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messageCompulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by DulwichFox June 15, 10:50AM

From Today (Monday 15th June) Face coverings are compulsory for people traveling on Public Transport.

However this does not seem to apply to Drivers.
I only saw 1 driver wearing a face covering today whilst out on Lordship Lane.

Why has it taken 12 weeks to bring in this Rule. ?? Utter nonsense...

DulwichFox

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by NewWave June 15, 10:10PM

I've just got in from work having used both overground and Jubilee line at 9am this morning and back via the London bridge train at 8.45 ish this evening.
This 'Rule' is being ignored-on the station platform this morning about 50% of people weren't wearing masks.
On the Jubilee line about half the people in my carriage just dropped the masks to their necks therefore leaving their noses and moths uncovered.
Coming home this evening on the Jubilee line a guy sat opposite me and removed his mask-I told him to put it back on-his response "why?" I told him 40.000 people have died in this country thats why.. his response was to ignore me and sit with it hanging off one ear-At London bridge there were lots of staff in High viz stood by the barriers-They didn't stop anyone walking through to the platforms who wasn't wearing a mask-and trust me-there were several.
like lockdown the face covering rule will fall apart within weeks-in fact it seems to be being ignored already.
A 2nd wave is sure to come with peoples attitude being what it is towards this very serious invisible threat to life.
If nothing is being done to enforce these simple rules.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by singalto June 15, 10:23PM

How depressing..

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 15, 10:31PM

They are not simple rules there has been contradictory advice about wearing masks, there are many people feel there breathing is prohibited wearing one. I do not believe it will benefit anyone in the long run, in fact I think it wilhave an negitive impact on our immune system and will interfere with natural immunity. If someone was ill then maybe it can protect but how many people especially at this time would be travelling on public transport if they were ill. 40,000 people did not die because people weren<t wearing face maske. it is not clear who is exempt from wearing one except people with lung problems, how will this be policed? again we<ll be faced with the same story of people making judgements about what people are allowed or not allowed to do.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Blah Blah June 16, 06:01AM

Masks are 80% effective in reducing the range of the germs you cough or sneeze out. It is no big deal to wear one and it serves as a constant reminder of the importance of doing what we all can to reduce the rate of infection. The problem is that people are wearing neoprene when they should be wearing surgical masks, which are lighter and easier to wear. But we have a government that does not know what it is doing and seems to think it can't get the supplies needed for the population. Given how cheap and easy those masks are to make, I am mystified at the lack of preparation.

As for immunity, we all develop that over a lifetime. It is not impeded by occasional use of a surgical mask. You don't see surgeons becoming immunocompromised as a result of the job they do.

Carry on like this, and we are heading for a serious second wave when seasonal flu hits, and we WILL be back in lockdown for the entire Winter as a result. That is why the scientific advisors, including those on the SAGE committee are no longer standing by government policy. We don't even know if those who recover from covid are immune, or for how long. It will take a good year to know that.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 16, 11:24AM

Blah blah. Carry on like this, where people are following rules where no questions are answered, then when they are, they contradict past decisions. Primarily surgeons wear masks to protect patients. Yes masks are worn in some workplaces to protect the wearer. The second wave is being woven like a threat which divides those who do not want to hear, give conversation or platform to the scientist who disagree with the narrative. An narrative that has not made sense from the start.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by KidKruger June 16, 12:37PM

TE44, I don't think the prospect of a 2nd wave is being used as a threat by anyone.
It's simply a possible outcome of increased infections, which could be contributed to by people not wearing masks.
How anyone can think a barrier between one person and another (or two barriers, if they're both wearing masks) would not help prevent infections is beyond me.
I think people don't take it seriously due to self-entitlement and having not known first-hand someone who died.
What do the people who've contracted Covid19 say ?

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by snoopy17 June 16, 01:42PM

I have no health problems, but after 2 minutes I can't breathe in those masks, wearing those masks for a long period of time will make more people sick as they are breathing in their own breathe.


if you have no health problems and you can't Breath in a mask will they still let you on a bus.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by JohnL June 16, 01:56PM

I practiced with a bandana over my mouth and nose at home as I know I'll re-adjust and fiddle.

