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messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by beckyg 30 March, 2012 17:52

First of all, can i add my condolences - im so sorry to hear about Morph.

But i'd also like to speak up for Blue and his owner. If it is the dog i think it is - and both the dog and owner answers the desctription and the dog has the right name - I have met it and its owner in ruskin park many times. my (small staff cross) dog has played with Blue and her brindle mate many times too. The owner is very feiendly and nice and seems to have good control of both dogs. he walks them evey day, trains them and is not an "irresponsible" owner at all.
From the description of what actually happened by the person who witnessed the attack, this was a game that went tragically wrong, and Blue's owner is doing the responsible thing by muzzling blue to stop it happening again.

Everything else seems to be rumour - eg the person who said their dog was attacked by blue two years ago: Blue is not yet two years old!

Why make an awful situation worse by making assumptions about the people involved, and by scaremongering?

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by beckyg 30 March, 2012 17:58

Ps and paulK i hope you read back that message about peckham rye scum to yourself and see how incredibly snobbish you sound!

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by first mate 30 March, 2012 19:03

LD,

You misunderstand, David mech shows that wolf hierarchies are rigid. Wolf packs are rigid- but they are built on family units where the parents are boss and keep the kids in line.

On the other hand, dogs though genetically related to wolves, do not form rigid hierarchies. Feral dogs may form loose packs but there is no hierarchy that reflects wolf behaviour.

As I said I do believe that you get more confident dogs and more pushy/assertive dogs but somehow dominance implies a broad agenda that motivates actions which I do not believe really reflects what dogs are all about- I think they live much more in the moment.

I agree about socialisation. Dogs have such an incredible range of morphologies and massive differences in behavioural thresholds that they really do have to learn about each other. Those differences almost amount to 'cultural' differences between breeds and types and this can cause poor communication and misunderstandings to occur.

As I said, I do agree that owners can ratchet up a fear reaction but owners should not have to get to that stage. All of us have to read canine signals better and not just base all dog interactions using our dog as the measure. My dog might desperately wnat to get to the little dog over there- but she is cowering away- perhaps she doesn't feel well today or perhaps my dog reminds her of a dog that attacked her a few weeks ago- who knows. Bottom line, I should call my dog away and quit bothering the other dog. At the very least this will help to build the others dog's confidence.

As a final note all it need take is one bad experience to make a fomerly confident dog fearful.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by first mate 30 March, 2012 19:12

beckyg,

You make some fair points but it is noteworthy that 'Blue' has formerly had 'nice' games with dogs of a similar breed type- the problem was engaging with a smaller breed. One can only conclude that the owner's knowledge of his dog was not perhaps as rounded as it needed to be. It sounds as though he was not monitoring his dogs closely enough and was very slow to intervene.

It is good that he has agreed to muzzle his dog but people have every right to be angry at what happened. Sad to say it also tells us something that dogs of very similar type (blue staffs) have been involved in other serious attacks on dogs. Either the dogs have been poorly socialized/inadequately trained, or they have a strong genetic predisposition to this behaviour.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by tallulah71 30 March, 2012 19:42

beckyg I totally agree with you - people jumping on the anti-bull-breed wagon and making comments about 'scum' using Peckham Rye are offensive, inaccurate, pointless and add nothing of value whatsoever to the OP.

I have also heard good things about Blue and his owner - through Mark Newell and others. Also there are times when my friends and I have had to step in when play between otherwise good-natured and well-socialised dogs gets over-excited and a potential problem....this is not uncommon amongst any breed of dog.

All of that said My thoughts are with Morph's family and friends. I can only imagine how bad they must be feeling.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by first mate 30 March, 2012 19:51

tallulah71, yes, the monitoring is really important and we should all do it, whatever the interaction.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by aquarius moon 30 March, 2012 20:56

I have 3 small dogs.

They are not dominant, submissive or aggressive.

In fact, they love everyone..... other dogs, cats, children etc.

One of them was attacked a couple of years ago by a staff. He was on a lead at the time, the other dog wasn't. I posted about it on here.(luckily my dog was unhurt, shaken up, but not as much as I was)

There were then a couple of other incidents in Nunhead cemetery where larger dogs took a dislike to mine, & only intervention from the owners prevented attacks from occuring.

Now I am in the sad situation where we never go to the cemetery, never go to Peckham Rye park......Never go anywhere, apart from pavement walking on the lead. I take my dogs out one at a time now, rather than altogether, which is both tiring & time-consuming,

If I do see a staff/bull breed/ large dog coming towards us, I cross over or pick my dog up.

