Jump to content

Recommended Posts

Cash in hand is generally not declared which is actually fraud.


In practical terms, it would mean your cleaner sending you an invoice rather than you leaving money on the side.

I think we all do/ have done it.


My friend gets less than ?9 an hour which is taxed.


The need to maximise such low rates is hardly surprising.


Perhaps the government should cast their net wider and look at how much corporation tax is lost every year from the economy through loop holes and avoidance by large companies.


Perhaps a starting point would be to ask her husband - as Mr May is an exec at an investment co, profiting from Corporation Tax avoidance - so he'd probably know


http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/theresa-may-philip-may-amazon-starbucks-google-capital-group-philip-morris-a7133231.html

Who would not agree. There is a huge amount of lost income tax/vat revenue.


Payments can now be made by mobile phone app in a matter of minutes, lots of options, from BACS or Pingit


Once you have set up the payee, its a 30 second job to pay them again next time.


As Jules says, there are many low earners making a contribution to the tax take as employees. Self employed have had it too good for too long.


Disclaimer - There are some who will pay all their taxes of course.

Nigello Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> With the advent of smartphones it should be very

> easy for everyone - even your cleaner - to be able

> to charge a fairer/more expensive price so as to

> accommodate taxes



That's a very interesting post.


It appears to suggest that the cost of the taxes will ultimately be funded by payer for the services, rather than the person supplying the services.


I'd argue that the person supplying the services is 100% to blame for not paying tax. If that means they feel the need to charge more, than that's what they should have been doing - but cash or electronic changes nothing in terms of responsibility to pay taxes correctly. It lies with the service provider and always has.

yeah those low paid self-employed people with their no sick pay, holiday pay, pension rights, job security, non-equitable access to benefits, practically impossible to get mortgages they've had it far too good for way too long. Obviously, it's the self-employed rather than the corporate tax evaders who are causing the most problems. I don't know of any regular acceptable "cash in hand" jobs aside from babysitting jobs for teens.

Jules-and-Boo Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

>

>

> Perhaps a starting point would be to ask her

> husband - as Mr May is an exec at an investment

> co, profiting from Corporation Tax avoidance - so

> he'd probably know

>


Before you get too unsteady on that moral high ground....That investment company will manage a whole lot of 'normal' people's pension pots...maybe even part of yours, but almost certainly at least someone you know ...which means most of us are also somehow profiting from this tax avoidance which you clearly find so abhorrent...

The thing I take from this is that most people agree that everyone should pay tax. So, how many people will stop paying their dog-walker/cleaner/window cleaner/mobile beautician** in cash and demand a receipt?


**Not all of these kind of workers are by default tax defrauders.

red devil Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> My thoughts exactly nigello, plus all the tips

> people give to taxi drivers, waiters, barber,

> ''have one yourself barman'' etc. We all know

> these will rarely be declared to the taxman...


'Have one yourself' isn't a tip, it's a chat up line :)

Nigello Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> The thing I take from this is that most people

> agree that everyone should pay tax. So, how many

> people will stop paying their

> dog-walker/cleaner/window cleaner/mobile

> beautician** in cash and demand a receipt?

>

> **Not all of these kind of workers are by default

> tax defrauders.



That will line up with the answer to the question of how many people fancy paying their cleaner 13-14 an hour instead of 10?

Mick Mac wrote:

The report quotes ?6bn - that's a lot of babysitting.


Relatively low earners in the employed sector pay their share of tax - Just because one is self employed doesn't mean one can defraud the government.




Aren't you missing the point? The article you quote Nigello doesn't mention 6.2 billion. Other news articles do and indeed the Taylor report does.


The figure comes from an HMRC report which you can read in full here. http://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/20160618143921/https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/470540/HMRC-measuring-tax-gaps-2015-1.pdf#page=11


The figure of ?6.2 billion relates to the "Hidden Economy" and is an "illustrative" estimate produced from estimated figures for 2013-14 (?4.1 billion). The estimates are, they stress, "experimental".


The Hidden Economy is described as being related to:



"Undeclared economic activity that involves what we call ?ghosts? ? whose entire income is

unknown to HMRC, and ?moonlighters? ? who are known to us in relation to part of their

income, but have other sources of income that HMRC does not know about.



