Penguin68

seconded to help protest the NATO Summit in SE Wales Protect? - otherwise this seems to be taking active participation of the police against the interests of the coalition government just a step too far.

James - The leaflet ALSO says 'You will also be regietered to vote if you have received information at your current address telling you that you are registered under the new system.' My personally addressed letter makes it clear that (1) I am registered and (2) my request not to be on the open register is still being honoured. You need to read the letter addressed to you individually before reading the accompanying leaflet to ascertain your status.

The third paragraph says, "Your details are not on the open register."; however in the paragraph headed "The open register", the following is stated, "Your name and address will be included in the open register unless you ask for them to be removed." These are form letters, which include details of what happens if you are on the open register. The key thing here is that the letter generated confirms that you are not on that register, and will continue not to be on it unless you wish to change. Ideally the later paragraph should have read 'Your name and address will be included in the open register unless you ask (or have already asked) for them to be removed." But you can't expect perfect drafting anymore. Edited to say 'cross posted with above'.

Curiously, the under-class of which Louisa speaks is not in fact working class, but mainly 'not-working' class. In my experience working class people (i.e. those who earn their livings through manual and skilled trades rather than through office and non-manual work) take a pride in their appearance, behaviour and attitudes, and often form the backbone of any society, rather than attacking or undermining it. They are as likely (some might say more likely) to respect others, not to act without thought or with criminal or vandalistic intent etc. etc. Of course, when celebrating, they can become as obnoxious in drink as any member of the Bullingdon, but this is alcohol, not class, talking. The social classification that used to be used (A, B, C1, C2, D, E) would have placed what I think Louisa probably means by 'working class' in the C1, C2, D groups (from skilled and supervisory manual through to unskilled manual work) - E is reserved for those not in work and on state, or no, benefits (including just the state pension). Her 'under class' are almost certainly all found in the E category. Of course retired working class people who only have a state (no occupational) pension would also classify as E - but I can't see them on motor bikes racing around the streets, quite. 'Middle class' would also be found in the C1 (and possibly, aspirationally in the C2 for semi-skilled clerical work).

I had thought 'chav' was more a tribal definition - reflecting, particularly, chosen dress style - i.e. Burberry checks, tightly tied back hair (for girls) and so on - a slightly old fashioned version of the TOWIE look. To some extent an ironic working class take on Sloane Rangers (and, because of the Burberry link, hugely annoying to same). As far as behaviour was concerned, certainly up-front and slightly aggressive, but not as described (implictly) here. It is, I think, class linked (because of its comparison with Sloanes, if for no other reason) - but in a reasonably positive way, at least initially. Chavs, punks, hippies, goths, mods, rockers, Teddy Boys (granted different eras) were all initially style, not behavior descriptors.

Actually, Louisa, this is not true for those who may have started in wealthy Home Counties but then were sent to boarding school in the 50s and 60s. Indeed, it was a quite well known fact, during post-war conscription, that boarding school pupils coped with the privations of the squad room and conscription generally (those who chose not to play at being officers for 2 years) much better than others. I believe boarding is now much more comfortable, so this may no longer be true. However, as more and more young people spend 3 or more years at University, living in uncomfortable and often insanitary digs in the worst parts of any town, I doubt if any people now come to London having lived their lives in a middle class cocoon of respectability and quiet. That is not to say that those, now paying top-end Home Counties prices for accommodation frequently less appealing than what they have been used to at home, have (clearly wrongly) expectations that their money should be buying them an environment more Home Counties than Gorbals. And of course many people live lives increasingly stressful, where they may choose a 'tipping point' - dogs barking, planes flying - to explain their stress, this acting as a trigger (a straw which breaks the camel's back) to 'explain' their distress.

Because we tend not to have this type of storm very often we do not have storm drains, but rely on the normal rainwater drainage system - this can become completely overwhelmed when you have local storms of the nature we had yesterday. It is a volume/ time issue. Around Bellenden I don't think there are enough front-gardens with parking potential for impermeable coverings to aid parking to have been real issue - but elsewhere the removal of open ground to offer soak-away can be a contributory factor. But so much water fell in such a short time that however permeable the ground there would have been flooding. Locally to me Southwark (or Thames Water) had people out only a couple of days ago sweeping gutters and clearing drains, so I don't think the problems will be necessarily a consequence of bad maintenance policies. Cities will always have problems when you get so much water falling in such a short time.

Well, that and the Soviet (WW2) and American (WW1 and WW2) armies. And the folks at Bletchely Park.

In general the middle classes are far more affected by loud noises, having sensitive hearing which can be readliy disturbed at the drop of a pin (or the distant sounds of dogs barking) - the working classes hearing has been deafened by the sounds of looms and heavy machinery in their (squalid) places of work. Additionally, of course, the middle classes can afford all the expensive, and sensitive, computing etc. equipment which can be disrupted by power surges, the working classes making do with darts boards and dominoes sets which are less effected by lightning strikes (unless directly on them, of course).

