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messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by first mate February 24, 08:46AM

This is the dilemma. We all want healthier streets with less pollution but the demands of getting kids to school, looking after elderly or sick relatives and myriad ‘ essential’ journeys weighted against increasingly crazy working hours and demands on time, mean car journeys may also be essential. It’s not people being lazy or indifferent. However, those on the more extreme end of council thinking will not be swayed or engage in the complexities. It is all black and white thinking and solutions. One of the S’wark cycling reps even suggested that unless you can cycle to work ( presumably that also involves school runs) then you had no business living round here and should move!

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by exdulwicher February 24, 09:37AM

first mate Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> This is the dilemma. We all want healthier streets
> with less pollution but the demands of getting
> kids to school, looking after elderly or sick
> relatives and myriad ‘ essential’ journeys
> weighted against increasingly crazy working hours
> and demands on time, mean car journeys may also be
> essential. It’s not people being lazy or
> indifferent. However, those on the more extreme
> end of council thinking will not be swayed or
> engage in the complexities. It is all black and
> white thinking and solutions. One of the S’wark
> cycling reps even suggested that unless you can
> cycle to work ( presumably that also involves
> school runs) then you had no business living round
> here and should move!

And so we return to the original point of the thread. People ARE both fundamentally lazy and creatures of habit - they will take the easiet option presented to them and do "what they've always done". Much of that is down to the infrastructure they're given.
If you provide every house with a driveway, lots of free parking everywhere and big roads, more people will drive.
If you provide lots of good quality cycle infrastructure, secure cycle parking and make it more difficult to use a car, more people will cycle
If you pedestrianise a high street, people will (obviously) walk.

So if Southwark can come up with an area-wide plan (rather than a street here, a junction there) that promotes walking and cycling and public transport and demotes car-driving then people will (eventually) gravitate towards the easier options.

The trick is making it equal to all. Not everyone can walk or cycle for every journey. Equally, not everyone can drive a car (or not everyone owns a car) for every journey. So if you promote mass car usage, you're depriving non drivers (or non car owners) of mobility. If you promote walking everywhere then you're obviously depriving people who need to drive (deliveries, people going long distance). There's a happy balance in the middle where the shorter journeys are predominantly done by active travel / public transport and the longer journeys mostly by public transport / car.

Years of "encouragement" and a few token efforts like painting a bit of cycle lane alongside an A-road and then wondering why cyclists don't use it have done nothing to move away from entrenched car use. Engineeer the environment to promote more sustainable travel and it happens.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by Rockets February 24, 10:48AM

Can't agree more - progress will only be made when planning policies are cognisant of every road user and every catalyst for the challenges the area faces. Unfortunately the council doesn't see it this way and is focusing solely on the car and car users as the problem - (Lambeth tried the same with Loughborough and it backfired massively and cost the tax payer a fortune to fix the issues - but of course because Labour has a huge majority in Lambeth there was no accountability).

It is far more nuanced and complicated than that and Southwark's heavy-handed approach ultimately benefits no-one (except for maybe the vocal few on a few streets who now benefit from the council's plans).

I did laugh when a poster wrote on here that they were fed-up with coaches and cars dropping kids off around the Townley Road area and will be glad when they are gone - therein lies the issue - there is so little empathy for anyone else's life nowadays: as long as you are alright Jack then everything is good - sod everyone else! We saw it with the CPZ and the vocal few who were championed by the council and used as nothing more than a trojan horse to get the plans through.

The council's approach to planning is lazy and motivated by political views that the car is evil (and a healthy dose of wealth and car ownership is evil too) and they will love the fact (if they even bother reading what people in the area actually think anymore) the debate on here turned into one about the private schools rather than the fact that they are trying to close off a huge part of our local community to through traffic that will cause huge issues elsewhere.

I am saddened when I read things like Cllr McCash's musings on private schools where an elected official can only see the world through his own politically motivated eyes and everything is black and white, good versus evil and there can never be anything more balanced or pragmatic. When you start to review all of the local council's decisions through that looking glass you then start to see what is going on here....."leafy" Dulwich is a bit of an irritation to them.....

