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messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by rendelharris 26 November, 2018 10:03

Someone's really gone the extra mile on Peckham High Street.
https://i.imgur.com/L29al1g.jpg



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was 2018:11:26:10:04:15 by rendelharris.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 26 November, 2018 10:47

May challenges and Corbyn agrees to live TV debate

[www.independent.co.uk]

Shes also wandering around the houses of parliament giving away things if anybody votes for her (if any MPs are present)

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 26 November, 2018 10:55

Has anybody got any spare liquefied chlorine, sodium silicofluoride, aluminium sulphate, fluorosilicic acid and calcium hydroxide.

If so Gove wants a word.

[www.standard.co.uk]

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by malumbu 26 November, 2018 13:01

Flip me, our future depends on a head to head between TM and JC - can this get any more depressing?

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 26 November, 2018 14:00

Interesting that May's laid down the challenge to Corbyn. At the election she was the one running scared from leaders' debates. And why have such a public debate, the public aren't voting on her deal, MPs are.
I think she would win a debate with Corbyn simply because he hasn't got a proposal for a Brexit deal to speak of that isn't more cakeism. But even if he had, why should there be a debate on it, Parliament is voting on May's deal, not May's versus Corbyn's. Instead she should be debating with someone proposing No Deal, as that currently is the only legal alternative to May's deal. For anything else to happen, e.g an alternative deal or People's Vote, Article 50 needs to be extended with the EU's permission to allow for the time needed to carry out such an alternative strategy...

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 26 November, 2018 15:45

Deja Vue

But now the SNP, the Lib Dems, the Green Party and Plaid Cymru say they should also be invited to discuss the withdrawal agreement.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 26 November, 2018 16:22

I've found the obvious candidate to debate for No Deal, Corbybabes bro...smiling smiley
[twitter.com]

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 26 November, 2018 16:35

He's not giving up...smiling smiley

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ds7gWlkWsAE87lq.jpg:small

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 26 November, 2018 16:47

diable rouge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I've found the obvious candidate to debate for No
> Deal, Corbybabes bro...smiling smiley
> [twitter.com]
> 440802816


Corbyn's brother is coming to take my flag smiling smiley - I'm buying another if he does come to Peckham to take it and it'll be twice as big.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 26 November, 2018 16:53

It's the way he refers to the EU as a 4th Reich and then proceeds on full-authoritarian let's round 'em all up mode. Lack of self-awareness must run in the family...

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by DovertheRoad 26 November, 2018 17:07

Question ..is the current deal on the table a soft or hard Brexit? Or a "fudge deal" ?

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 26 November, 2018 17:32

Day 1 of Theresa Mays mission impossible.

@peston

This is becoming cruel. Every part of the commons dumping manure on @theresa_may for allegedly driving wedge between NI and GB, for locking UK into customs union, for NOT locking UK into customs union, for being a "blind brexit", for being too transparently a surrender to EU etc.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 26 November, 2018 17:38

DovertheRoad Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Question ..is the current deal on the table a soft
> or hard Brexit? Or a "fudge deal" ?

Hard, as it takes us out of the Single Market. It's also harder than the so called Chequers deal as that promised frictionless trade which May's deal doesn't. There's lots of fudge too.
The 'Plan B' Norway option which is being talked about as an alternative should May's deal collapse, would keep us in the SM and is considered soft. IMO the Norway option best reflects the closeness of the referendum and I'm sure a lot of Remainers would've accepted that, but May egged on by the Brextremists got greedy...

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 26 November, 2018 17:45

diable rouge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hard, as it takes us out of the Single Market.
> It's also harder than the so called Chequers deal
> as that promised frictionless trade which May's
> deal doesn't. There's lots of fudge too.
> The 'Plan B' Norway option which is being talked
> about as an alternative should May's deal
> collapse, would keep us in the SM and is
> considered soft. IMO the Norway option best
> reflects the closeness of the referendum and I'm
> sure a lot of Remainers would've accepted that,
> but May egged on by the Brextremists got greedy...


Did read today on Nick boles twitter that the EFTA/EEA option could mean Norway blocking us from joining in a temporary capacity and therefore we'd need to sign up permanently.

[twitter.com]

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 26 November, 2018 18:11

Yep, he originally called in 'Norway for now' which didn't go down well...

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 26 November, 2018 18:27

And here's the view from the nation's living rooms...

