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messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Chuckd February 06, 01:20PM

When the incident happened to me I didn't deem it that serious and then read more about other incidents on here. At that point I made an online report of the incident on the Met website as I believe other people have.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by binkylilyput February 06, 01:49PM

Shivering swan1 this man is clearly a risk to others and all are in agreement that the police should be involved but your language is offensive, as is questioning why he hasn't been assaulted

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by ianr February 06, 02:31PM

If anyone does have cause to call 999, I think I'd make a point of mentioning, not just the immediate act that triggered the call, but also, if appropriate, the fact that the person matches the description of the perpetrator of number of other instances of spontaneous 'random' threatening behaviour or assault in the area over the past week.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was february 06, 02:34pm by ianr.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by contented sow February 06, 03:14PM

I dialled 999 on Sunday morning when he pushed my friend in PR park and I witnessed him attacking others. I couldn’t stay but was told police were there looking for him. I don’t know the outcome (hence creating this thread) so I very much hope they’re aware there is serious concern.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by apmuso February 06, 04:23PM

Just seen this guy walking up Greendale towards JAGS. Clearly not well. Being aggressive with anyone who makes eye contact. Flagged a police car down and gave them his description and whereabouts.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Penguin68 February 06, 04:54PM

All the descriptions here suggest the man is displaying clear signs of psychotic behaviour - the police are neither trained nor resourced to act as psychiatrists - all they can do is to lock him up, and we know that this is frequently a precursor to self-harm, or worse, injury caused by police attempts to restrain someone not criminal but mad. Ideally he should probably be sectioned and hospitalised, but there are woeful shortages of acute beds. The waiting list for tertiary (hospital) psychiatric care is many months if not longer. It may be that he has medication but is refusing to take it - and people cannot be obliged or compelled to take medicine unless sectioned. This is a problem which is not simply soluble by dialling '999'. Anything the police can do will only be very short term. And probably pretty useless (other than protecting individuals currently at risk).

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Blah Blah February 06, 06:00PM

I disagree penguin. If he is displaying psychotic behaviour, a Police psychiatrist will section him. Then medical professionals will assess the risk, esp if he is not taking his medication, and go from there.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by roywj February 06, 06:54PM

Throwing hot coffee in a woman’s face and throwing an elderly man to the floor is a criminal offence and Police should intervene.

Agree with blah blah, Police will be able to get him support if required. Talk on here about mental health issues is just speculation. Unfortunately he seems to be targeting more vulnerable people in our community and I hope he gets picked up soon.


Penguin68 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All the descriptions here suggest the man is
> displaying clear signs of psychotic behaviour -
> the police are neither trained nor resourced to
> act as psychiatrists - all they can do is to lock
> him up, and we know that this is frequently a
> precursor to self-harm, or worse, injury caused by
> police attempts to restrain someone not criminal
> but mad. Ideally he should probably be sectioned
> and hospitalised, but there are woeful shortages
> of acute beds. The waiting list for tertiary
> (hospital) psychiatric care is many months if not
> longer. It may be that he has medication but is
> refusing to take it - and people cannot be obliged
> or compelled to take medicine unless sectioned.
> This is a problem which is not simply soluble by
> dialling '999'. Anything the police can do will
> only be very short term. And probably pretty
> useless (other than protecting individuals
> currently at risk).

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by dimples February 06, 11:37PM

I went to Peckham rye park this afternoon with my dog and there was a policeman stationed in the park for the whole hour I was there . He was stationary on a bike and I wondered what he was looking out for ?!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was february 06, 11:39pm by dimples.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Penguin68 February 07, 12:14AM

If he is displaying psychotic behaviour, a Police psychiatrist will section him. Then medical professionals will assess the risk, esp if he is not taking his medication, and go from there.

