Police resources (Lounged)

[alachlan]

I've just been to get some chips on northcross and on my way back to LL there were some coppers doing a girl (save it) for drink driving. Fair enough - but there was a car with two coppers in talking to her in addition to a VAN with others to take her away. Clearly drink driving is beyond reproach but why spend all the manpopwer on a lone girl when there are clearly more pressing problems locally?

Is there some kind of police rule saying that there have to be several witnesses to any caution? I guess after today's reported de menezes admission there must be let alone an arrest or worse?

[Mark]

I believe a van's sometimes used to take arrested people away leaving the officers in the car to go off and continue in their fight against crime. I guess the call to the meat wagon to pick up a drunk driver doesn't matter whether they're picking up a man or a woman and as far as I'm aware there's no need to have a witness to a caution or arrest, you usually need a witness (or evidence) for an offence.

There was a pizza scooter guy lying in the middle of East Dulwich Road last week after his cheeky manoeuvre to overtake a car turning right went wrong, hurting his leg in the process against the road and the car. Apart from the ambulance car and ambulance, there were two police cars and a police van, I guess they all respond to an incident as they sometimes don't know what's required until they get there. I actually thought it was quite reassuring to know so much help comes to an accident.

[alachlan]

fair enough then - just struck me as odd that a car would pick her up and then call for backup - I doubt the van just happened to be there!

I was just walking past so I don't know if there was any preamble but it certainly didn't look like it.

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

Something I've started seeing, is police cars with two police officers following security vans on their route. they stay with them all day and wait at every pick up. If they are doing this for a lot of private companies, to protect private individuals money, I want at least one cop following me when I have to cycle through the North Peckham estate to visit my neice on the Aylesbury to stop me getting robbed/murdered/raped etc!

Do you think these profit making companies who employ security guards to protect this money pay anything to the police for their one to one shadowing? I know BAE didn't have to stump up any cash for the police overkill at the Climate Camp cos I got Jenny Jones to ask the MPA boss, Mr Ian Blair himself.

I want to find out why this is happeneing. maybe the security companies should pay out for better training for their guards on a par with police training, instead of getting us to pay to protect their profits.

[kford]

If you look at the back of security vans they all now have stickers that read: POLICE: FOLLOW THIS VEHICLE. I suppose that when a patrol is idle or between calls, they can now be doing something productive and preventative.

[Loz]

I thought the same yesterday when I went through Denmark Hill station and the train operating company's 'revenue protection' squad were out in force accompanied by three BTP officers. Why are the police not tackling crime in general, rather than allocating time exclusively to ensure that a private company gets it's dosh?

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

I would love to know what percentage of police resources and manpower are used to protect private companies money like this.

[kford]

I think that's a big part of the BTP's remit.

[Brendan]

Loz Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

Why are

> the police not tackling crime in general, rather

> than allocating time exclusively to ensure that a

> private company gets it's dosh?

To ensure a private company doesn?t go completely bust and leave the government with more egg on its face over mismanaged privatisation.

Essentially sending henchmen around to collect taxes.

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

Paid for by our taxes.

[boosboss]

Fare evasion is a crime!

[Brendan]

Sorry why do they need at least 7 coppers standing at the station in the morning checking for fare dodgers or 5 of them writing out a fine when they can?t do anything about people?s private property being vandalised because they don?t? have the resources?

They fking work for us don?t they?

[Mark]

They're there because public (or private) transport is a big issue in London. I've been on the bendy buses when say 20 people don't swipe their card, let's say that's a tenner in lost revenue on one journey, and lets say there's 10,000* journeys like that a day makes ?100,000 loss. It's that loss which contributes to the transport system being the way it is and I don't mind seeing people being done for that. The police also have to been seen to be doing something and being in a high footfall place like the train station ticks that box.

*number picked from the air

[SeanMacGabhann]

I would imagine that you would like several comrades around you should a gang in a car or bus/train decide to get aggresive about being found out as well....

They are damned if they do and damned if they don't - when you don't see them around stations people get arsey about the number of fare dodgers..

