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messageMore protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by IlonaM August 30, 06:50PM

[www.standard.co.uk]

Stop The Coup, defend democracy - protest at Downing Street
Tomorrow, 12:00 – 14:00
SW1A 2AT
London

Parliament Returns. We protest. #RejectBrexit
Tue, 08:30 – 23:30
Palace of Westminster
London

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by uncleglen August 30, 11:33PM

What a load of contradictory hypocritical phrases- defend democracy- you mean HONOUR the original Referendum vote surely....next thing you will all be moaning the cops are not around- self-serving bunch of champagne socialists

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by dbboy August 31, 10:43AM

Coup? What Coup????

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Saffron August 31, 03:10PM

I'm not for defending Cambridge Analytica and a bunch of who lied. Just stay in your box. I'm sure it's comfy there. Chortle.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Loutwo August 31, 03:27PM

I changed my mind on Brexit soon after voting. I still think we should remain. But the more I see these protests talking about “democracy” the more the remain camp is pushing me and like minded folk away. I have to be honest here.

Louisa.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Sephiroth August 31, 03:41PM

Always honest Lou

Usually wrong

Why would these protests drive you away? An unelected prime minister is taking us towards a no deal Brexit which is the opposite of that which was promised - it’s entirely appropriate to talk about democracy, the abuse of etc

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by diable rouge August 31, 04:26PM

I've lost count of the number of times Brexiters have used the veiled threat that there would be civil unrest if Brexit wasn't delivered. Whereas Remainers have demonstrated peacefully in their hundreds of thousands their opposition to Brexit and now the clear undermining of our democratic system by proroguing Parliament. We've got an unelected tinpot dictator telling Tory MPs that if they vote against No Deal they will automatically be deselected by Tory Central Office. Wake up Lou, this is how fascism creeps up, it never arrives in jackboots...

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by dbboy August 31, 05:40PM

Have you thought that Boris is playing a double bluff with the EU, but potentially the UK could leave as the majority at the time voted to leave the EU.

Next, you'll be calling for a General Strike on 31st October.

Referring to Nazi Germany causes offence, do you really need to introduce that?

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by diable rouge August 31, 06:11PM

I didn't refer to Nazi Germany. And even if I did, why would you take offence?...

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Sephiroth August 31, 06:29PM

How does this “game of double-bluff” work then dbboy?

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by dbboy September 01, 01:06PM

diable rouge Yesterday, 04:26PM "this is how fascism creeps up, it never arrives in jackboots..."

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by diable rouge September 01, 01:14PM

That's still not a reference to Nazi Germany. Keep trying...

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by uncleglen September 01, 01:41PM

Sephiroth Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Always honest Lou
>
> Usually wrong
>
> Why would these protests drive you away? An
> unelected prime minister is taking us towards a no
> deal Brexit which is the opposite of that which
> was promised - it’s entirely appropriate to talk
> about democracy, the abuse of etc

Gordon Brown wasn't elected and he got Milliband to sig the Lisbon treaty...[www.heritage.org]

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by uncleglen September 01, 01:46PM

diable rouge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's still not a reference to Nazi Germany. Keep
> trying...
Sadiq has done it for you
[inews.co.uk]

what an embarrassment he is turning out to be

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by diable rouge September 01, 01:59PM

Errrr, Sadiq Khan doesn't speak for me and what I wrote. Keep trying...

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by DulwichFox September 01, 01:59PM

Hitler wanted a united Europe under HIS Command.
He basically invented th E.U. but was defeated.

The E.U. was formed in an attempt to prevent conflict between its members from ever happening again.
Thats what we were all told. It was more of a financial set up for which the U.K. were not really part off.

The member countries adopted the Euro as their currency. The UK kept the Pound.

Why do you think Brussels allowed us to do that ??

It meant we were Never really part of the E.U. in the Financial sector. and were subject to an exchange rate.

That's a big area were The UK lost out and have continued to do so.

Fox

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by pk September 01, 02:12PM

DulwichFox Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Hitler wanted a united Europe under HIS Command.
> He basically invented th E.U. but was defeated.
>
> The E.U. was formed in an attempt to prevent
> conflict between its members from ever happening
> again.
> Thats what we were all told. It was more of a
> financial set up for which the U.K. were not
> really part off.
>
> The member countries adopted the Euro as their
> currency. The UK kept the Pound.
>
> Why do you think Brussels allowed us to do that
> ??
>
> It meant we were Never really part of the E.U. in
> the Financial sector. and were subject to an
> exchange rate.
>
> That's a big area were The UK lost out and have
> continued to do so.
>
> Fox

Financial services is an area where we are already losing out as a result of a leave vote

But as usual you’re happy to spout rubbish that has no basis in reality

‘Hitler invented the EU’! WTF!

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Loutwo September 01, 02:23PM

With respect, foxy has a valid point. The rise of Hitler was a second attempt by the German state, under a dictator, to take over Europe and unite it under the Third Reich. It began with the annexation of “German speaking” regions of various neighbouring countries throughout the 1930’s and ended with them eyeing up the Soviet Union.

