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The Bishop, The EDT, The Great Exhibition, the Actress or another?
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messageDiversity
Posted by TheCat April 27, 04:54PM

So, the new leader of the Women's Equality Party makes the claim that their candidate list is the MOST DIVERSE of all political parties....how can they say this with a straight face when there isn't one candidate representative of half the population?

I understand their reason for being, and don't doubt they do good work raising awareness of issues that affect women. But, we are constantly being told that more diverse workplaces, politics etc etc will make us more successful and more productive due to the kaleidescope of different experiences and ideas it brings.....sounds great...funny though that diversity in membership,management team and candidates selection is clearly not really that important for a party that like to claim it as one of their key goals....

[www.theguardian.com]

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 27, 05:59PM

Why so negative and not supportive - depressing. I was always taught to look at the person saying stuff and ask why they are saying it and it's stood me in good stead. There are so many bigger issues to be rightly concerned about and it's always tedious when anything women do for themselves is criticised in this way.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 27, 06:40PM

So I criticise this party on one specific issue, and that must make me 'not supportive' of women and women's issues?

Are women 'doing things for themselves' immune from any criticism of their actions? This is often the case with many campaign groups, that they shutdown any debate or opportunity to appeal to a broader audience by painting any criticism or disagreement as being anti-whatever the group stands for. (In this case anti-women)

The only depressing thing here is the predictability of your response.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit was april 27, 06:42pm by TheCat.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 27, 08:17PM

They are not a campaign group but a political party. Your whole tone is patronising and critical - why not be helpful and supportive if you genuinely care rather than nitpick.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 27, 09:02PM

Not a campaign group, but a political party...haha...look who's 'nit-picking' now....

In anycase, you've managed to build your strawman about my support or other wise of women's equality issues, and have totally ignored the specific issue I raised, likely because you've no decent response....happy to hear otherwise if you've something to add on the actual issue I raised...

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 27, 09:22PM

Nah - you're not worth investing in - just a stirrer. The much missed RendelHarris had your number all right and made mincemeat of you.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 27, 10:37PM

Have had many good conversations with rendell on this forum, on topics we agreed and disagreed on. I don't in anyway recall ever being made into 'mincemeat'.... But, in anycase, you could take a leaf out of rendel's book, and learn how to actually have a discussion/debate with someone who might disagree with you with or see something differently from you.

Nah...you'd prefer to just sit in your echochamber I guess....and when someone raises an issue which is inconvenient for one of your preconceived beliefs, you can then not even make an attempt to address/discuss the issue, just brand them a 'stirrer' and claim they're 'not worth investing in' because it masks the truth that you actually have nothing of any substance to add to the discussion.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by seenbeen April 27, 10:54PM

the headline is very off-putting and reminds me of Diane Abbott

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 27, 11:20PM

TheCat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Have had many good conversations with rendell on
> this forum, on topics we agreed and disagreed on.
> I don't in anyway recall ever being made into
> 'mincemeat'.... But, in anycase, you could take a
> leaf out of rendel's book, and learn how to
> actually have a discussion/debate with someone who
> might disagree with you with or see something
> differently from you.
>
> Nah...you'd prefer to just sit in your echochamber
> I guess....and when someone raises an issue which
> is inconvenient for one of your preconceived
> beliefs, you can then not even make an attempt to
> address/discuss the issue, just brand them a
> 'stirrer' and claim they're 'not worth investing
> in' because it masks the truth that you actually
> have nothing of any substance to add to the
> discussion.


Nope - you're not helping.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by malumbu April 27, 11:49PM

What's all this sycophancy towards Rendel? Fight your own battles. And if others are being RRRSss it's obvious for others to see.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 28, 07:51AM

cella Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TheCat Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Have had many good conversations with rendell
> on
> > this forum, on topics we agreed and disagreed
> on.
> > I don't in anyway recall ever being made into
> > 'mincemeat'.... But, in anycase, you could take
> a
> > leaf out of rendel's book, and learn how to
> > actually have a discussion/debate with someone
> who
> > might disagree with you with or see something
> > differently from you.
> >
> > Nah...you'd prefer to just sit in your
> echochamber
> > I guess....and when someone raises an issue
> which
> > is inconvenient for one of your preconceived
> > beliefs, you can then not even make an attempt
> to
> > address/discuss the issue, just brand them a
> > 'stirrer' and claim they're 'not worth
> investing
> > in' because it masks the truth that you
> actually
> > have nothing of any substance to add to the
> > discussion.
>
>
> Nope - you're not helping

A quick look at your posting history is informative. You make a habit of having a dig at people, while not have anything useful to say, then often make cryptic/irrelevant remarks when called out on it and recently (as malumbu notes) have made constant references to rendelharris' posts rather than actually making an argument yourself.