All because I don't feel safe anymore.

The way things are going, it is only going to get worse.
Small dogs will be always be at risk unless there is a law to prevent dogs running free in public places, by being kept on leads.

And before all the responsible dog owners reply and say it's not fair to them if their well-behaved sociable dogs should be penalised by being kept on a lead........

Sorry, but I'm a responsible dog owner & I have to keep mine on a lead in order to protect them sad smiley

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by ibilly99 30 March, 2012 20:59

Dogs that kill should be killed no ifs no buts

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by minder 30 March, 2012 23:49

Fuzzyboots, hope your 6 year old son is getting over seeing something so terrible.

Last Friday I was walking through the Greendales after just leaving a playgroup with 2 toddlers in pram. A woman with a dog off the lead was just in front of me. I slowed down as it was a type of dog I just don't feel easy with (sorry dog owners).

A man with a black labrador dog on a lead was coming towards us. The woman's dog just went mad, ran towards it and started attacking the dog. It was horrible to watch. It must have lasted a few minutes but the man and his dog came away bleeding. I asked him if he was ok but he (and I) was so shocked and he just said he "was sick of dogs off the lead" and walked away.

I shouted at the woman "put your dog on a lead". She was maybe 500 yards from me. She looked at me and just carried on with the dog running alongside her!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was 2012:03:30:23:52:27 by minder.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by dawn 23 April, 2012 20:19

A blind friend of mine was walking her guide dog near Brixton. A man was using a phone box and his dog was off the lead. The dog mauled my friends gorgeous Labrador and it needed vetenary treatment,stitches, and was horribly shaken.The owner didn't even apologise!!Yes people should keep their dogs on leads if there is even the remotest chance they may be aggressive.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by dawn 24 April, 2012 19:20

Just wanted to say how sad I am to hear of the dog attack. Truly awful!!!

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by esme 25 April, 2012 12:49

lilly123 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> i dont care what dog people own, but the law
> should be made for every dog that is out in public
> to be muzzled, forget about having a dog licence,
> a licence will not stop a dog attacking a
> child,human or another animal.
--------------

Completely agree Lilly123 - scary number of dangerous dogs (as now classified under relatively new laws) out and about without muzzles and often pulling their owners along, usually smirking at the fact they feel powerful with something that could seriously hurt someone if they gave the right order. Why do people want dogs that could attack or hurt another animal or even a child / adult?? I just don't understand the need for it personally, plenty of lovely types of dog that make perfect pets and do no harm to anyone, yet we still hear about "random" attacks on family members and unsuspecting children... Roll on stronger laws against dangerous dogs and their owners. There are plans to chip every dog I believe, at the owner's cost, can't wait!!

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by sweet megan 25 April, 2012 20:28

esme-how can you completely agree with lilly123??

-they are saying they don't care what dog it is & that ALL dogs out in public need to be muzzled-you agree with the statement but then go on to say there are plenty of lovely dogs that make perfect pets & do no harm to anyone-so should these "lovely dogs" also be muzzled in your opinion?

Recent high profile attacks on children have been by parents/relatives own dog & within the home-so should dogs have to be muzzled at home too?

The problem lies with irresponsible owners, not the dog (regardless of breed)- the majority of dog owners are responsible.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by Marie81 25 April, 2012 22:07

Well said sweet megan.

By the way esme you can get dogs microchipped for free at many places not that it will make a difference as it will be impossible to enforce.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by first mate 26 April, 2012 10:43

Microchipping is all well and good but the vast majority of owners already do this. Even if the ne'er do wells are in some way forced to microchip, who, in these times of austerity, is going to be tasked with carrying scanners to do spot checks? Remember also that chips can and have been removed by the same dodgy types, who have little compunction in visiting pain on their dog.

I do so wish that having dogs on lead was enforceable on the streets, this seems to me a far more practical solution for less cost, a dog on the lead can be both avoided and controlled.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by tallulah71 26 April, 2012 11:11

I agree First Mate. My friend recently had a very near miss with a dog off-lead who ran into the road. She stopped the car for the dog on a very busy road, and called out to the owner to ask if the dog was alright. He said "don't worry - that's how he'll learn". Appalling.

messageRe: Dog (on dog) attack in Peckham Rye Park today - 16.40 (23/3/2012)
Posted by Gidget 26 April, 2012 11:42

My dog hates being accosted by offlead dogs while on the lead. There are too many on the pavements - usually staffies, sorry to say.

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