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ds8B1kkW0AAJPq5.jpg:small

BBC, you gonna have to build an even taller tower smiling smiley

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by zerkalo 26 November, 2018 21:56

As an EU citizen who has been living and contributing in the UK for years, I feel very offended by the PMs 'queue jumping' comments. Having to apply to stay in our homes is bad enough, but language like this only adds insult to injury. Her apology is frankly too little too late.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 27 November, 2018 10:01

According to Joanna Cherry QC MP (@joannacherry) the UK government at the European Court (#cjeu) has refused to put forward reasons why Article 50 cannot be revoked - leaving the question of whether it can be revoked unilaterally or unanimously (EU27). Of course the court can still decide it can't be revoked - but no arguments put forward.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was 2018:11:27:10:04:17 by JohnL.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by stepdown 27 November, 2018 12:44

Extra c needed for @joannaccherry, another thread on the hearing here:

[twitter.com]

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 27 November, 2018 13:22

zerkalo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> As an EU citizen who has been living and
> contributing in the UK for years, I feel very
> offended by the PMs 'queue jumping' comments.
> Having to apply to stay in our homes is bad
> enough, but language like this only adds insult to
> injury. Her apology is frankly too little too
> late.

She didn't actually apologise, merely stated that she shouldn't have used that term. Not only did she insult EU citizens who legitimately exercised their right to live and work in the UK, but also the million+ UK citizens doing likewise in the EU. She trumpets ending Freedom of Movement as some kind of victory, yet by doing that she will take away the right of UK citizens to freely travel, work, study and live/retire in the EU. EU citizens will still be able to freely travel to 26 other countries, whereas for UK citizens it will be zilch. Some victory.

Whenever I feel a modicum of sympathy for her current predicament I quickly remind myself that when it comes to immigration, May has always had a nasty streak. She was the architect of the 'hostile environment' at the Home Office, which led to the 'Go Home' advertising vans and appalling treatment of the Windrush generation. She's used Brexit to further her anti-immigration MO, a deal ending free movement with Brexit-lite attached as an addendum.

And now she wants to reconcile with remainers, the same remainers she put down as 'citizens of nowhere'. Get. To. Fook..

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by KidKruger 27 November, 2018 13:51

"..by doing that she will take away the right of UK citizens to freely travel, work, study and live/retire in the EU."

Does this seriously mean that the 1000s of UK retirees out in Spain and elsewhere in the EU will lose the right to be there (and as a result will have to go somewhere else) ? Or does it mean they'll be OK, but new retirees from UK can't join them ?

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by robbin 27 November, 2018 14:25

The latter, obviously.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by diable rouge 27 November, 2018 14:28

It effects new retirees, and takes effect from the end of the transition period. But should we crash out with 'no deal' then existing retirees instantly lose their rights. IMO their rights should've been ring-fenced in the deal to protect them from such an awful scenario.
If an existing retiree living in Portugal wanted to move to Spain after transition, say for better healthcare reasons, they wouldn't be able to do so freely. In effect they could be stuck in Spain or would have to come back to the UK.
Most of this was agreed back in March and hasn't moved on much since. Lots of uncertainties, and people are understandably concerned...[britishineurope.org]

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 27 November, 2018 15:26

KidKruger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "..by doing that she will take away the right of
> UK citizens to freely travel, work, study and
> live/retire in the EU."
>
> Does this seriously mean that the 1000s of UK
> retirees out in Spain and elsewhere in the EU will
> lose the right to be there (and as a result will
> have to go somewhere else) ? Or does it mean
> they'll be OK, but new retirees from UK can't join
> them ?


There were questions whether they'll be able to collect UK pensions if they're in Spain - not sure if that's solved.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 27 November, 2018 15:32

stepdown Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Extra c needed for @joannaccherry, another thread
> on the hearing here:
>
> [twitter.com]
> 4639360

Thanks smiling smiley

My take on that thread is that the court will rule A50 is revocable but all or some (I think some) of the EU members need to agree.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by Alan Medic 29 November, 2018 13:10

A May v Corbyn TV debate. What the hell is the point? They both want to leave the EU. Neither of them is capable of an original thought. What a waste of time. And can anyone vote on what they hear? No. Only MP's.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by Angelina 29 November, 2018 13:32

What on Earth makes you think May wants to leave the EU?

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by uncleglen 29 November, 2018 14:02

May came out as a Remainer because she wanted to keep her job under Cameron when it looked like the vote would be Remain. She is trying to keep in with both sides and as Mrs T said if you stand in the middle of the road you get hit by traffic from both sides...unfortunately Mrs May is standing in the middle of a T junction....with the EU bureaucrats making up the third onslaught!

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by Angelina 29 November, 2018 14:07

pretty much sums it up. I think she's pretending to Leave but is not driven to.

messageRe: Brexit View
Posted by JohnL 29 November, 2018 15:35

Angelina Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pretty much sums it up. I think she's pretending
> to Leave but is not driven to.

Depends what you call leave - you may call her deal not leave - but I don's see it as remain. Remain for me is UK as a member of the Council of Ministers and having MEPs in the European Parliament.


That means her deal is Limbo

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