According to the report: "The direct tax hidden economy estimate is ?4.1 billion in 2013-14. This consists of ghosts (?1.2 billion), moonlighters (?1.9 billion) and Pay As You Earn individuals not in Self Assessment (?1.0 billion).


So by HMRC's own reckoning approximately a quarter of the "Hidden Economy" are in fact, employees (in PAYE) who don't declare additional income through SA, and another half are "moonlighters" which HMRC describes thus:


?Moonlighters? are individuals who pay tax on their main job through PAYE, but who fail to declare earnings from

a second job or additional income from self-employment.


Just over another quarter are people who simply don't declare any income at all. The "ghosts". These people don't have the status of being "self-employed".


So, in fact. Mick Mack, according to the source document from HMRC the problem is not with the self-employed it is with the employed. It is those already within PAYE that are being referred to when that figure of ?6.2 billion is bandied about.


As you say, "Just because one is employed one can't defraud the government"

dbboy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> window cleaner, gardener, hairdresser, cleaner

> (house), oven cleaner - what other jobs are cash

> in hand??


Most cleaning firms that offer services aren't cash in hand, never been to a hairdressers where I've been asked to pay cash that hasn't gone through a till, the only time I;ve used a gardener they gave me a receipt ... (hardly ever) clean my own windows and oven. The only thing I've paid cash for, aside from tips, is babysitting and that usually to a "young person". When I used a "professional" babysitter or flexible nanny on an ad hoc basis I had to run their weekly pay through PAYE and register as an employer.

Baldy Man.

That's a very long way to make a brief point. I don't really care if people who don't report earnings have an employment as well as the cash earnings that they don't report, it's not a vendetta against the self employed, it's a vendetta against fraudulent behaviour.


Ps - get my name right and I'll get yours right too :)

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Latest Discussions

    • Not really since the first world war, and mainly in the sense then of 'getting a Blighty one' meaning a wound so serious you had to be sent home. I seriously doubt if one school child in 100 now would know what Blighty meant if the word was presented on its own with no context. 
    • 1 space available due to one of my clients moving.  Message me for more informations  🙂  
    • Why is the name a big of a red flag? Blighty is a common name for the UK whatever people might think.
    • The only election which counts is the General Election.  There is still strong resentment for fourteen year's of Conservative rule. They squeezed the working class's way to hard, then they squeezed the middle class, but somehow the upper class never got touched, funny that.   There is also new resentment for Labour because of the utter balls up they've made of things since coming to power nine months ago. The majority of the population (or at least those with an ounce of common sense) want these clowns out of office ASAP because they see the damage they are doing to UK plc. They squeezed the pensioners, then the farmers and then business. They made and broke promise after promise, or just didn't tell the truth or say what they where going to do, otherwise known as merely lying to get elected. Inflation may be falling but the cost of things in the shops and utility bills keep on rising, the direct opposite of what they promised. They will never be trusted once they are ousted from power in about four and a half years time.   Everything they do and touch causes further harm, led by three stooges, Rayner, Reeves and balls'less Starmer, who couldn't fight his way out of a paper bag. He still thinks he's a solicitor at the DPP. Rather than spending week upon week getting involved in international politics he needs to be sorting out the UK's issues, sadly he's not up to the job and nor are his Cabinet.  Society needs a mix of people with different skills to prosper, not more and more graduates who can't get jobs in what they studied in.   Reform is the current anti establishment party, which will hopefully wither away back to where it came from.  The Liberals and Greens, well what can you say apart from using them as another alternative vote of dissatisfaction, but neither will come to power.  The country seriously needs stability and a Government that stands up for and represents it's people, not what MP's want but what the constituencies want and need.  Government needs to become far more open and transparent, it needs to be seen to be doing its job, doing what MP's are elected to do,  working for the people in the constituencies, getting back to basic principles and rebuilding the trust which has been lost by successive party's immaterial of them being, red, blue, light blue, yellow, green or some other colour.     
Home
Events
Sign In

Sign In



Or sign in with one of these services

Search
×
    Search In
×
×
  • Create New...