You are making assumptions that doctors (you need two) are available to section him, and that there is space in a medium secure unit for him to be housed (his behaviour is clearly aggressive and simply putting him on a general psychiatric ward may well not be suitable). Frequently the only space - at least short term - where someone displaying psychotic behaviour to be held is a police cell, and the police are neither trained, nor are police cells suitable, for this. What you are describing is an ideal - I do know that waiting times for patients with mental problems which require psychiatric intervention are bad and getting worse.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by roywj February 07, 07:37AM

So what are you suggesting? People should not bother calling the Police in case it's due to mental health issues?


Penguin68 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If he is displaying psychotic behaviour, a Police
> psychiatrist will section him. Then medical
> professionals will assess the risk, esp if he is
> not taking his medication, and go from there.
>
> You are making assumptions that doctors (you need
> two) are available to section him, and that there
> is space in a medium secure unit for him to be
> housed (his behaviour is clearly aggressive and
> simply putting him on a general psychiatric ward
> may well not be suitable). Frequently the only
> space - at least short term - where someone
> displaying psychotic behaviour to be held is a
> police cell, and the police are neither trained,
> nor are police cells suitable, for this. What you
> are describing is an ideal - I do know that
> waiting times for patients with mental problems
> which require psychiatric intervention are bad and
> getting worse.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Dexters Mum February 07, 08:37AM

I spoke to 2 police officers on Wednesday who were telling me 6 officers had spend 3 hours restraining a 21 yr old male mental health patient at KCH, they had arrested him 3 days prior where he was put into the Maudsley and released. Police are stretched beyond need, mental health services are stretched beyond need and these situations are only going to become more frequent.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Blah Blah February 07, 09:49AM

If he commits assault (as he already has) and is arrested and charged, a court could detain him under the mental health act and send him to a secure unit. The Maudsley is a hospital, not a secure unit. SO I suspect if the aggressive behaviour continues, that is where he will end up.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Penguin68 February 07, 09:53AM

So what are you suggesting? People should not bother calling the Police in case it's due to mental health issues?

No, of course not, but what I am saying is that 'calling the police' does not simply solve the problem, except in terms of short term safety for the public. 'Calling the police' where a mentally ill patient is concerned, as it appears may be the case here, is the start of a long and difficult process - and one the police are ill equipped and resourced to deliver. '999' in and of itself is not a solution (as it may be for the simply criminal). Police are about dealing with crime, not mental health issues save where immediate safety (of the public or the mentally ill person) is concerned.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Blah Blah February 07, 10:07AM

Penguin, the only way to get someone who is a danger to the public off the street is through the Police and courts into a secure mental health unit. So calling the Police is absolutely the right thing to do. And just to add that sectioning and detention are different things. Staff at any hospital will also call Police if a patient is threatening them. Only secure units are designed to treat people detained via the MHA.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was february 07, 10:11am by Blah Blah.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by cw_1984 February 07, 10:36AM

I have seen this guy three times in the last week-10 days between the Tesco on East Dulwich Road and Greendale/East Dulwich Grove.

I recognised him as someone suffering from mental health/drug issues immediately having had experience around people who suffer from this. I knew it was the same guy as he had the same jacket each time and the same walk. The first two times I was walking and he locked eyes with me and may have mumbled something but i'm quite a big guy and keep myself to myself so he never approached me. The third time I was driving and he was swinging his arms and kept looking behind himself as he approached Lordship Lane.

We have small children and have to walk down Greendale and my partner has to walk home down there when it is now dark as early as 5pm so I hope that the situation is being properly monitored. Is there we can do to anything we can do to help/inform the local Police? He is clearly doing the same route (Greendale - Peckham Rye Park up EDG/EDR)if that helps them.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Penguin68 February 07, 11:21AM

Penguin, the only way to get someone who is a danger to the public off the street is through the Police and courts into a secure mental health unit.

This is simply not true. Within my own extended family one individual was sectioned at the behest and instigation of his parents - the police were not directly involved, and certainly not the courts. A patient presenting to a doctor and not prepared to accept treatment may, again, be sectioned if the doctor (with a colleague) believes that is in his or her best interests. Of course, when an individual is acting in a threatening manner, or attacking people, the police can be called and will act to their best capabilities, but they are not properly trained or resourced to be an NHS outreach service.