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by rahrahrah February 24, 10:48AM

^this ... edtied to say, not that, the one above it winking smiley



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was february 24, 04:51pm by rahrahrah.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by EPB February 24, 11:39AM

What oft was thought, but ne’er so well express’d

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by JEG1 February 24, 01:57PM

slarti b Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> EDBoy Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> I moved in 30 years ago, partly for the local
> schools which, at that time, were smaller and had
> many local pupils. Since then they have have
> expanded massively and, in the case of the
> foundation schools vastly increased their
> catchment areas and the proportion of parents
> driving their kids to school. Even now Alleyns
> want to expand their lower school further.
>
> At the same time as increasing
> pollution,congestion and stress on local streets,
> the foundation schools presume to lecture us on
> measures we locals residents should take. Total
> hypocrisy.

If you moved here 30 years ago for the local schools, then you will remember that the local state schools, Kingsdale and William Penn were 'failing' and massively undersubscribed. None of the Dulwich parents seemed to want to send their children there. Kingsdale closed down for a while, as did William Penn, which reopened as Dulwich High, which didn't do any better. As a result, a lot of the local children from the Hamlet went to Alleyn's, JAGS or DC. The fees were a lot more affordable in those days and the Assisted place scheme was also on offer for less well-off families. The Foundation schools were a lot less competitive than they are today. In addition, we didn't have the schools shortage crisis 30 years ago that we have today because of the rising population. It's a very different situation. Today, the area thankfully has Ofsted 'outstanding' state schools, and everyone is fighting to get into them, paying a fortune to buy or rent houses within their catchment areas. Therefore, fewer of the local children are applying to the local private schools. And of course there are more cars on the road than there were 30 years ago. The dire 37 bus service hasn't changed though!

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by kr988 February 24, 03:04PM

And it’s likely to get worse with more traffic backed up on East Dulwich Grove if Townley and Carlton are blocked off to traffic. Sure this will make cycling more dangerous and bus travel more difficult on EDG. I don’t see the logic ?

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by handh February 24, 04:31PM

Just skimmed the evidence pack which is worth a read. The volume of traffic going through the area at school open and closing times is truly shocking. Are we poisoning our kids? It feels that way.

So I'm ready to support the timed "School Street" restrictions on Dulwich Village and Townley Road.

Not so sure about the permanent closure on Calton Avenue and Court Lane when a timed restriction might be enough, that feels like it's a different issue and I'd like to understand the case better.

It's difficult and there are risks. But as I walk from East Dulwich Grove down through the Village and see traffic backed up in all directions at every junction, doing nothing just doesn't feel like an option.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by rupert james February 24, 04:34PM

One of the reasons that EDG is backed up is because they closed Champion Hill.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by Rockets February 24, 05:53PM

Exactly....the traffic will go somewhere it always does...anyone noticed how the traffic is particularly bad today? It's because there are a load of roadworks that have been thrown up as the council spend their remaining FY19 budget before year end and everyone is trying to find a route around the worst of it. That's our world if these plans go ahead.

When I look at the plan I wonder how anyone coming from Brixton area is supposed to get across to the upper part of Lordship Lane - they may normally use Townley or Court Lane. Would they then be expected to drive along EDG, turn left onto Lordship Lane, then around the Goose Green roundabout and back along Lordship Lane?

