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messageOur Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by Jezza May 04, 09:25AM

The council is seeking the views of residents, businesses and stakeholders on traffic volumes, road safety, air quality and walking and cycling issues affecting the East Dulwich and wider Dulwich area.

They have gathered data on air quality hot spots, traffic volumes, through traffic routes, traffic speeds, collision hotspots and feedback from previous engagements.

Have your say on possible solutions to explore with residents, agree/ disagree on comments made by others, pin your comments at a specific location on their engagement app.

This approach seems different from previous consultations by the council and aims to be open to potential approaches in relation to the issues that people identify.

The first phase of finding out more about issues that people face lasts until 7th June and can be found at:

[www.southwark.gov.uk]

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by Otto2 May 05, 09:38PM

I am getting an error trying to add feedback to the map. I've registered.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by h3+ May 05, 11:49PM

Me too :-(

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by Sally Eva May 06, 08:30AM

Me too. Too many people posting at the same time I guess. I got two comments on and then error messages

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by Penguin68 May 06, 08:36AM

You do all understand, I hope, that the objective of this exercise is to flood the area with 'concerns' about e.g. road safety to help justify ('public demand') whatever draconian and probably inappropriate 'traffic management' schemes they plan - more CPZs; more extended double yellows, less parking etc. etc. There will be no more buses, with no additional frequency (of course, as that's TfL not Southwark) let alone any improvements in the rail services. Every time you add a concern you add another nail in the coffin of cars in Southwark, the stated aim of the council.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by tiddles May 06, 09:36AM

Thats exactly what i was thinking penguin! - they clearly don't give a stuff about what people actually think! Hugely expensive ‘consultation’ which then disregarded the responses followed by a shambolic public meeting! What on earth do we Think they are up to now....

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by Sally Eva May 07, 09:34AM

This is working again now.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by Abe_froeman May 07, 10:01AM

Penguin, I've taken a leaf out of the book of that southwark cyclists special interest group page on the other thread and am flooding this consultation with comments that reflect my personal preferences and self interest.

So far I have expressed my grave concerns that removing all cars parked on the kerbside 1) increases the speed of traffic making the roads physically more dangerous for cyclists and pedestrians, and 2) encourages people to pave over their front gardens to use as car parks, thus increasing pollution a de-greening the area, which are causing yet more lung and brain damage to cyclists

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by TheCat May 07, 10:24AM

Perhaps in keeping with other threads on this forum, we could add some "Dog Shite" hotspots onto this map.....surely not having feaces smeared everywhere plays a part in having 'healthy streets'.....?

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by El Presidente May 07, 12:26PM

Penguin68 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You do all understand, I hope, that the objective
> of this exercise is to flood the area with
> 'concerns' about e.g. road safety to help justify
> ('public demand') whatever draconian and probably
> inappropriate 'traffic management' schemes they
> plan - more CPZs; more extended double yellows,
> less parking etc. etc. There will be no more
> buses, with no additional frequency (of course, as
> that's TfL not Southwark) let alone any
> improvements in the rail services. Every time you
> add a concern you add another nail in the coffin
> of cars in Southwark, the stated aim of the
> council.

Precisely what they are up to. It is right out of their standard playbook. They probably already know what draconian scheme they are planning, but will be sequencing the consultation to get the result they want.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by sonnyw May 07, 01:06PM

I had problems with the site as well but I emailed Southwark about it and I eventually sorted the problem. It seems to have a problem with really old phones/browsers.

Email them on Highways@southwark.gov.uk

I just gave them a description of my problem, sent across a screengrab, what phone/PC I was using and the email address I registered with.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by rahrahrah May 07, 04:12PM

This is so tedious. If they really wanted to improve the health of the area then they would close some streets off to traffic in order to create cycle routes into town, invest in secure cycle parking at all tube stations, invest in local public transport. But they won't. They'll bring in CPZs, continue to approve drop kerbs and the concreting over of gardens and put in more and more speed bumps (adding to pollution). None of these things decrease local car ownership, or improve the environment.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit was may 07, 04:14pm by rahrahrah.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by rahrahrah May 07, 04:19PM

rahrahrah Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is so tedious. If they really wanted to
> improve the health of the area then they would
> close some streets off to traffic in order to
> create cycle routes into town, invest in secure
> cycle parking at all tube stations, invest in
> local public transport. But they won't. They'll
> bring in CPZs, continue to approve drop kerbs and
> the concreting over of gardens and put in more and
> more speed bumps (adding to pollution). None of
> these things decrease local car ownership, or
> improve the environment.

... oh, and completely fail to police commonplace, dangerous driving.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by rahrahrah May 07, 04:23PM

That said, at least they're trying to take an area wide approach rather than the usual 'he who shouts loudest' one.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was may 07, 04:25pm by rahrahrah.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by XDoc May 07, 05:02PM

Penguin68 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> You do all understand, I hope, that the objective
> of this exercise is to flood the area with
> 'concerns' about e.g. road safety to help justify
> ('public demand') whatever draconian and probably
> inappropriate 'traffic management' schemes they
> plan - more CPZs; more extended double yellows,
> less parking etc. etc. There will be no more
> buses, with no additional frequency (of course, as
> that's TfL not Southwark) let alone any
> improvements in the rail services. Every time you
> add a concern you add another nail in the coffin
> of cars in Southwark, the stated aim of the
> council.

exactly...

