Food shops / restaurants / Gastro Pub / Deli / Kitchenware / Off-License

[Tom]

Am I alone in noticing the increasing girth of ED residents?

Are we all completely food obsessed?

I must admit my waist has increased by 3" since I moved here 1 yr ago... maybe we need to sell Dulwich eating to a wider London market?? Gastro capital of London?

Those poor souls in the village must be feeling terribly left our with all these lovely shops which put theirs to shame!

[dulwichmum]

Are you implying that East Dulwich is populated by a crowd of fattypuffs?

[Michael Palaeologus]

Thats me - down with the Thinifers!!

[Tom]

Fattypuffs no, but the once gym honed, buff young things of Clapham would apprear to be setting into their middle years quite well.

[dulwichmum]

Dear Tom,

Speak for yourself! I am physically perfect (at the moment) - although I plan to re-kindle my relationship with Sainsbury's triple chocolate ('chocolate bottoms' I prefer to call them) cookies as soon as I have my gall stones zapped.

[Guest]

East Dulwich still isnt a touch on the village area.. The look and feel of Dulwich Village are quite unique for south-east London, and the historic connections with Surrey and the countryside all make it such a special place to be in or visit. East Dulwich has lost it's working class lively atmosphere, it's only real positive attribute, to be replaced by bland gastro pubs and expensive eateries, whilst still looking like a typical inner London, victorian, suburban development.. There really isnt any comparison..

[Guest]

Hee Hee..

Aside from the novel fact that it looks a bit like Trumpton, 'the village' is actually just a bit dull.

'Working class lively atmosphere'.. bless 'em! Those good-old working class folk sure know how to have a good-old, working-class time!

[Guest]

"bless 'em! Those good-old working class folk sure know how to have a good-old, working-class time!"

Yes they do, and many of the pubs had traditional sing songs around the piano, and laughing and crying late into the night, everyone knew each other and had no issue with speaking their mind... I would say compared to the recent influx of people, who seem to enjoy generic pursuits like visiting caffe nero or having half a continental lager in a gastro bar, the term "fun" takes on a different meaning... I loved the down to earth crowd in ED as a kid I can remember my mother talking to all sorts of local characters, the likes of which no longer seem to exist, as everyone appears the same... As for the village being dull, well I would say the Picture Gallery, the old workmens cottages, the charles dickens house and the surrounding fields and parks all add together to make it a very unique place... full of atmosphere which was once strikingly different to ED... but which now rather blandly fuses into the nearby areas, making it all seem a bit the same and dull..

[dulwichmum]

Dear Louisa,

I know a little about the Village and I think you are being rather harsh. East Dulwich is a cosmopolitan and lively townlet. I don't remember it being 'lively' when it was more working class. There was a 7/11, The Lord Palmerston, Walshes the Glaziers, and lots and lots boarded up shops and tumble weed blowing down the street!

Dulwich Village has a selection of estate agents (4), branches of Pizza Express and Bella Pasta (or whatever they call it now) a branch of the Dulwich Trader, a branch of Question Air, and a branch of Sheppards - and is probably as typical as any other upmarket London village. I love the Village (SE21 is my home), but I love East Dulwich too. It has real character (as has the Village), and it is a lively alternative to its more sedate neighbour.:)

[Guest]

Can I borrow your rose-tinted specs, Louisa? They look like fun!

I wouldn't be so rude as to ask you age, but I would suggest (on a conciliatory note) that perhaps this might be where the disagreement lies. Traditional sing-songs round the old 'joanna' seem to have slipped in popularity since they did away with gas lighting and rickets.

[Guest]

Obviously working class areas are quite bland and dull until higher earning individuals move into the area and spread their magic by turning grotty pubs into wonderful expensive eateries with sophisticated lagers, void of any atmosphere or personality.. amongst other things...

Yes Dulwich Village does have chain shops, as does every high street or town centre, but it also has a wealth of historic cultural alternatives which set it apart from most other inner London areas south of the river.. ED has retained some of it's character, but I would disagree that the new comers have magically transformed a dull working class area into a wonderful cosmopolitan place, it has been this way long before the awful boutiques or gastro eateries arrived..

[Keef]

Yeah, and I think that's genuinely a pity! Sing songs are fun... I'm only 28 by the way :)-D

[Guest]

Bob, you obviously didnt frequent such places locally, because I can remember pubs right up until the mid 1990's in the ED area which had traditional sing songs!

[dulwichmum]

I wonder when exactly it was that these lovely singing locals were congregating around these piano's? I remember the old Lord Palmerston, and it is vastly improved, as has The Forresters Arms, and the EDT. I also remember a local from East Dulwich telling me about twenty years ago, that the Old St Francis Hospital (near East Dulwich train station, pulled down now) used to be a work house. I think that things have undeniably improved for East Dulwich.