I wonder which local park will be turned into a swimming pool to avoid this in the future - after the Herne Hill flood consequentials we are starting to run out?

The 'problem' with good independents is that, by definition, they are independent. When the owner(s) wish to retire, or move-on, unless they have dedicated family to follow them - or someone prepared to buy and continue the business 'as-is' (and if it is a family or personally run business - how easy is that?)- then they will close and disappear. Chains do offer continuity - independents don't. For a community the upside of having thriving independent retail and food business serving that community is their independence and unique service - the downside is that continuity cannot be guaranteed (or even offered) past the business lifetime of their initial owners. Sometimes businesses are handed on to family, or sold-on to like minded individuals, but even then you may (indeed should) expect changes - an unchanging independent starts to have the soul of a chain. Because of the size of retail outlets in ED (which are not attractive to chains) we may anticipate turn-over of premises, even where they do continue as retail outlets. This will mean the inevitable loss of treasured shops and restaurants, and premises being closed at times. But hopefully, their eventual replacement with (albeit) different offerings. All of us (if we have been here any time) will have had favoured businesses close, and regretted that closure. Equally many of us have been able to welcome new businesses, and new people trading.

I am not particularly recommending the item in the link below, though I do have 2 (and I have no relationship with the company other than as a customer) but this sort of item:- http://www.mobilefun.co.uk/masterplug-surge-protected-6-plug-power-block-with-dual-usb-white-p38675.htm?referer=N_650697426&utm_campaign=13th+Aug+Masterplug+Surge+Protected+6+Plug+Power+Block+with+Dual+USB+-+White&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_source=Mobile+Fun may give some peace of mind for connecting vulnerable electronic devices, including charging them (i.e. phones/ e-readers etc.) in case of power surge risk.

With properly numbered and counter-foiled tickets it might be possible to operate 2 types of fraud (1) theft of entry money (a fraud perpetrated by the ticket seller) or (2) false declaration of ticket receipts where sharing of revenues between home and visitors was undertaken (i.e by declaring fewer tickets sold, there would be less pot to share - a fraud perpetrated by the home club). But this would require that the ticket system was auditable (and would make sense, considering the risks if caught, only where the gains would be comparatively substantial. I am (absolutely) NOT suggesting that such a fraud (or frauds) was being undertaken here, if no no other reason that there are few enough supporters in the ground for them to be readily counted as a check against receipts. Unless every class of ticket (adult, child, concession & so on) is issued from a different roll of old fashioned cinema style stub tickets (assuming these are numbered) then matching receipts against entry would not anyway be easy. As described the 3 tickets issued for 4 paid sounds much more like a simple error than evidence of fraud. If worried, check you have the right number of tickets at the entrance before you go in.

Lightning can absolutely still blow-out electrical appliances - if it hits any associated power cables causing a surge - although I don't think these can protect against lightning surges you can buy anti-surge plugs and sockets which are well worth while using for sensitive computer equipment - which can be damaged by far lower power surges than are in lightning strikes. But unplugging after a very close strike is probably unnecessary - if you've survived that then the chances are that the storm will already have passed over you. You need to unplug at the first hearing of distant thunder.

Shortly after the big bang (lightning strike)- no more than 20 minutes - for some reason a couple of loud fireworks were set off around Underhill/ Wood Vale (I heard the 'whoosh' as well as the bang). This may have confused those close enough to hear the bangs but not the other firework noises.

I find it interesting that, with a 'park' opposite, they choose to spend time in a children's playground. Does this suggest where they sort-of still identify themselves, as children rather than independent adults? Do they feel more comfortable in a more clearly 'observed' environment? Are they jealous of the little children (whose space this more clearly is) and would wish to have back some of the certainties of real childhood? This does not excuse their behaviour, of course, nor mean that it should be in any way tolerated, but I wonder whether this eschewing of an adult environment reflects their own uncertainties with incipient adulthood? Should we be treating them as potential adults or over-grown children?

could our landlines be affected by the fault but our broadband - BT infinity - be unaffected BT Infinity is supplied (if memory serves) via 'fibre to the cabinet' - that is, only the final local loop (from the last main flexibility point to your house) is delivered over the old copper twisted pair. For such a short run copper can carry a great deal of information. Other fibre options are fibre to the curb and fibre to the premise - this latter generally only a business option. I am not sure, but I believe voice services are still carried over copper - so if the cable cut/ stolen sits on the exchange side of the cabinet (most likely since that's where the thick cables are) then it is possible that your fibre connexion will still be intact, but the copper cable carrying voice will be lost. Hence you will still have internet/ broadband but not the 'phone' (i.e. voice) services. Depending on where the optical fibre is run (it normally shares duct with the copper cable) it may, or may not, be disrupted when the copper cable is stolen. Where the duct is accidently damaged by other works this can take out both copper and fibre of course. I do not believe (happy to be corrected) that those with BT Infity also get packetised voice services, thus putting all traffic over the optical fibre. If you have the BT SmartTalk ap on your mobile you may still be able to make outgoing 'voice' calls at your PSTN tariff from home, using VOIP (Voice over Internet Protocol) - but you will not be able to receive calls over your landline until the cable is restored. You will also be able to make calls using something like Skype from any piece of kit running that (desktop, laptop, mobile, pad etc.)