Yes something has to be done but closing a large chunk of the borough to through traffic is not the answer - it will make matters a lot worse for anyone outside of that one area.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by EDBoy February 25, 04:33PM

Some of this thread is really quite interesting and there are some decent suggestions and caveats to Healthy Streets - Dulwich Phase 3. Slarti, I don't live in the Northern part of Area B, but I do live nearby and fully understand what the mornings and evenings are like in term time. Unlike you, I don't cycle through Dulwich Village most mornings but when I used to cycle to work, I would usually try to avoid main roads and rat-runs wherever possible. However, at 5:00am there really wasn't much traffic about. With regard to lecturing, I'm not sure about the foundation schools, but there seems does plenty of it on this forum. JEG1, just to confirm, I've only lived here 20 years, I was quoting Slarti. I understand the need for change, but as other posters have said, closing local roads to traffic is not the answer and will move the problem elsewhere. One of the main reasons that there is a CPZ in Herne Hill/North Dulwich is because of the introduction of the Central London Congestion Charging Zone in 2003. Also, having read the Champion Hill Monitoring Study I was slightly underwhelmed by the summary observations of improvements in traffic volumes, pollution levels and cycle movements, but what stood out was the quote regarding noticeable traffic increases on Camberwell Grove and East Dulwich Grove not having any link to the trial scheme. Therefore, getting back on thread, hopefully a few of you will be able to attend, if you haven't already, either the Herne Hill Baptist Church this Sat, 9:00am to 12pm, or Wed 4th March, 6:30pm to 9pm at JAGS to convey most of the ideas and concerns on this thread.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by wulfhound February 25, 05:01PM

Quote:
When I look at the plan I wonder how anyone coming from Brixton area is supposed to get across to the upper part of Lordship Lane - they may normally use Townley or Court Lane. Would they then be expected to drive along EDG, turn left onto Lordship Lane, then around the Goose Green roundabout and back along Lordship Lane?

Over Tulse Hill and along the South Circular seems pretty direct? Slow across the Common at rush hour, granted, but I'm not sure it'd be that much slower than any other way.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by Rockets February 26, 03:12PM

Which by my reckoning would add at least an additional 1.5 miles to a 3 mile journey...so a 50% increase in pollution by an increased journey length. Then factor in the number of additional cars also making that journey because of the closure of DV to through-traffic (remember the council reckons there are 7000 cars going through there a day) and the A205 and other roads become more choked with traffic and so the cars spend more time in high pollution idling mode stuck in traffic....

Do you see the issue here....the problem here is Nimbyism....all the council is going to do is move the problem from one area to another and create more problems than there were originally...?

And some may say that people will stop using their cars...well maybe 10% might but even then there's still a lot of through traffic to contend with elsewhere (6,000+ a day) and by looking at the council's own numbers a tiny number of cycles use that junction despite the alterations made to it which may suggest that it isn't a route cyclists want or need to take.

Just speak to anyone in Lambeth who lived through the Loughborough Junction debacle for a real-life case-study of what will happen. The impact was so catastrophic (in terms of congestion and pollution) to the surrounding areas that Lambeth had to reverse their plans.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by exdulwicher February 26, 03:41PM

Rockets Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Which by my reckoning would add at least an
> additional 1.5 miles to a 3 mile journey...so a
> 50% increase in pollution by an increased journey
> length. Then factor in the number of additional
> cars also making that journey because of the
> closure of DV to through-traffic (remember the
> council reckons there are 7000 cars going through
> there a day) and the A205 and other roads become
> more choked with traffic and so the cars spend
> more time in high pollution idling mode stuck in
> traffic....
>

Brixton Station to Grove Tavern (upper end of Lordship Lane, as suggested). You can do this yourself on Google Mpas, picking and choosing start/finish points to test it. Croxted Road, left onto South Circular and left onto LL. 3 miles, currently showing at 16 mins by car.

The alternative route suggested is Half Moon Lane, DV, Court Lane: that's 2.8 miles and 17 mins (as at time of testing which is 3.30pm Wednesday so near school finishing time). Maybe that'd change by a few minutes either side if you tried it on a weekend.

Basically there's nothing in it - it's already quicker to go via the South Circular.

You can test this out on all sorts of start/finish points and modes of transport - Google Maps allows you to look at cycling, walking, car or public transport.

