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messageNew LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by bobbsy January 04, 04:00PM

Over the last days, the streetlamps around mine have been replaced for LED lamps. Great in terms of reduced energy usage...however...

FAR TOO BRIGHT in my opinion, and the lovely yellow glow of the old ones replaced with harsher white-ish light.

Anyone else feel the same? It's just upped the light pollution considerably. I wonder if any chance they could be toned/turned down?

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by IlonaM January 04, 04:11PM

I saw them working on them the other day (Horniman end). I'll have a look out tonight after dark and see what I think. So far have only seen them alight at dusk. May be a big ask to get them changed for a warmer tone, but you could try!!

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by muffins78 January 04, 04:38PM

I thought the same Bobbsy - I had originally thought they had put in an additional light or something similar. They are very very bright!!

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by DulwichFox January 04, 04:59PM

Many years ago the same thing happened on Ulverscroft Road.

Bright White like daylight. They were later adjusted.
Currently quite Dim. Could do with a slight increase in brightness.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by IlonaM January 04, 10:25PM

They are brighter, but compared to the orangey glow of the street lights I can see at the end of Underhill on Lordship Lane the new ones seem to offer better lighting (security) for people walking home in the dark. I agree the tone could be warmer, but not sure whether Southwark would make the effort to adjust them.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was january 05, 07:10am by IlonaM.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by kford January 05, 07:12AM

Really bright lights mess with birds’ sleep patterns

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by bobbsy February 07, 08:40AM

This one

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by Shivering swan1 February 07, 08:50AM

I think the best course of action here would be to make a formal complaint to the council and force them to take action. They have plenty of lolly sloshing around in their coffers at present, so they can easily rip out the new lamps and replace them with something a bit more to your atmospheric pleasing.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by Shivering swan1 February 07, 08:53AM

Plus all the little birdies will surely appreciate the efforts, and will merrily tweet at a suitable time each morning, around about when the curtains are drawn and the fresh OJ is squeezed, but strictly no earlier lest valuable beauty sleep be interrupted.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by first mate February 08, 08:00AM

Get the local councillor involved. Very bright white lights are effectively light pollution and a contradiction of Southwark’s alleged commitment to the environment and making the area a greener, healthier place to live.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by James Barber February 10, 06:03PM

I sometimes had complaints about upgraded lights shining in bedroom windows and would get the council to add a light shield to cast a shadow on said windows.
White light is better for people walking around ot see whites of eyes and whether someone looking at you. Apparently better for street safety.
I had been seeking for street lights to be remotely monitored and controlled - fab cost saving as avoids having council officers on 'night patrolling' looking for dead street lights. They can then also be remotely turned down. Sadly not implemented yet.

--------------------
Regards jamesvbarber@gmail.com
former Liberal Democrat Councillor for East Dulwich Ward (2006-2018)
[www.jamesbarber.org.uk]
[twitter.com]

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by worldwiser February 11, 08:19PM

They're horrible. I feel like I'm living next to a football stadium. Like so many things the council does, they're all function and zero design. They've carpet bombed the neighbourhood with these awful things. Guess there wouldn't have been any point in consulting residents, we all know how the council stitches up consultations before they start. So angry.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by LEDphobic February 12, 04:15AM

In studies where councils have turned street lamps off or dimmed them considerably between the hours of midnight and 5 AM there has been no corresponding increase in crime. There is however evidence that these excessively bright lights can do damage to our sleep patterns and our wildlife. Apart from no longer being able to sleep in my own bedroom since the lamps were installed, walking up Underhill road at night is now like being under prison spotlights. They are causing light pollution and the only thing we can do and keep doing is bombard the council with complaints.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by micromacromonkey February 12, 02:42PM

In the meantime get a blackout curtain. You can get ones which stick to your window with suckers, or replace an existing blind. We got some for the kids' room and ended up using them ourselves.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by bobbsy February 12, 03:16PM

Thanks, yeap blackout blinds work, but I kind of like sleeping with the window open and waking with the dawn...however it's now permanent dawn!

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by LEDphobic February 12, 07:46PM

Here is a good article about how damaging the street lamps are to insects: [luxreview.com]. I just feel so sad. It feels like a madness - on the one hand we are informed we are facing a catastrophic threat to our global biodiversity and then our local authority implements policies to speed up the decline. We are told to remove our tablets and phones from our and our children’s rooms as the blue lights disrupt sleep but now that very same light is streamed though our windows. Yes you can buy blackout blinds but I want dark skies and a right to night.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by heartblock February 12, 08:43PM

New one outside our house.... I thought the police were doing a raid across the road. So pleased my bedroom is at the back. Terrible for birds and for anyone trying to sleep roadside. Is it worth complaining? Nothing has been done about a road hump despite being told that it would be ‘looked at’, so any thoughts?