Already reported here http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?5,1366345 and may be similar to the incident reported here http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?5,1364740 Theft of (copper) cable is a real issue when scrap values are so high, and dealers still offer a 'no questions asked' response to those selling scrap to them (despite the fact they are meant to keep records)

Just for the record, water pressure was restored around the promised time (23.00 yesterday) - the pressures had been reduced (hence no water on upper floors in Underhill) because the road had started to bulge omminously above the leak. Credit where it's due - a comparatively quick and effective response from Thames Water on this one, assuming the repair holds.

Are those drivers putting people more at risk than if they were signalling? probably. But is it a real problem or is it just bad manners? Often, particularly on roundabouts, road position (where there are two or more tracks) is a relatively good indication of turning intent, although signalling in addition would generally be good. Turning without signal if you are the only road user (or where no one is close enough to you to need to be aware of your intentions) is also reasonable, although again signalling would be better - if for no better reason than it becomes an automatic driving response (it is not for nothing that 'mirror, signal...' is a driving instructor mantra). I would generally say that signallng where it isn't needed (i.e. there is no one else there, or your intentions are otherwise clear - you are in a lane which requires a mandatory turn - is a matter of manners (or good habits)) - but to fail to signal where it is needed is clearly a real problem. Once you start to think of signalling as an option you will find yourself failing to signal where you are putting other road users (or pedestrians) at risk.

Modern car headlights are now very powerful - much more so than in the past, which means that, yes, visibility may be better for the driver, but, equally, where the lights are in a car heading towards you, the glare may well make other, unlit, road users less visible - anyone who uses roads without taking required (legally required) care about their own visibility is relying entirely on the skill and care of other road users - as cyclists are so proud to tell us, as other road users are all selfish, uncaring, b*st*rds, thoughtlessly rushing through life, they are placing their lives, where they do not use lights/ high viz bands etc. in the hands of people they don't trust and do despise. How stupid is that? If car drivers have a duty of care to other road users (they do) then other road users have, at the very least, a duty of care towards themselves. And the issue that the (also cycling, as I read it) OP had was not that an adult had placed themselves at risk (clearly their choice, saves the plane fare to Switzerland) - but that they had willing placed a child at the same risk, at the very least hardly a good role model. When I was a child and learning to ride a bicyle, I was expected, even in daylight, to have lights fitted to my bike (and was stopped by a beat policemen when I hadn't, and warned), but my parents did not let me out onto even side roads before I could demonstrate that I could signal safely (i.e. ride one handed, left or right). I now see perhaps only one in 10 (or less) cyclists who bother to signal any turns - not that it would make much difference for a dark cyclist on a poorly lit road at night. Why do people who cycle, clearly a risky and vulnerable form of transport, consider that taking no care or precaution for their own safety is an acceptable, let alone sensible, choice? Pillory poor and careless and thoughtless drivers who do not drive so as to share the road safely with other users, of course - but that doesn't mean that the same level of lack of care is excusable in others, just because it is they who will be most damaged in any accident.

If 'everything' is down, and the repair time is long, the chances are that this is a cable breach, either accidently (i.e. JCB went through it in error) or the result of intentional cable theft. Because each cable is made up of multiple twisted pairs, each of which uniquely connects between the subscriber's end and the exchange equipment, restoration requires each pair to be correctly matched; this is much more complex than mending an electricty cable or gas pipe or water pipe - when just joining back the ends is all this is required to restore 'flow'. Similary damage to a flexibility point (i.e. one of the green cabinets in the street) also required meticulous restoration of each pair. Do you know what has caused this outtage?

Turkish Cypriot food is somewhat different from Turkish - there is a greater Greek style of cooking influence, but good Turkish food, Cypriot or not, is very appealing - and much more delicate than exposure to 'taverna' style cooking would imply. Turkish (red) wines can be excellent, as is Turkish beer. 'Turkish' restaurants - together with Greek and Cypriot, can offer quite a wide raange of styles - certainly not as great as the whole Indian sub-continent can muster, but we normally only see a small selection (mainly Bangladeshi) on our high streets, so there is certainly room for more Middle Easter cookery generally, without becoming too repetitive. It is the ambience and service which often makes a restaurant anyway, almost as much as the food.

Back in the 80s, some of the new entrants to Clapham (from across the river) were trying to call it 'Clarm' to gentrify it - I am expecting 'Pe'm' quite soon.

No one will be driving to this school. The catchment for the nearest primary to it is just over 200m. Unless the school is very unpopular everyone who gets in will be walking to it rather than driving. I would agree that with one (or more) children at that school parents or carers are most likely to walk, but once you have children at more than one school logistics of getting them both to school on time frequently require, if you have access to a car, a car journey - particularly if you then need to get to a station yourself to get to work. Been there, done that, got the wrinkes.