The EU has done a lot of good things for Europe, but it has also done a lot of not so good things. It’s treatment of Greece for one, is a shameful stain on its reputation. I think we should remain, but not because I absolutely love this capitalist loving institution for wealthy unelected elites, but because I am a pragmatist who thinks we are so badly entangled within its structure we could potentially cause a lot of immediate and possibly long lasting damage to our economy.

However, all these remain marches and two fingers at democracy make me feel very uneasy. As I’m sure they do a lot of people.

Louisa.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Loutwo September 01, 02:31PM

Sephiroth Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Always honest Lou
>
> Usually wrong
>
> Why would these protests drive you away? An
> unelected prime minister is taking us towards a no
> deal Brexit which is the opposite of that which
> was promised - it’s entirely appropriate to talk
> about democracy, the abuse of etc

Prime Ministers in the U.K. are not elected as such, never have been. The party has the privilege of crowning them such. Not sure why that is always thrown up as a justification for anything people don’t agree with a government doing.

Parliament could have walked away with May’s deal three times and chose not to. This could all be done and dusted by now. The fact is, most remainers won’t be happy until we get a second referendum in which everyone decides to vote remain. It’s not going to happen. And let’s say people voted to leave again, would you remainers accept the result? Or would you want a further referendum? Maybe the question could be “are you really really sure you want to leave?”

The whole thing is getting ridiculous!

Louisa.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by pk September 01, 02:32PM

Loutwo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> With respect, foxy has a valid point. The rise of
> Hitler was a second attempt by the German state,
> under a dictator, to take over Europe and unite it
> under the Third Reich. It began with the
> annexation of “German speaking” regions of various
> neighbouring countries throughout the 1930’s and
> ended with them eyeing up the Soviet Union.
>
with respect, suggesting hitler invented the EU is ridiculous

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Loutwo September 01, 02:36PM

pk Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Loutwo Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > With respect, foxy has a valid point. The rise
> of
> > Hitler was a second attempt by the German
> state,
> > under a dictator, to take over Europe and unite
> it
> > under the Third Reich. It began with the
> > annexation of “German speaking” regions of
> various
> > neighbouring countries throughout the 1930’s
> and
> > ended with them eyeing up the Soviet Union.
> >
> with respect, suggesting hitler invented the EU is
> ridiculous

With respect, if we had not had Hitler, we would not have needed the EU. The Second World War lead to European nations seeking a way of uniting nations under a umbrella organisation to prevent dictatorships such as the nazi regime. Without Hitler and his tyranny, the EU would never have happened.

Louisa.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by pk September 01, 02:45PM

Loutwo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> pk Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Loutwo Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > With respect, foxy has a valid point. The
> rise
> > of
> > > Hitler was a second attempt by the German
> > state,
> > > under a dictator, to take over Europe and
> unite
> > it
> > > under the Third Reich. It began with the
> > > annexation of “German speaking” regions of
> > various
> > > neighbouring countries throughout the 1930’s
> > and
> > > ended with them eyeing up the Soviet Union.
> > >
> > with respect, suggesting hitler invented the EU
> is
> > ridiculous
>
> With respect, if we had not had Hitler, we would
> not have needed the EU. The Second World War lead
> to European nations seeking a way of uniting
> nations under a umbrella organisation to prevent
> dictatorships such as the nazi regime. Without
> Hitler and his tyranny, the EU would never have
> happened.
>
> Louisa.

Hitler didn’t invent war or empire building or international trade you know

But even if he had it wouldn’t mean that he invented the EU

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Loutwo September 01, 02:55PM

Foxy was making the point pk that Hitler indirectly contributed towards the ideas behind the EU. And tbh, they’ve followed quite a undemocratic and institutionalised path ever since!

Louisa.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Jenny1 September 01, 02:57PM

Dulwich Fox. What are your views on Churchill's ideas on a united Europe?

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by dbboy September 01, 03:02PM

Now, it's the inference that you clearly make

diable rouge Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> That's still not a reference to Nazi Germany. Keep
> trying...

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Jenny1 September 01, 03:07PM

dbboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Now, it's the inference that you clearly make
>
> diable rouge Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > That's still not a reference to Nazi Germany.
> Keep
> > trying...

This is a long read but I think it makes some really interesting points about what comparisons we can and can't make between our current situation and the Weimar Republic. There are, of course, never any direct repetitions of history, and one shouldn't look for them, while at the same time trying to learn what lessons one can from the past.

[www.prospectmagazine.co.uk]

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by dbboy September 01, 03:23PM

I believe learning lessons from history is important so that they are not repeated.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by diable rouge September 01, 04:06PM

dbboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Now, it's the inference that you clearly make

Wrong, it's the inference that you clearly have made. Fascism seeks to destroy parliamentary liberalism, hence why I used it in the context of this Gov shutting down parliament. I deliberately used the term fascism in the generic term rather than a specific form of fascism. It was you that equated fascism to 'Nazi Germany'. By the way, fascism's roots are actually in Italian politics...

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by Jenny1 September 01, 04:22PM

dbboy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I believe learning lessons from history is
> important so that they are not repeated.

I think we can all agree with this.

messageRe: More protests in Westminster: Saturday & Tuesday
Posted by dbboy September 01, 04:27PM

So how do you describe 1930's Germany, Hitler and the resulting catastrophe which resulted?

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