You'd hope that the council have learned some lessons from the Loughborough Junction issues (trying to do things single junction by single junction being the main one) so the area-wide plan seems pretty reasonable. The fact that all their consultation and a lot of the modelling work / figures / data is on their website suggests that there's a robust assurance framework in place for it.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by Rockets February 26, 04:48PM

If such journeys are quicker by the south circular then why do 7,000 cars use DV every day - they're not all private school journeys as many on here would like to believe? (And my analysis was based on the suggestion that going via Tulse Hill was an option).

Loughborough Junction was not junction by junction - it was an area-wide closure of roads and access very similar to what Southwark is proposing for DV - Lambeth went through the same process, presented the same regurgitated facts about pollution and healthy streets, went through a consultation period that ignored the input of pretty much everyone, implemented it on a set date and sat back as utter chaos followed. After it was implemented they ignored the pleas of local residents both inside and outside the car-free area who said it wasn't working, they even ignored the pleas of the ambulance service who said the gridlock it was causing in the surrounding streets was putting lives at risk. Lambeth finally relented when Kate Hoey had to intervene (it is telling that they only listened to one of their political comrades!).

Any rational person could look at these proposals and see that the impact is going to be huge and that the problem isn't being dealt with, it's just being moved somewhere else. Hurrah for those in the area, bad luck for anyone outside it.

BTW does anyone know what work is being done at the DV/Court Lane junction at the moment that is causing the big tailbacks into and out of the village?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was february 26, 04:51pm by Rockets.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by EDBoy February 26, 07:09PM

And this is the problem with the whole, 'Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3 - Have you say on our draft proposals'.

Ruskin Walk, a road that runs between Half Moon Lane and Herne Hill is set to become one-way, uphill only, with the addition of speed humps, from next week. No consultation and with very limited resident participation, unless you were a resident of Ruskin Walk. I think the council are learning just fine, and will continue to divide areas around here, road by road, junction by junction, CPZ by CPZ...

I have attached an email comment from Margy Newens below:

The proposals for Ruskin Walk come out of a report that was compiled about 2 years ago (before we were councillors) including a certain amount of data on traffic flow, and the responses to it. The idea now is to run a trial. A different route would have been to hold a full consultation, but for a small project like this, it seemed just as worthwhile to go ahead with a trial.

It is possible that it will increase the volume of traffic coming down Hollingbourne Road into Warmington Road and Howletts. This will be carefully monitored with the possibility of banning a turn into Hollingbourne Road from Herne Hill if it becomes a problem. The Highways officers felt that it was not necessary to include the no-turn in the trial.

Lambeth and Southwark are certainly talking to each other about their respective plans (Lambeth is looking at a very much wider area across most of Brixton and nearly as far as Herne Hill). Lewisham is also planning a large liveable neighbourhood and there are other projects across London. Birmingham is looking at closing the city centre to private motor vehicles altogether and, indeed, this replicates similar measures in a number of European cities. In all cases the over-riding ambition is to reduce reliance on private motor vehicles, encouraging and enabling people of all ages and abilities to safely choose more sustainable ways of getting about, and creating pleasanter neighbourhoods and public spaces that are not permanently choked with traffic. Accepting that some of our citizens have restriction on their mobility, reduced traffic volumes will make it easier for those who need to rely on their cars too.

Whilst the Ruskin Walk project has been motivated primarily by residents’ desire to address practical safety concerns, the wider picture is very much about creating a healthier environment - tackling air pollution which is now increasingly being recognised as the public health crisis that it is, addressing the obesity epidemic and multiple other health impacts of low physical activity, and dealing with the climate emergency. It is true that no scheme is likely to be perfect but the least perfect path is to do nothing.

I would be very happy to discuss the details of the Dulwich Healthy Streets proposals if that would be helpful. Either way, we are encouraging residents to attend the engagement meetings where they can here about the proposals and ask questions.

Feedback welcome.

Warm regards

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by slarti b February 27, 09:24AM

Rockets Wrote:

> BTW does anyone know what work is being done at
> the DV/Court Lane junction at the moment that is
> causing the big tailbacks into and out of the
> village?