It's cotton so the feeling of not being able to breathe is not real and goes as you get used to it.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 16, 02:04PM

Kk I don't believe its about self entitlement nor is it as simple as saying people don't take it seriously. When people do not take the word of corrupt instirutes who do not have our best interest at heart. We do not have to follow rules which can be changed at the drop of a hat or sbould I say science expertise that refuse to have any conversation with other scientists/ doctors who do not agree with measures pit in place. And resign to the usual insults.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by DulwichFox June 16, 02:06PM

It's odd but before the Pandemic, if you went into a Bank or Building Society wearing a mask
the staff would Press the Panic Button and the shutters would shoot up closed and the alarm would be set off.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Sephiroth June 16, 02:11PM

The ability of this country to contemplae it's own navel and ignore the rest of the world never fails to surprise me

Let's break it down

Are other countries dealing with this virus much better with far lower infection rates and fatalities? Yes

Are masks being used in these countries? Yes

Can people still breathe even when wearing these masks? Yes

Everything else is just waffle

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Spartacus June 16, 03:29PM

snoopy17 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have no health problems, but after 2 minutes I
> can't breathe in those masks, wearing those masks
> for a long period of time will make more people
> sick as they are breathing in their own breathe.
>
>
> if you have no health problems and you can't
> Breath in a mask will they still let you on a bus.

This is typical of the general attitude in the population

"I know we need to wear face coverings but I'm a special case and beside I won't catch it or pass it on"

We don't seem to be very good at following the rules do we! Maybe because "the special cases" went out and spread the virus during the 10 weeks of lock down rather than following the advice of staying home then the numbers could have been lower over the whole period, based purely on if people stayed in then the virus couldn't be transmitted. Of course this is am idealistic view of things but based on comments about people not wanting to wear masks then it lends weight to the concept in my opinion.

Oh Snoopy, I'm not having a go at you, more the general attitude we as a nation seem to have to bring told what to do yet wanting to blame those that tell us when our failure to follow advice makes everything go wrong.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Blah Blah June 16, 03:44PM

TE44 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Blah blah. Carry on like this, where people are
> following rules where no questions are answered,
> then when they are, they contradict past
> decisions. Primarily surgeons wear masks to
> protect patients. Yes masks are worn in some
> workplaces to protect the wearer. The second wave
> is being woven like a threat which divides those
> who do not want to hear, give conversation or
> platform to the scientist who disagree with the
> narrative. An narrative that has not made sense
> from the start.

The concept of a virus that spreads easily, hospitalises a large percentage of people and kills, by the latest global stats, 9 per cent of confirmed cases, should be an easy enough concept to grasp, irregardless of government messaging.

The governments problem is that they have an economy to manage as well as the virus and they are struggling to find the best way forward.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Blah Blah June 16, 03:47PM

snoopy17 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have no health problems, but after 2 minutes I
> can't breathe in those masks, wearing those masks
> for a long period of time will make more people
> sick as they are breathing in their own breathe.
>
>
> if you have no health problems and you can't
> Breath in a mask will they still let you on a bus.


This is rubbish of the kind being peddled by conspiracy theorists. Once you have an infection, you can not make yourself more infected by breathing back in the viral particles you shed. It is the antibodies you produce to fight the infection that decide how long you remain infected for and to what degree. The wearing of a mask makes no difference to that, but it will reduce the chance of you infecting others in proximity to you.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by binkylilyput June 16, 05:25PM

I'd say I had quite a different experience on the same lines to NewWave but different times. Was very quiet and 99% folk wearing a mask. One or two not. Occasionally people dropped their mask to have a bit of a breath (it was stuffy and warm) or a drink or whatever but most people seemed to be doing what they are meant to do.

Also giving out free masks at some stations plus police presence at a number of stations that I used.

It was also very quiet, even at rush hour in the afternoon.

Nothing will be perfect and not everyone will comply all of the time but good enough compliance should be good enough!

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by malumbu June 16, 06:24PM

Yep, used a train from Wealdstone to Clapham Junciton, quiet and all with face masks. Good social distancing at both stations.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Pugwash June 16, 06:51PM

I have no problems in wearing a mask but as a person who lip reads as I have only partial hearing, it would be helpful if other mask wearers take in to consideration that I may ask them to repeat anything that is said to me. I have head the experience of people talking to me and I have asked them to repeat for them to get very aggressive .

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by kiera June 16, 07:15PM

There's a firm in Edinburgh making masks which have a transparent insert so that the wearer's lips can be read. They're expensive at 15.99
[www.breathe-easy.info]

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 16, 07:43PM

Blah Blah Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> TE44 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Blah blah. Carry on like this, where people are
> > following rules where no questions are
> answered,
> > then when they are, they contradict past
> > decisions. Primarily surgeons wear masks to
> > protect patients. Yes masks are worn in some
> > workplaces to protect the wearer. The second
> wave
> > is being woven like a threat which divides
> those
> > who do not want to hear, give conversation or
> > platform to the scientist who disagree with the
> > narrative. An narrative that has not made sense
> > from the start.
>
> The concept of a virus that spreads easily,
> hospitalises a large percentage of people and
> kills, by the latest global stats, 9 per cent of
> confirmed cases, should be an easy enough concept
> to grasp, irregardless of government messaging.
>
> The governments problem is that they have an
> economy to manage as well as the virus and they
> are struggling to find the best way forward.