[Guest]

The Lord Palmerston had all sorts of wonderful loca characters, many of which have sadly passed over.. And was once full with people having a good sing song on a Friday or Saturday night, standing at the bar nestling a pint.. It is now half empty most of the time, with everyone huddled around tables with little interaction or social mixing.. That is a serious problem I think... The oppurtunity to mix and have a laugh have been restricted by these gastly gastro venues, which no doubt want to ban everything under the sun and offer food with everything.. I am sorry DulwichMum but I have to strongly disagree ED is a better place, I think it has changed for the worse in some respects..

[Tom]

Just so I don't make a mistake, what makes an area cosmopolitan?

I was under the impression a 'cosmopolitan' area reflected all cultures, countries and people. In this respect, I would like to sugest that East dulwich reflects a very wide range of British, European and Global cultures and societies (or levels of society).

In addition, an area which has boutiques that sell product sourced globally, gastro pubs that serve global as well as British food and residents who are open minded and well read / travelled (regardless of social status) would have a claim to be cosmopolitan. When I lived in ED as a student about 15 yrs ago, I can promise you it was not cosmopolitan. In fact it was a depressing a*hole, in parts populated by whores & drug dealers. ED of today is a marked improvement in terms of facilities, enviroment, housing, transport and entertainment. Hence the reason many people wish to move here and bring children up here.

The village is lovely to drive through, but have you eaten there recently? Sorry, but they are falling behind. Piaf is awful, Beauberry is ok, but not exactly superb, and the chains - well, they are italplastic.

[Guest]

Louisa your getting me all dewy eyed! Please let me know when the next sing song down the Dog is. "Oh knees up Muvva Bwown, knees up Muvva Bwown.........She'll be cumin wound the mountain when she comes! She'll be cumin wound the mountain........" Come on everybody join in!

[Guest]

The regardless of social class comment clearly is the point being missed by those arguing that ED is a much better place.. The new comers to the area are from a certain income or social class, however you wish to catergorize it, and I believe they often overlook the rich cultural heritage which was already resident in ED long before they arrived.. ED has been cosmopolitan for as long as I can remember, and trust me I am quite old.. The Italian and Turkish communities have been resident since the 1930's in the local area, and the Black and Asian communities have also been here since about the 1950's onwards.. This rather odd claim that certain types of people have attracted cultural diversity and better social conditions is rather patronising and vague in it's detail.. There really isnt any evidence to prove that this area is better now than it was, and those who claim it is are often people who come from a certain income bracket and refuse to put themselves in the shoes of people who come from a less wealthy background... I am not saying that this area is completely in dire straits as a result of new people moving here, but I would certainly argue that ED has lost much of it's cultural past and working class charm, which did exist and I am sure others can vouch for this, 20 or 30 years ago..

[Keef]

Tom I can garuntee you that there are still plenty of drug dealers in Dulwich... They just wear suits these days! >:D<

I remember there being a piano in the CPT when I was little and my dad took us there on Sundays (yeah I've really moved on inlife I know), but was too young to really remember anyone playing it..... These days we just bring guitars! B)

[dulwichmum]

Dear Louisa,

I genuinely value your point of view, but in seriousness, I used to drink in The Lord Palmerston about twenty years ago when I was a student. I even spent several New Years Eve's there, as my friend Sarah used to love it. It was always empty, and there was never anyone playing a musical instrument. There was plenty of evidence that LL had once been a thriving retail area, but it was a ghost town then. I think that it has improved hugely from then. We have all changed. My husband would not have recognised me in my student attire with a pint glass in my hand (please don't tell him, he thinks I have always been a 'lady' and preferred white wine). We all mature and change.

[Guest]

Spending time with 'working class' people (whatever they are these days) is no better guarantee of having a good time than with any other class - except the upper classes, of course, who are mostly there for 'laughing-at' value.

For every dull-as-dishwater Mercades-driving accountant droning-on about audit discrepancies, there's some salt-of-the-earth who traps you in the corner of the pub for half and hour telling you about different kinds creosote to use on fencing.

[mockney piers]

I for one completely agree with Louisa, East Dulwich has lost all sembalnce of any 'character' now that those home counties types have taken over with their mock estuary accents and their 2.4 cars clogging up the streets bordered by well tended gardens.

Once upon a time you could count on everybody having a good old sing song in the smog, chuckling about the latest cholera outbreak and drinking ourselves to death on cheap dutch gin. Bring back 'anging I say.

[Guest]

Hey Billy-Bob

I resent your dissing of accountants. We are special human beings.

We accountants bayonet the wounded after the battle is over...

So there

[Guest]

Michael,

Perhaps I should have been more positive: what I should have said was "For every life-and-soul Accountant telling the best joke you've ever heard, there's some salt-of-the-earth who tells you about the time he creosoted Jimmy Nesbitt's fence"

One love!

[dulwichmum]

Yes, before Mr Nesbitt cleared off to live in a capacious mansion in Herne Hill - having first secured places for his little ones in the Dulwich Village Infants from his old address.