'Sectioning' an individual is something that happens instead of a court being involved.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by KidKruger February 07, 11:39AM

Yeah a mate of mine was sectioned twice.
No police, no courts.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by binkylilyput February 07, 11:50AM

Both are correct. A person can be sectioned under the MHA with or without police involvement.

If a person is in public and/ or behaving in a manner that suggests mental health difficulties and risks the police will be involved in order to securely take the person to a designated 136 assessment suite where they can be assessed by mental health professionals.

I hope he has now been found

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Bishberro February 07, 12:31PM

This man clearly has mental health issues but he needs to be arrested and taken off the streets before he severely injures someone. It is a police issue primarily because he's walking around committing crimes - attacking people and kids, throwing coffee in people's faces and it looks potentially like the same person who sexually assaulted a young woman at 2.30pm on East Dulwich Grove. I have an 11-year-old who goes to school around this area and I'm worried as he wouldn't necessarily know how to react if approached by this man and I've had to warn him about this. Does anyone know if he has been caught?

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by hpsaucey February 07, 03:39PM

A call to 999 could request an ambulance and police who would also attend anyway in this situation. Whatever happens after given how overrun services are - that"s something none of us can tell.


HP

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Blah Blah February 08, 12:24AM

Police are the go to when someone is endangering others. Who else does anyone expect to apprehend and detain this man? Expecting paramedics to deal with someone who may already have committed assault on numerous occasions and of various kinds, is unreasonable. They have no power of arrest.

message.
Posted by TreacleRabbit February 08, 07:39AM

.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was february 08, 02:31pm by TreacleRabbit.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by JohnL February 12, 03:00PM

[www.southwarknews.co.uk]

"A spokesperson from the Met’s central press office declined to comment on the reported incidents, saying that it could not “waste time” looking into “non-serious” crimes that did not involve “terror attacks or murders” for this publication."



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit was february 12, 03:02pm by JohnL.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Sue February 12, 05:24PM

JohnL Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> [www.southwarknews.co.uk]
> eries-of-attacks-and-threatening-behaviour-toward-
> women-and-toddlers-in-peckham-rye-park-and-east-du
> lwich/
>
> "A spokesperson from the Met’s central press
> office declined to comment on the reported
> incidents, saying that it could not “waste time”
> looking into “non-serious” crimes that did not
> involve “terror attacks or murders” for this
> publication."


So the police are going to wait until this person commits a "serious" crime?

That's reassuring. Not.

Or maybe they need to get a new spokesperson .....

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by RichH February 12, 05:58PM

Sue Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So the police are going to wait until this person
> commits a "serious" crime?
>
> That's reassuring. Not.
>
> Or maybe they need to get a new spokesperson .....

Not quite. I read it as the Met Police *Press Office* saying that they don't have the time to help a local paper with a local story about local and relatively minor offences as they have bigger fish to fry. Not the *Police* saying they don't have time to investigate the issue.

But, yes, their Press Office might have phrased their response more tactfully.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Sue February 12, 09:05PM

Ah, OK, sorry, I misunderstood.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by Poplett84 February 19, 10:43AM

I saw this man (fitting the description mentioned) last night at around 8pm at the Croxted Road / Gipsy Road roundabout. He was walking behind a woman shouting obscenities at her and then proceeded to run after our running group!

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by KidKruger February 19, 03:07PM

Again, as I asked on 4/2/20, "Is this guy of quite slight build ?".
Apols if I've missed some detail above.

messageRe: Aggressive man - Peckham rye park
Posted by cactus February 19, 05:57PM

Dexters Mum Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> need to get a photo to give to police but too
> nervous to risk getting attacked. KidKruger yes he
> is of slight build

KidKruger, confirmed by this person.

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