I had a look last night. It is SGN, ie gas network people. They had bore some large holes ( 50 cm daimter?) in teh road. Looking for leaks perhaps?

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by rahrahrah February 27, 10:13AM

The bottom line is that we have to start providing people with better alternatives to the car. Even if it's a bit painful in the short term. It's simply not sustainable to have so much public space given over to motor vehicles. We need to encourage more walking, cycling and invest in public transport (I do worry that this last bit is not getting enough attention).

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by rupert james February 27, 10:19AM

I just spent 35 minutes waiting for a non existent P13 in the rain and sleet and with 8 other people mostly OAP's

Gave up and came home.

I have not been able to do what I had to do by bus. Wont happen again I will use my car.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was february 27, 10:27am by rupert james.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by Metallic February 27, 11:30AM

I think the councillors for Dulwich Village Ward might just Exclaimation have mentioned this Ruskin Walk plan when they were meeting people who actually live in the Ward and who are facing turmoil if the OHS is implemented without a trial - not a word about it, even to Holmdene residents who are mostly impacted.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by Melihoople February 27, 04:50PM

P13 Is a route of the devil... There needs to be much better public transport. It's no good ignoring this.

rupert james Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just spent 35 minutes waiting for a non existent
> P13 in the rain and sleet and with 8 other people
> mostly OAP's
>
> Gave up and came home.
>
> I have not been able to do what I had to do by
> bus. Wont happen again I will use my car.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by exdulwicher February 27, 05:07PM

rupert james Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I just spent 35 minutes waiting for a non existent
> P13 in the rain and sleet and with 8 other people
> mostly OAP's
>
> Gave up and came home.
>
> I have not been able to do what I had to do by
> bus. Wont happen again I will use my car.

TfL's website and app both have live bus info.
There's a good app called Bus Times London which is all London buses, all stop info, departures, live tracking and even little maps and arrows to show you which side of the road to go to. It's by a company called MapWay who do global transport apps for bus, metro, subway etc.

My Mum uses it all the time - as a lone elderly woman she doesn't want to be waiting round ages. She knows exactly how long it takes her to walk to the 4 bus stops within easy distance of her house, so she just looks at the app, works out how long she's got and sets off. If the bus is late/cancelled for whatever reason, it'll show up and she's not wasting time at a stop in the cold and rain. Don't think she's ever waited more than about 2 minutes since she started using that app!

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by alice February 27, 05:17PM

Why is TfL removing the digital timetable at bus stops? it was easy to use, removed the need of getting out your phone and fiddling with glasses etc and was accessible to all.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by exdulwicher February 27, 06:08PM

alice Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Why is TfL removing the digital timetable at bus
> stops? it was easy to use, removed the need of
> getting out your phone and fiddling with glasses
> etc and was accessible to all.

@alice : it's just refurbishment of the stops. There's a rolling programme of improvements, one of which is the introduction of better/more modern displays capable of showing more info.

They're also sadly rather prone to vandalism so there's ongoing work to put shatterproof screens around them along with better security (CCTV, help points etc) at bus stops.

They won't be gone permanently, TfL are NOT getting rid of them. Hope that helps.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by rupert james February 27, 06:30PM

Exdulwicher, Many people have asked on the forum are you a resident of East Dulwich and its surrounds but you have never answered.

You seem to have an agenda regarding all things motorised and are never short of the answer to people's postings.

If you do not reside in the area why do you find it necessary to keep replying and commenting on what is a local residents problem. If it does not affect you why do you keep commenting?

Its appears to me that you could be a plant.

Many people like me do not need a phone and the cost to put a man on the moon.

There are many people like me who do not need an APP to live perhaps the young should appreciate that.

Please let us know where you really live and why you find it necessary if you are not a local to keep posting?

If you do not live here how do you know what the daily problems are?

