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The East Dulwich Forum
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messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 20, 06:22PM

It seems odd to have community wardens dealing with what are traffic offences .I wonder why they are there and not Traffic Wardens ,or even police support officers .

I think the community officers can only warn drivers and then "if necessary" pass the details on for a penalty notice . Some of the coach drivers seem unworried by their presence ,I almost feel it's a question of them running their engines until asked to stop .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by alice November 20, 06:52PM

Itatm I may have got the job title wrong not police officers but officials with red waistcoats. Maybe they are traffic wardens

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by exdulwicher November 20, 07:07PM

alice Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Itatm I may have got the job title wrong not
> police officers but officials with red waistcoats.
> Maybe they are traffic wardens

They might be "monitoring officers" or suchlike from Alleyn's. I know they had a couple of (presumably contracted) staff in a while ago "keeping an eye on things".

Which probably means that if you have an argument with a driver about idling engines, you'll find your picture being circulated to the police...

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by alice November 20, 07:41PM

No not the Alleyns people they wear yellow fluorescent jackets. The police are more interested in people were breaking the law. The police are more interested in people were breaking the law ie The drivers and those that instruct them to park illegally with their engines running.

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 20, 08:19PM

I think they are community wardens .They wear red jackets .
[www.southwark.gov.uk]

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by cleanairdulwich November 20, 10:57PM

Hi All

Really interesting to understand more about the strength of feeling locally about the coach parking.

We set up the ‘Clean Air for Dulwich’ group as a local grassroots campaign working hard to raise awareness and bring about changes which will reduce air pollution in the area. We’re a relatively new group and have been using social media channels (twitter, Instagram and a Facebook page – all @CleanAirDulwich) to raise awareness of issues locally and to gather support for positive change.

We’ve also been using these social media channels to raise awareness of Southwark Council’s ‘Our Healthy Streets’ consultation for Dulwich Village, and one of the focus areas of this consultation is specifically looking at how to address the issues on Townley Road. For people who haven’t yet responded, the response form is now online and this phase of consultation closes on the 23rd November and is a chance to look at options that could result in real change.


[consultations.southwark.gov.uk]


Please follow us on social media, email to join our mailing list at CleanAirForDulwich@gmail.com so that we can work together to make positive changes.

Kind regards
Clean Air for Dulwich



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was november 21, 07:35am by cleanairdulwich.

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 21, 09:09AM

Thanks for that clean air . I hadn't realised that this survey included Townley Road because I was under the impression ,gained from the map attached to the survey ,that Townley Road was not in the areas being considered .


messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 21, 09:24AM


messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by cleanairdulwich November 21, 09:47AM

The consultation works on junctions, but you can add comments on the Townley/ east dulwich grove junction as there is a free form box!

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 21, 10:13AM

I've taken the opportunity to express views on what measures I think might help the issuesin Townley Road .

Are you saying that the consultation is only about junctions ? That would be odd .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by cleanairdulwich November 21, 10:29AM

No- it isn’t, it’s just been set up in a way that picked out some key junctions and the issues ‘around’ them. It wasn’t intended to only focus on them though. Think for people who couldn’t make the workshops it can be a bit more tricky to unpick, but in summary fill in the consultation and comment if possible. Thanks!

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 21, 10:49AM

I did go to 2 workshops - one at the library and one at Christchurch at top of Barry Rd ,I didn't attend the Dulwich Village ones because I wasn't aware of them .And I only knew about the one at top of Barry Rd because I got an email from a councillor who I'd spoken to personally .

It seems such an odd consultation ,and really it shouldn't be difficult to unpick because you haven't been to a workshop .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by Metallic November 21, 01:56PM

Can someone tell me, after the coaches have dropped kids in the morning at JAGS/Alleyn's, how they turn round to get back to Dulwich Village where they turn after being in East Dulwich Grove? And how others go onwards from this drop off? Where do they go? Surely they are not parked in Townley all day - or are they?

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by mikeb November 21, 04:16PM

The two biggest problems in the area are (a) crossing the south circular at the Grove and (b) crossing the junction of East Dulwich Grove and Lordship Lane

everything else is pretty peripheral

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 21, 09:16PM

I quite agree re those two mikeb .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by Sally Eva November 22, 10:46AM

Two more days to do this consultation:
[consultations.southwark.gov.uk]

Lots of ideas -- surely some of them would deal with the coaches, it's a well-flagged problem

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 22, 11:16AM

I've been searching ( without success) on Dulwich Society because I'm sure I saw some info on what's happening re the LordshipLane/South Circular crossing issue .