Well, played. It's you who are actually the 'stirrer'. I'm sure you'll again find some dismissive comment to reply to this post without actually engaging with the content. Perhaps commission rendelharris on contract to do all your thinking for you, since you're such a big fan.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was april 28, 07:54am by TheCat.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 28, 08:12AM

Again no. A quick look at your posting history shows that you have a habit of starting threads to stir up confrontation which you then back away from when others on here expose you. I used Rendelharris as an example of someone who was adept at sussing these things out and providing a robust defence to support his counter arguments.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 28, 08:14AM

malumbu Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What's all this sycophancy towards Rendel? Fight
> your own battles. And if others are being RRRSss
> it's obvious for others to see.


Well you should know. Won't even bother with this as per.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 28, 08:36AM

cella Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Again no. A quick look at your posting history
> shows that you have a habit of starting threads to
> stir up confrontation which you then back away
> from when others on here expose you. I used
> Rendelharris as an example of someone who was
> adept at sussing these things out and providing a
> robust defence to support his counter arguments.

Honestly cella....you have to actually MAKE a counter argument for me to even attempt to defend my original post....

But as per most of your responses when called out...you 'won't even bother as per' your normal modus ooperandi

Anyway, you successfully managed to hijack this thread and draw me into a meaningless tit for tat. So if you have something on the OP topic to add, then I'll respond. Otherwise best to just leave it

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 28, 09:35AM

TheCat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> cella Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Again no. A quick look at your posting history
> > shows that you have a habit of starting threads
> to
> > stir up confrontation which you then back away
> > from when others on here expose you. I used
> > Rendelharris as an example of someone who was
> > adept at sussing these things out and providing
> a
> > robust defence to support his counter
> arguments.
>
> Honestly cella....you have to actually MAKE a
> counter argument for me to even attempt to defend
> my original post....
>
> But as per most of your responses when called
> out...you 'won't even bother as per' your normal
> modus ooperandi
>
> Anyway, you successfully managed to hijack this
> thread and draw me into a meaningless tit for tat.
> So if you have something on the OP topic to add,
> then I'll respond. Otherwise best to just leave it

Actually, no I don't have to make a counter argument to your critical thread. I am allowed to criticise your criticism of women's issues. I have and I'm done.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by Captain Marvel April 28, 10:25AM

That went well

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 28, 12:43PM

I thought so.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by teddyboy23 April 28, 05:39PM

You sound like a hate filled person trying to past off hate as criticism awful

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 28, 06:12PM

teddyboy23 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You sound like a hate filled person trying to past
> off hate as criticism awful


I assume that's directed at me? If not...then please ignore what followssmiling smiley

If it is.... all I can say is WOW!..this sort of attitude is what contributes to so much division in society. Again, I criticise 1 statement by 1 leader of 1 political party which I personally found hypocritical and inconsistent. And suddenly I'm filled with 'hate'?

As I've said above, if supporters any progressive movement dismiss all or any criticism of specific aspects or players in that movement as representative of 'hate'...then we're all f#cked.... Becuase no one will ever listen to anyone else...and we never move forward.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit was april 28, 06:22pm by TheCat.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by teddyboy23 April 28, 06:17PM

Cat its not directed at you .its for my mate cella .she had a pop at me on the brexit thread with a Simula post



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was april 28, 06:22pm by teddyboy23.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 28, 06:21PM

teddyboy23 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cat its not directed at you .its for my mate cella
> .

My Apols then teddy. I don't know if it's hate, but Cella certainly seems to be full of something....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was april 28, 06:28pm by TheCat.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 29, 12:13AM

For the last time TheCat stop criticising women and adopt a more positive outlook. I'm not feeding your habit after this.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 29, 12:14AM

teddyboy23 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Cat its not directed at you .its for my mate cella
> .she had a pop at me on the brexit thread with a
> Simula post

You just need get a life or maybe learn to spell.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by TheCat April 29, 07:07AM

cella Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> For the last time TheCat stop criticising women
> and adopt a more positive outlook. I'm not feeding
> your habit after this.