Not being rude just interested.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by Melihoople February 27, 07:11PM

It's an interesting response that highlights a lack of understanding about the route. Which isn't helpful at improving local public travel.

exdulwicher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> rupert james Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I just spent 35 minutes waiting for a non
> existent
> > P13 in the rain and sleet and with 8 other
> people
> > mostly OAP's
> >
> > Gave up and came home.
> >
> > I have not been able to do what I had to do by
> > bus. Wont happen again I will use my car.
>
> TfL's website and app both have live bus info.
> There's a good app called Bus Times London which
> is all London buses, all stop info, departures,
> live tracking and even little maps and arrows to
> show you which side of the road to go to. It's by
> a company called MapWay who do global transport
> apps for bus, metro, subway etc.
>
> My Mum uses it all the time - as a lone elderly
> woman she doesn't want to be waiting round ages.
> She knows exactly how long it takes her to walk to
> the 4 bus stops within easy distance of her house,
> so she just looks at the app, works out how long
> she's got and sets off. If the bus is
> late/cancelled for whatever reason, it'll show up
> and she's not wasting time at a stop in the cold
> and rain. Don't think she's ever waited more than
> about 2 minutes since she started using that app!

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by alice February 27, 07:22PM

My nearest excellent bus shelter has been replaced by a shiny new one without a digital timetable.
First create a problem then expect praise when it’s ‘solved’ - a bit like Healthy Streets

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by exdulwicher February 28, 10:03AM

rupert james Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Exdulwicher, Many people have asked on the forum
> are you a resident of East Dulwich and its
> surrounds but you have never answered.
>
> You seem to have an agenda regarding all things
> motorised and are never short of the answer to
> people's postings.
>
> If you do not reside in the area why do you find
> it necessary to keep replying and commenting on
> what is a local residents problem. If it does not
> affect you why do you keep commenting?
>
> Its appears to me that you could be a plant.
>
> Many people like me do not need a phone and the
> cost to put a man on the moon.
>
> There are many people like me who do not need an
> APP to live perhaps the young should appreciate
> that.
>
> Please let us know where you really live and why
> you find it necessary if you are not a local to
> keep posting?
>
> If you do not live here how do you know what the
> daily problems are?
>
> Not being rude just interested.

Rupert, good morning.

If you click on my name, you can view all my posts - you'll see I've been on this forum since 2015 although most of 2017/18 I wasn't very active at all on here.

Literally the only thing you have on me not living in Dulwich is the forum name. I'd have thought most of my posts on local matters actually show I have a very good knowledge and first-hand experience of the area? When I registered on here in 2015, I had moved away - EDF was a way of keeping in touch with what was going on in the area I grew up in, went to school in (Alleyn's if you're interested which I'm sure makes me a pariah in some circles!), lived in for a while after university, moved away from (but visited regularly), moved back to... For fairly obvious reasons I'm not going to give an address but it's Area B on the Healthy Streets plan.
I've lived here, travelled in/around/through the area by bicycle, car (the horror, I do own a car, it's not even ULEZ-compliant!), train and bus.

I post a fair bit on transport issues because it is literally my job (although not for Southwark). It's a topic that greatly interests me and I've seen / experienced plenty of the issues that Southwark / East Dulwich are proposing now done elsewhere (to varying degrees of success!) in the country and indeed in Europe.

I've never set out to offend anyone, I try and stick to transport facts and figures. Certainly not a plant either - I've been critical of Southwark Council at various times in the past on here.

Hope that's all OK and explains it?

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by kiera February 28, 12:24PM

exdulwicher - thank you for your most useful contribution to the forum. I find your posts very informative, so, regardless of where you live, I hope that you will continue to take the trouble to share your knowledge on here.

messageRe: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3
Posted by kr988 February 28, 05:35PM

Exdulwicher I think I would have a bit more respect for your preaching if you weren’t a car owner yourself , although at least you are honest .
Rupert it took my son almost an hour to get home from West Dulwich on the P4 and 37 due to the Village Roadworks which I fear is modelling for what will happen with if the proposals go through . I too will be forced to drive him if delays on public transport get worse due to the changes .

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