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by first mate May 07, 08:39PM

Abe_froeman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Penguin, I've taken a leaf out of the book of that
> southwark cyclists special interest group page on
> the other thread and am flooding this consultation
> with comments that reflect my personal preferences
> and self interest.
>
> So far I have expressed my grave concerns that
> removing all cars parked on the kerbside 1)
> increases the speed of traffic making the roads
> physically more dangerous for cyclists and
> pedestrians, and 2) encourages people to pave over
> their front gardens to use as car parks, thus
> increasing pollution a de-greening the area, which
> are causing yet more lung and brain damage to
> cyclists

Do follow the example set and try to call friends, even friends living out of the area and get them to participate in future plans for ED streets.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by wulfhound May 07, 09:08PM

"If they really wanted to improve the health of the area then they would close some streets off to traffic in order to create cycle routes into town, invest in secure cycle parking at all tube stations, invest in local public transport. But they won't."

Given that Healthy Streets seems to be a brainchild of Will Norman (the Mayor's Walking & Cycling Commissioner), you would at least hope..

Investing in local public transport is challenging since (without wishing to make this political) Central Government removed all of TfL's grant. With Crossrail delayed, TfL are strapped for cash. Ideally you'd want two other routes to complement the P4 - one running roughly SE-NW (i.e. Sydenham/Herne Hill) and another SW-NE i.e. West Norwood to Peckham. Failing that you just need a LOT more P4s to connect up with existing routes running north and south of the Village.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by seenbeen May 09, 02:11PM

I'm sick of speeding cyclists- they are silent, they speed around bends, I have had a couple of close calls and my sister has a permanent injury to her foot because of a cyclist who did not even stop after he mowed her down....

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by goldilocks May 09, 07:18PM

Just out of interest Seenbeen - how many people do you think have been injured by cyclists locally? Compare this to how many people you think have been injured by cars? Move on to consider the severity of injury in each scenario!

Yes there are stupid cyclists and yes, very occasionally, the results of this are tragic. Mostly though the 'fear' of being hit by cyclists seems to be just that - a fear or percieved risk. I suspect it has got worse in recent years as people either texting / playing games or listening to music step off the kerb and don't hear cyclists, but overall the number of pedestrians hit by cyclists is extremely low and when they are hit the comparative harm compared to being hit by cars is much lower.

What happened to your sister is obviously unacceptable but I think that you need to consider healthy streets in a much wider context. What would help us across the board is a construct like the Netherlands where the assumption of fault lies with the transport that can do most harm - ie in cars vs bikes this would be the cars and in pedestrians vs bikes, it would be bikes.


seenbeen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sick of speeding cyclists- they are silent,
> they speed around bends, I have had a couple of
> close calls and my sister has a permanent injury
> to her foot because of a cyclist who did not even
> stop after he mowed her down....

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by rahrahrah May 17, 09:43AM

seenbeen Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I'm sick of speeding cyclists- they are silent,
> they speed around bends, I have had a couple of
> close calls and my sister has a permanent injury
> to her foot because of a cyclist who did not even
> stop after he mowed her down....

I've see some inconsiderate cycling and some extremely dangerous driving. The latter clearly causes significantly more harm and represents a much more serious problem generally, though both are unacceptable. It is often the same individuals who behave badly whether they're travelling by bike or in a car of course.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was may 17, 09:46am by rahrahrah.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by RichH May 17, 02:32PM

If we want to make roads healthier/safer (especially for cyclists and pedestrians) then I'd suggest making Cycling Proficiency Tests (now called "Bikeability" I believe) compulsory and bring back The Green Cross Man (a Superhero that really did save lives.)

[bikeability.org.uk]

If you're a driver or motorcycle rider that wants to improve their skills, perhaps consider undertaking some RoSPA training.

[www.rospa.com]

Now, how about some street signs advertising these worthwhile schemes? You know, signs that actually provide some useful information rather than just whatever suits the Council's political agenda at the time.

I infer that the 20mph speed limit is too slow. A simple deduction reached by observing that almost everyone exceeds it. This can't all be attributed to oft-repeated "bad driving". So, put the speed limit back to 30mph and take out all the speed bumps and similarly ridiculous obstacles (it's a road after all!) that force many vehicles to slow down to 10mph or less only to have to speed up again to prevent a queue forming behind them. That will allow vehicles to proceed at a steady and efficient pace thereby reducing what little pollution modern vehicles create.

Of course, more traffic policing (by which I mean proper, real Police) would help to reduce the few incidents of genuinely bad driving as well as catch the, even fewer, idiots. And of course an improvement in public transport wouldn't go amiss either.

And there you go, problem solved. Don't mention it!

...of course, it'll never happen big grin



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit was may 17, 02:43pm by RichH.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by snowy May 17, 03:55PM

Because your suggestions are frankly stupid and have been proven not to work?

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets –Dulwich
Posted by RichH May 17, 05:59PM

I suspect RoSPA and the Bikeability folk would disagree with you. Of course I can't be sure about the Green Cross Man. Teaching people to drive, ride and cross the road more safely is hardly stupid and doesn't work only for people of very low intelligence.

Roads worked perfectly well without obstacles in them for a couple of thousand years. Mind you, those Romans were a pretty daft lot too ;)


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