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by LEDphobic February 12, 08:54PM

Yes complain. I was told today that their lead light engineer is due to carry out a night scout of the area on the 20th of Feb. He/she is obliged to look at every complaint and measure for obtrusive light on your property. The more people who make a fuss hopefully something will be done. Southwark are saying they are following guidelines and good practices as set out by the institution of lighting professionals (iLP). However, the ILP recommends providing an adequate shield, replacing the light fitting or varying the light levels if a complaint is received. They also suggest adopting a light ‘curfew’ which means turning the lights down after 23:00. Southwark is clearly not following these guidelines.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by heartblock February 12, 09:06PM

Have complained- will follow up in a week if no reply.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by FallingDownMoment February 12, 10:33PM

The streetlights in our street already had light shields fitted to shade bedroom windows. The shields were all removed when the lights were replaced with LEDs yesterday.

I don't mind the colour temperature, and the light spread seems a little more directed, but these new lights are almost painfully bright from certain angles, and way more powerful than is necessary or desirable after, say, midnight.

I'll definitely contact the council to request that they be dimmed later at night, for the benefit of people and wildlife.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by bobbsy February 13, 09:03AM

LEDphobic, how did you complain? I have emailed local councillors but have had nothing back from them.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by DulwichBorn&Bred February 13, 09:17AM

I emailed the local councillor too but have not had a reply as yet.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by micromacromonkey February 13, 10:10AM

Brightness can definitely be managed. You are almost certainly stuck with the colour though, as most 'white' LEDs are actually blue ones with phosphor in the plastic lens that absorbs some of the blue light and emits yellow instead. So the warmth/coldness of the LED is actually a balance between the blue and the yellow. This phosphor content(and hence blue/yellow ratio) is already baked in at manufacturing time so can't be altered.

It's also possible to make white LEDs from red, green and blue ones mixed together but this is more expensive and I have never seen street lights use this method.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by cw_1984 February 13, 10:29AM

we live on East Dulwich Grove - the new lights have turned up here (they used to be quite a soothing yellow) and this is no exaggeration - it is like having a dentist's lamp shining into our bedroom everynight - its penetrating our shutters - looks like we'll have to either invest a lot in blackout curtains or put something over the windows....never noticed it in 3 years until a week ago just after seeing these posts appear.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by miwg83 February 13, 10:38AM

I complained about the same thing on Hindmans Road last year and had a lighting engineer from the council come and take some readings. They measured the light levels at a downstairs window and we were told this measured less than 1 LUX - apparently obtrusive light can be as much as 5 LUX (if that means anything to anyone)! With the shutters open upstairs or downstairs at the moment it looks light daylight with the street lamps on so I can't imagine it 5x greater!

I did suggest the light shields but my request seemed to be ignored and I gave up.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by TreacleRabbit February 13, 11:07AM

Yes agree Crawthew lights are far too bright!
Where do we complain to please?

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by miwg83 February 13, 11:27AM

I emailed James McAsh who then copied in someone from the lighting department but as I said, they investigated and decided the light level was appropriate. As many above have said I find the white light is very intrusive but they seem to be operating off some guidelines which suggest they are acceptable.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by Penguin68 February 13, 11:50AM

be operating off some guidelines which suggest they are acceptable. These would be the guidelines which suggest that they should happily ignore the needs or wishes of residents. The apparat are always right, we are always wrong. Live with it. It turns out our 'representatives' represent Tooley St. - their job is to tell us why the apparat is right.

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by miwg83 February 13, 11:55AM

To quote - they are acting on the "Institute of Lighting Professionals guidance on light pollution".

In my opinion it feels like car headlamps are pointed right at my windows!

messageRe: New LED streetlamps, Underhill Rd - too bright and white
Posted by first mate February 13, 01:04PM

Oh well, that's okay then. Clearly those numbers who are complaining that the lighting is way too bright need to try much harder to adjust their perceptions so they align with council policy and guidelines.

Penguin68 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> be operating off some guidelines which suggest
> they are acceptable. These would be the guidelines
> which suggest that they should happily ignore the
> needs or wishes of residents. The apparat are
> always right, we are always wrong. Live with it.
> It turns out our 'representatives' represent
> Tooley St. - their job is to tell us why the
> apparat is right.

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