I don't really do Twitter and all that stuff so I was surprised to see all the organisations all interested in pollution/congestion etc .
[twitter.com]

[twitter.com]

[twitter.com]

[twitter.com]

I see the clean air group have asked the police to intervene re Townley Rd - or more specifically and narrowly the Calton Ave junction with .

So I can see that this thread is redundant .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 22, 11:21AM

And this [dulwichsaferoutes.blogspot.com] indicates that all Alleyns sites have been awarded a TfL Gold Star award .Which involves

"Gold
Be among the top 10% of London schools, setting high standards to inspire others to transform travel habits, fully engage the wider community to promote best practices, and see a measurable reduction in the number of journeys made by car every day.

What you need to do
Within three academic years complete 25 different travel activities, 15 supporting activities and 8 consultation activities
Provide evidence for each activity completed
Demonstrate at least a 6% modal shift away from the car or at least 90% of pupils travelling actively"


so the coach situation is obviously not only fine but recognised as a good thing .

So I'm off to put my head in a bucket of water .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by Penguin68 November 22, 11:41AM

It's clearly true that transporting children by coach rather than by multiple private car journeys is a positive move - the problem is not with the children being moved in the coaches, but by the coaches blocking streets and polluting (through running their engines whilst stationary) when the children aren't in them!

Maye someone needs to contact TfL with this specific issue (management of coaches when they are not doing their job, but are waiting to do it) so they can reconsider their award scheme.

And if I was a current Alleyn's parent I wouldn't be happy that my children are being asked to breath in diesel fumes being pumped out round their school. They may as well be on a main road as a leafy suburban street.

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 22, 12:08PM

I do understand the one coach v. lots of cars ,though when I've seen coaches driving off they have v. few passengers .Possibly picking up at Townley and then off to other schools ?

The need to soak my head is prompted more by the plethora of groups all considering similar issues but this glaring aberration persisting plus the narrow vision of some eg focussing on Calton Road .

Plus the clear breeches of law by some drivers of coaches and the apparent lack of will by the authorities to address this .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?attachment
Posted by mikeb November 22, 03:12PM

This is interesting: the route map for the coaches for the foundation schools

[www.dulwich.org.uk]

I had a go at putting this onto a map - just shows how far away the local schools cast their nets.

Attachments: Foundation schools map.GIF (474.6KB)  
messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by alice November 22, 03:40PM

An impressive piece of work Mb.

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by Townleygreen November 22, 03:51PM

I'm led to believe that several of the coaches (not all) drive between JAGs/Alleyns and DC or vice versa. That probably explains the lack of punters on some coaches.
mikeb's map shows how essential these routes are, lots of cars being kept off the roads.

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by bels123 November 22, 04:35PM

Although it could be argued some routes are unnecessary and could be done via public transport or cycling instead.

This 2016 comprehensive report states ‘The majority of pupils using the coach service, some 65%, are transported less than four miles’

[consultations.southwark.gov.uk]

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 22, 08:00PM

The coaches are so large ,the ones I saw leaving Townley Road had no more than 5 passengers . So one has to believe that the other schools have much higher numbers of users . I wonder why the disparity .

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by intexasatthe moment November 23, 09:08AM

bels that's a very interesting report ,thank you for posting .

It is indeed comprehensive and I'm still digesting the contents .

Have hopefully attached some of the key points.

[imgur.com]

[imgur.com]

[imgur.com]


messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by mikeb November 25, 09:55AM

I am amazed how far kids travel to come to Alleyn's / JAGS. The pollution would definitely be better if the school was more skewed to local children.

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by alice November 25, 12:30PM

London state secondaries are now so good that private schools are having to trawl further to fill.

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by DuncanW November 25, 01:24PM

That's for sure. How would you affect that?

messageRe: Coaches ,Townley Road ,obstruction ,pollution when will it change ?
Posted by seenbeen November 25, 02:23PM

alice Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> London state secondaries are now so good that
> private schools are having to trawl further to
> fill.

Yes unlike when Harriet Harman felt the need to send her son to St. Olaves Boys Grammar in Orpington around 1995...

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