Schonrock kids and unchaperoned "school run"

[Alex K]

The Sunday TIMES (4/7/10) reports that a local couple, Oliver and Gillian Schonrock, whose 8- and 5-year-old on their own cycle a mile from their West Dulwich home to Alleyn's junior school, are to be "referred to children's services" -- by the school's headmaster -- for endangering their daughter and son.

I'm happily childless; so I never should have dreamt that to allow one's children to make their own way to school and back, in so benign an environment as that of the various Dulwiches, could be construed as placing them at risk.

What really has me boggling, however, is another statement in the article -- that this act by the headmaster was in response to pressure from other parents, who disapprove.

If the Schonrocks follow this forum: Sir, ma'am, bravo to you both! I walked the mile and a half to school from age five years till age eight, when my parents thought that I could handle my bicycle adequately; in the summer holidays, from age eight till I left for uni, I bicycled to the various farms around our village where day labourers were needed and where I was happy to work. Nothing went wrong.

I was not an encumbrance to my parents, needing to be ferried everywhere, and I am grateful to them for letting me try my wings.

[PeckhamRose]

Ditto, I walked to my infant school and back alone, not dreaming to cross the main road at anything other than the zebra crossing. My Mum walked with me to begin with and taught me where to cross and so on. She trusted me and she was right to do so. She had to work to help with the income for our lives. But this story is daft and give us a link to where it was published or broadcast?

[Curmudgeon]

Well you are quite right of course and I agree with the Bravo but until you have children yourselves you will not realise how much things have changed, how expectations have changed and how unlikely it is that this freedom will be bestowed

There is a difference between now and then:

other adults were to be respected

if you did wrong any adult would give you a telling off, pull you back from the brink without fear. Nowadays it is much changed with parents not open to the community raising of children (it's sad but true).

everybody did it and there was safety in numbers - nowadays few do so there is no such safety

media coverage of the tragedies of child abduction / paedophilia has made stranger danger feel more real

helicopter parents believe their child can do no wrong; their children have more rights than responsibilities; that all around should

my children's school will not allow my 9 year old to return home from school unaccompanied even though I have offered to put it in writing; we live 30 paces away from the school gate and I have already picked up younger child - but not till year 5 is it allowed (when he will be 9 - 10)

[HAL9000]

But today we live in a world where predators snatch children from the streets in broad daylight - I don't understand how any parent could allow their little ones out alone in the light of such risks? Sooner of later, I fear it will end in tears.

[Alex K]

Today's TIMES; but their new webwall makes it impossible to link effectively. A few column inches below the fold on the front page and nearly all the fifth page above the fold. Perhaps if it's picked up by another news provider without a webwall I'll see it. If I do, I'll supply a link.

[PeckhamRose]

I was told to run away if strangers approached me!

But this constant "unless you have had kids yourself" thing is a bit irksome. I am naturally very proctective of kids and am always aware and cautious when I realise I may be witnessing something troublesome. And have acted appropriately when occasions arise to call police / step in / protect, etc. It is clear in some very sad cases that make the news that nature does not choose the best people to be parents.

Your story of not being able to have your kids walk thirty paces unaccompanied, should go in the new website where you can choose which laws to get rid of!

[Curmudgeon]

HAL9000 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> But today we live in a world where predators

> snatch children from the streets in broad daylight

> - I don't understand how any parent could allow

> their little ones out alone in the light of such

> risks? Sooner of later, I fear it will end in

> tears.

I don't believe it's worse than when we were kids - it's just more reported

and there's safety in numbers

[Curmudgeon]

PeckhamRose Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> > But this constant "unless you have had kids

> yourself" thing is a bit irksome.

You misunderstand - I meant until you have kids yourself you do not realise the pressure put on parents (by other parents and school expecations) to not do these things.I did not mean that you can't possibly give a toss or understand just that you haven't experienced the nuances of parenting

>

> Your story of not being able to have your kids

> walk thirty paces unaccompanied, should go in the

> new website where you can choose which laws to get

> rid of!

it's school policy - as long as I pick him up from school, I can give him the house keys and send him home - but they won't release him without me being there

[PeckhamRose]

Ah, I see, yes I misunderstood!

[Amelie]

What astonished me was the Headmaster apparently threatened to report the parents to Social Services if they did not stop their children cycling to school unaccompanied. This is an outrageous abuse of authority. The Headmaster should be called in by Southwark Council on Monday and given a dressing down he will never forget.

At the very least if he felt the need to say anything he should have asked the couple to come in so he could speak to them privately, and if he was receiving complaints from other parents he should have told them to speak directly to the Schonrocks and not interfered in an arrangement the parents had made in such a high-handed fashion.

I would hope that the Headmaster will have the decency to apologise and to withdraw the disgraceful threat contained in his original letter.

[Fuschia]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/7871046/Couple-warned-over-allowing-children-to-cycle-to-school-alone.html

[WickedStepmother]

I think a few forumite emails to Alleyn's junior school are called for here. This decision is sheer, unalloyed bollocks and exactly the kind of unjustified scaremongering nonsense that frightens parents of a nervous disposition into panicky over-protectiveness.

The concrete risk to a child from the side-effcts of obesity resulting from lack of exercise is of far higher likelihood than the risk of them being abducted by some hypothetical paedophile. And that's to say nothing of the mental health issues that I strongly suspect are eventually going to spring up in adversity as a result of a childhood spent wrapped in cotton wool and coached to be scared of everything and everyone.

Oh dear. I think I need a cup of tea and a nice lie down. My hobbyhorse could probably do with a good rub down too...

[buggie]

Just out of interest, what would the reaction be if the story was that one of the children had been knocked over while on their way to school and that the child (or maybe both the children) had then had to be sent to A&E accompanied by police while contacting the parents was attempted?? Fairly sure safety issues would be discussed with the family in the hospital, but surely that would be shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted.