[Brendan]

Firstly let me say that one of my best friends is a copper and my little jibe about them ?working for us? would not leave him, or any other coppers, best pleased. It is probably a bit unfair. I just have an inbred genetic problem with authority.

I do believe that they have to make sure people pay for transport but it is about the allocation of resources.

1000 car windows smashed around London. Replacement cost ?100 p/w. Expenses ?100 000 to the hard working public. * Whose money is more important, ours or the transport baron?s?

*Numbers also picked from the air.

[PeckhamRose]

I have often wondered why vans have stickers saying "Police follow this van" on them. I mean, why should they? Maybe I should put a sticker on the backs of cars that have no tax disc on them, or cars I've seen driving really badly I could sneak up to at the lights and put a sticker on them saying, "Ambulance, follow this car, you're bound to be needed sooner or later". Ho hum.

[mockney piers]

I think the BTP is funded, if not entirely, then substantially by TFL, so it's a fair cop on that one really.

Plus the're not just there for the benefit of the revenue protection officers, they're there to make us all a bit safer and more at ease from the thugs that have been known to get on trains and buses.

If making it understood that you have to pay your fare and you won't be able to bully the inspectors should they ask you to produce a ticket, then that's not a bad thing as far as I can see.

[Brendan]

Even if they are funded completely by TFL they are still funded by a combination of our taxes and our fare money. Therefore as a tax payer and paying customer (which are one in the same thing in my book) I want to see them on the train late at night cracking miscreant?s skulls and not standing around in florescent vest making me miss my train on Tuesday mornings! (6)

I?m trying to quit smoking by the way. Does it show?

[Administrator]

You can carry this discussion on in the Lounge as it's no longer East Dulwich specific

Lounged

[alachlan]

-- moved topic --

[rifleman harris]

Can i ask a question? Why is it when i see these roadside stops for car tax and insurance is there around 20+ police officers in attendance?

[ChavWivaLawDegree]

Brendan - "I just have an inbred genetic problem with authority" - are you sure we are not related?

[LuvPeckham]

Loz Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I thought the same yesterday when I went through

> Denmark Hill station and the train operating

> company's 'revenue protection' squad were out in

> force accompanied by three BTP officers. Why are

> the police not tackling crime in general, rather

> than allocating time exclusively to ensure that a

> private company gets it's dosh?

Being a chair on one of the Police Ward Panels (amongst my other hats) can I throw my twopeneth into the discussion on this one.

This morning at Peckham station there was one of a series of operations called Operation Blunt by the police aimed at stopping fare evasion.

The Reason the police are working with the revenue inspectors and BTP on this operation is two fold.

One. Criminals tend to not want to pay to travel to the areas that they are going to commit crime in, therefore by arresting or stopping fare evaders from entering an area (say Peckham or Denmark Hill) then there is a marked decrease in street robbery, general crime and vandalism in the area that day as a result.

Two. Criminals tend to use the same weapon for multiple activities, and if they are caught fare evading then the police have a legal reason to search them for drugs and weapons, thus being able to solve other crimes when they find knives or guns on someone, or even better they can stop another crime occuring with that weapon.

I used to wonder why so many police to stop fare evasion and the simple fact of the matter is that they aren't worried about the money (even though it is a crime) they are more worried about the sort of person coming into the area who doesn't want to pay for a ticket.

I understand that there will be various operations to reduce Crime in Southwark over the next few months, especially with the lead up to Christmas and I for one applaud the police for this kind of operation.

[Thequietone]

In tonights Standard there was a call for the sus laws to be revived. That should be another thread as it involves colour, class, age and recreational drugs.

My observation of Peckham police is limited as they just drive around in cars with sirens on. The phrase gutless wankers comes to mind.

Paul

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

My experience of Peckham police is that they are lovely. Various encounters over the years from drunken (and inadvertent naked exposure but we'll gloss over that) and professional contact. There are some jobsworths but a lot of them are truly caring and jolly nice.