HaHa...brilliant, now I know for sure that you are just a wind-up merchant.

I criticise 1 statement by 1 woman (well, i've criticised you as well, so if you're a woman, that makes two women i've criticized in this thread)...and that means I need to 'stop criticising women and adopt a more positive outlook'

Okay, sure. Well, I'm an immigrant, and you have criticised me. So Cella, for the last time, you really need to stop criticising immigrants and adopt a more positive outlook. Your anti-immigrant agenda is harmful and unproductive.

see...we can all play this ridiculous gamesmiling smiley



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was april 29, 07:09am by TheCat.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by KalamityKel April 29, 09:26AM

I'm still waiting to see what cella's point is... smiling smiley

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by JohnL April 29, 10:17AM


messageRe: Diversity
Posted by cella April 29, 10:48AM

TheCat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> cella Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > For the last time TheCat stop criticising women
> > and adopt a more positive outlook. I'm not
> feeding
> > your habit after this.
>
>
> HaHa...brilliant, now I know for sure that you are
> just a wind-up merchant.
>
> I criticise 1 statement by 1 woman (well, i've
> criticised you as well, so if you're a woman, that
> makes two women i've criticized in this
> thread)...and that means I need to 'stop
> criticising women and adopt a more positive
> outlook'
>
> Okay, sure. Well, I'm an immigrant, and you have
> criticised me. So Cella, for the last time, you
> really need to stop criticising immigrants and
> adopt a more positive outlook. Your anti-immigrant
> agenda is harmful and unproductive.
>
> see...we can all play this ridiculous gamesmiling smiley

You and Philip Davies are cut from the same cloth. I'm hopefully right in that you don't have a partner so can feel free to indulge your rants.

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by fishbiscuits April 29, 11:36AM

TheCat Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> how can they say this with a straight face when there
> isn't one candidate representative of half the population?

Yes and no... gender is just one criteria you could use to split the population. Ethnicity, class, sexuality, disability... and plenty more besides. You could look at the conservatives for instance, and conclude that they're disproportionately white and privately educated.

You also have to consider the raison d'etre for such a party. Realistically, they're not going to be expecting credible success in a general election. But perhaps they can achieve something valuable through representation in local politics, as well as raising awareness of issues affecting women, and presumably seek to influence mainstream the political narrative. Given these (assumed) aims, I'd argue that male representation is not necessary.

This reminds me a little bit of "black lives matter" vs "all lives matter". Sometimes a marginalized group needs to shout a bit louder to get their voices heard... make the needle overshoot a bit before a system can reach equilibrium. Then a bunch of people completely miss the point and start wailing "but what about me!! I matter too!!"...

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by Siduhe April 29, 11:37AM

Quote:
TheCat
So, the new leader of the Women's Equality Party makes the claim that their candidate list is the MOST DIVERSE of all political parties....how can they say this with a straight face when there isn't one candidate representative of half the population?

I was intrigued enough to read the article and it seems pretty clear to me that what is being referred to - in the context of an entire article about the appointment of the first black leader of a political party, entitled "We’re not just for middle class white women" - when Mandu Reid says she would venture that the WEP has a more diverse list of candidates than any other party, she's talking about representing women of colour, the LGBTQAI community, women with disabilities or other impairments and women from diverse social classes. You may not agree with what the WEP is trying to do (although it sounds like you do) but cherry picking a sentence in an article without context to make a point seems an odd way to do it.

I also agree that most of the evidence suggests that diverse workplaces make more successful and more productive long term value creating businesses (in contrast, having a more diverse workplace seems to restrict short term strategies and gains which is often held up as examples of why women don't succeed as much in business). But in a politics context, what the WEP are trying to do is balance up the representation of women in a system which is already skewed significantly against them in terms of numbers - as are groups like Women2Win (which is the Conservative group trying to do pretty much the same thing). Are you suggesting that the WEP needs to put forward male candidates in order to meet their aim of improving the number of women representatives in Parliament?

messageRe: Diversity
Posted by Siduhe April 29, 11:38AM

Quote:
fishbiscuits
This reminds me a little bit of "black lives matter" vs "all lives matter". Sometimes a marginalized group needs to shout a bit louder to get their voices heard... make the needle overshoot a bit before a system can reach equilibrium. Then a bunch of people completely miss the point and start wailing "but what about me!! I matter too!!"...

What he/she said...

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