While it seems strong armed to be talking about referring to SS, guessing this is after the school have discussed with the parents the concerns they have and that this wouldn't be something that was taken lightly. Am sure the class of the family have something to do with why this story is "news" (SS not just looking at the working classes shocker!).

Given how busy the roads are these days, and that I think 8yrs old is far too young to be expected to have full responsibility for another child (would anyone invite an 8yr to babysit for them?). I think the parents should reconsider how their children get to school, there are ways to encourage independence/con't cycling while still having some supervision

[Marmora Man]

I was going to raise this item but couldn't link to ST website.

Agree with all the points - the parents are to be applauded. The school to be lambasted, Social Services sent on their way and other parents at the school to be given a short lesson in common sense and parental responsibility. Better to raise an aware, confident and fit young children by letting them take a short walk to school than to create an artificial bubble for them to live in until their teens.

[Alex K]

Fuschia, thank you for the TELEGRAPH link -- Peckham Rose, I hope that you can follow it to see another version of the report.

[Earl Aelfheah]

I used to cycle 7 miles (one way) to school, from the age of 11, with a group of friends. No harm ever came to us, probably the biggest effect was that we were fitter, happier and more conifident. I don't believe that things are more dangerous today. I do believe that people are absolutely paralysed by fear of crime. Anyway, what really upsets me about this story is the role of other parents and social services. Firstly, what business is it of other parents at the school? You could argue that actually driving your children to the school gate is far more antisocial and therefore more of a matter for other parents to question your choices over.

[MissM]

rahrahrah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I used to cycle 7 miles (one way) to school, from

> the age of 11, with a group of friends. No harm

> ever came to us, probably the biggest effect was

> that we were fitter, happier and more conifident.

> I don't believe that things are more dangerous

> today. I do believe that people are absolutely

> paralysed by fear of crime. Anyway, what really

> upsets me about this story is the role of other

> parents and social services. Firstly, what

> business is it of other parents at the school? You

> could argue that actually driving your children to

> the school gate is far more antisocial and

> therefore more of a matter for other parents to

> question your choices over.

If other parents are concerned, I think they have every right raise this with the appropriate person in authority (in this case the head) who would then make a decision. I'm sure they were just doing so in genuine concern rather than spite.

In all honesty, I think 5 and 8 are too young to go without adult supervision. 5 especially! That seems teeny!!

[iaineasy]

I had to walk to school at primary on my own, whats the fuss? Reporting parents for this is, to my mind over stepping the mark by a long way. I don't believe there to be more risk now than then, and it is for the parents to decide if thats a risk worth taking? Unless the kids are showing outward signs of neglect and ill treatment the headmaster should keep his fat mouth shut and the other "concerned" parents should mind there own business. Some families survive on both parents working which precludes them the luxury of having the time or a nanny to do the school run.I am sure the fact that they travel together makes them safer and with any luck they ride on the pavement only.

Hurrah for them

hugs

[HonaloochieB]

I think allowing any child of primary school age to take themselves to school is hugely irresponsible.

Nothing to do with 'paedo-scare' or any implied 'PC gone mad' so-called hysteria.

An 8 and 5 year old are not equipped to deal with the sort of incidents/accidents they might encounter on that sort of journey.

Marmora man, the OP says that the children cycle a mile to school to school, not a 'short walk'. A big diffence I think.

And just as a matter of interest, what if these were kids on a sink estate whose parents were on benefits?

Parents encouraging health and independence? Or being feckless and indifferent?

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

Have to disagree Hb. My brother and I took ourselves on the bus to infant and junior school - pretty normal where I grew up.

My own child took the bus from Peckham to Bermondsey from Year 5. We did the routes, practised various scenarios and how she should react and taught her how to use public 'phone boxes and approach women for help if needed. In fact her school insisted that pupils from Year 6 walked to school on their own in preparation for when they went to big school.

[iaineasy]

.

[PeckhamRose]

Thanks for the link. The parents sound great!

[iaineasy]

I think allowing any child of primary school age to take themselves to school is hugely irresponsible.

------------------------------

I couldn't disagree more, my dad left when I was 5, my mum worked two jobs to pay the mortgage and keep a roof over our heads losing the house and being homeless would have been irresponsible. My taking myself to school may not have been ideal but nothing ever happened to me.

my point remains hurrah for the parents.

hugsb

[James Barber]

I have similar aged kids.

This has made me reflect that we're being overly cautious with them.

NB. this story becoming national news can only make these kids less safe.

[Growlybear]

I was shocked to read this article this morning, and to think that any parent would allow children of 8 and 5 to cycle alone to school. A mile is quite a long distance for such young children, and letting children who are of infant school age travel to school on their own puts them in such a vulnerable position. This isn't a little quiet country village in 1950 - it's a busy area in inner London in 2010. Apart from the obvious risk of abduction, the children have to negotiate traffic during the rush hour period whilst crossing the road. At five years old, children just don't have the necessary powers of concentration to be cycling without supervision, and an eight year old definitely isn't responsible enough to supervise such a young child.

Whilst I think the Headteacher's approach might be a little extreme, I think it should be remembered that the school is in loco parentis for these children from the time they arrive at school until they leave. The parents might argue that it is their decision how their children get to school, but I can't see that the school could seriously be expected to condone allowing such young children to leave their care at the end of the day to cycle home alone and therefore to put them in a vulnerable position. If the Headteacher has spoken to the parents and they refuse to accompany their children to school and are insistent that they want to continue putting their children at risk, then I don't think the school had any choice but to consider involving Social Services - in my view it's clearly a child protection issue.