Blah blah, the governments problem is justifying thee deaths! Deprivation and all the other things we can look forward to that has come from there actions to deal with a pandemic that has not seen the people die that was expected. Niw the government may say that is because of there actions, so what has changed that saved the millions from dying that it would now call for face masks to be mandatory. The flu will be upon us soon, why not learn from there mistakes and actually care for the vulnerable. Its so much easier when we are pointing the finger at one another rather than asking why it is alright to take away our rights, lets hear a debate from doctors/ scientists who have different ideas and experiences around this virus. Or will they continue to vilify and encourage us to blame one another rather than look at what is going on.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 16, 07:49PM

Blah blah Can you tell me why people with lung problems are exempt from wearing one on transport if there is no problem wearing one.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Sephiroth June 16, 07:53PM

Te44

You could answer questions already posed

Other countries with better records and lower infections uses masks without any of the problems you portray

How is that?

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 16, 08:00PM

[www.clinicaltrials.gov]

An old study on facemasks, pre covid.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Sephiroth June 16, 08:05PM

That ignores in every sense the questions asked

The world in in a pandemic

And countries other than U.K. are handling it better with lower death rates and lower infections

And those countries are using face masks either widely or by law

And it is helping and not causing problems

So how come?

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 16, 09:27PM

Is it helping and not causing problems? Time will tell. It may be the least of our worries regarding choices, who knows theres enough people willing to believe whatever picture! story or number given. After all its not like we can't trust our governments or people in power.can you imagine the conspiracy if you thought that.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Blah Blah June 16, 09:58PM

TE44, we have an excess death count, compared to the year on year average, that can be explained in no other way than being the result of this pandemic. In the winter, if a second wave hits, we will see another excess death count, compared to the figures seasonal flu delivers. We have a moral duty to protect life and the only way that can be effectively done during a pandemic is in the way that governments around the world have responded.

The cost to the economy of doing nothing is bigger longer term. Why? because business is equally hit hard when millions of people are too sick to work at any given time, and health resources, unable to cope with the pandemic, can't treat anyone else either. Why do you think Spanish Flu (the last unfettered global pandemic) killed an estimated 40 million plus? Why do you think that had a depressive economic impact? Why do you think Manchester, who did employ what we would now recognise as social distancing and lock down measures, had less than other cities that did not in 1918?

And by other doctors/ scientists who have different ideas and experiences, please don't say you mean the discredited voices behind hogwash like 'Plandemic'. Those people are deliberately peddling claims they know are not true, and are a disgrace to science.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Blah Blah June 16, 10:01PM

TE44 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Blah blah Can you tell me why people with lung
> problems are exempt from wearing one on transport
> if there is no problem wearing one.

You really have to ask this? Some of those with compromised respiratory conditions may need clearer airways in a way that healthy people don't. They are not being told to not wear masks, only that they do not need to if it compromises their condition.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by Blah Blah June 16, 10:08PM

TE44 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> [www.clinicaltrials.gov]
> 7
>
> An old study on facemasks, pre covid.


Oddly enough, this page has been doing the rounds from the pandemic deniers over the last 24 hours. It is rather telling as to the sources you are following TE44 ;)

This relates to a particular types of mask, that has many layers and is not really designed for all day use. Surgical masks are much lighter. Hypoxia is something usually experienced at altitude, where the air is thinner and less 02 dense. Different people have different thresholds for hypoxia. This is why not everyone can be a fighter pilot for example. The likelihood of a doctor or nurse suffering from hypoxia from wearing a mask is rare. But should anyone feel nauseous, common sense requires they simply take a break to recover. And that is exactly what nurses and doctors do.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was june 16, 10:09pm by Blah Blah.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by TE44 June 16, 10:47PM

Bkah blah I know its an old study, I thought it would be less likely to be related to conspiracy as pre covid. It is the first time I have ever seen that link so your assumptions of the sources you believe I am following shows how easy it is to believe when people differ from your own views it is easier to group people together. I was actualky speaking from a personal view and what I would regard as common sense. If your inhalation is restricted I believe that has an effect.

messageRe: Compulsory Face coverings on Public Transport.
Posted by DulwichBorn&Bred June 16, 11:34PM

In that case, doctors, surgeons, nurses, dentists, vets etc would be dropping like flies every day since they wear masks and breathe in their own breaths. Honestly, I despair.

TE44 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bkah blah I know its an old study, I thought it
> would be less likely to be related to conspiracy
> as pre covid. It is the first time I have ever
> seen that link so your assumptions of the sources
> you believe I am following shows how easy it is to
> believe when people differ from your own views it
> is easier to group people together. I was actualky
> speaking from a personal view and what I would
> regard as common sense. If your inhalation is
> restricted I believe that has an effect.

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