Downing Street Trust

[TheCat]

Well mark this down the 697-th thread initially about something totally unrelated which has been turned into another Brexit p1ssing match.....

[diable rouge]

Sephiroth Wrote:

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> ?If Brussels and Dublin ?

>

> F@@k me. Where were you people when people like

> me were saying Brexit would lead to this.

>

> England has forced this situation. Not Dublin.

> Not Brussels

It's like listening to an arsonist who has deliberately set fire to his home, who then blames the fire brigade for not putting it out.

Always the victim, it's never their fault.

*Waves at Hammy/Trinny/et al...*

[Blah Blah]

Blaming the EU for the mess NI is in, is quite frankly, ignorant.

[Seabag]

TheCat Wrote:

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> Well mark this down the 697-th thread initially

> about something totally unrelated which has been

> turned into another Brexit p1ssing match.....

Yup, but....

It?s hard to separate BJ and this Tory government AND B****T

Not impossible, but hard. Specially seeing as Boris? lying taints everything across the board.

[Sephiroth]

Cat hasn?t twigged that Brexit has screwed and divided the country and the country will remain that way until it?s addressed

No one is complaining about Brexit more than people who voted for Brexit but he doesn?t complain about them (he can?t even mention them normally because that would mean facing up to the reality)

This forum, me, and all of us could disappear tomorrow. But cat will still have to listen to people complaining and face the consequences of his gamble for pretty much rest of his life

[TheCat]

I'm going to guess that most people on this forum support decarbonisation of the economy, and alignment with the Paris COP 2 degree limit. I'm also guessing they're not crying tears for the coal miners losing their livelihoods, becuase they believe in the overall greater good of such aims. Similarly most leavers will believe in the overall greater good of brexit for the Uk...and know that some people will be negative impacted.

Every political or economic decision has winners and losers. This strawman that many remainers seem to have created, claiming that leave supporters were all saying there would be no downside and sunlit uplands for everybody, is exactly that. A strawman.

No matter how successful (or not) brexit will end up being, you will always be able to point to someone, somewhere that has been disadvanatged. Particularly with such a massive change like leaving the EU.

Industries and society will evolve, some people will lose their livelihood, some will gain new ones, how it all evolve will depend a lot on policy over the next 5-10 years as I've said almost ad nauseam.

[Sephiroth]

How convenient

[Sephiroth]

It?s amazing how labour (for example) can never get near power with anything that whiffs of anything too left wing. The excuse ?don?t worry. Always winners and losers. Give it 10 years. You?ll see? doesn?t wash there. And it doesn?t wash with Brexit either

[TheCat]

No. Labour can't get anywhere near power becuase they're usually just a bit sh1t.

[Sephiroth]

Whoooosh

[diable rouge]

''It?s hard to separate BJ and this Tory government AND B****T''

Quite, when Cummings and his mates were in No 10, we literally had the Vote Leave campaign running the country.

This article by Chris Grey highlights how connected Brexit and the subsequent actions of Gov's post-referendum have been...https://chrisgreybrexitblog.blogspot.com/2021/04/the-brexit-roots-of-scandals.html

[Huguenot]

Fun times

[Sephiroth]

Farkin ell

Mockney will be back in a mo

[Seabag]

Sephiroth Wrote:

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> Farkin ell

>

> Mockney will be back in a mo

The Grandees return 😄😆

[TheCat]

I can't believe you guys can be so flippant when people are losing their livelihood.

Unforgivable.

But of course none of you are fishermen.

Jesus wept

You should be prosecuted

[Blah Blah]

TheCat Wrote:

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> I can't believe you guys can be so flippant when

> people are losing their livelihood.

>

> Unforgivable.

>

> But of course none of you are fishermen.

>

> Jesus wept

>

> You should be prosecuted

Cat, jut stop it. You are bordering on whataboutery trolling. Engage with the points ffs.

For the record, some of us DID care when miners were losing their jobs, because you see, as much as you want to deflect from answering the here and now questions about the impacts of something you are so wedded to, with some assumed search for hypocrisy, there is a principle here. A principle that you don't trash the economy for some ideological jingoistic jolly.

Moving away from fossil fuels for example has credibility. Sure, there is a debate to be had around the best way to do that, but that debate always includes how to transfer jobs. With Brexit, there wasn't even any acknowledgement of job losses, let alone how to overcome the impacts on livelihoods. So it is no surprise that a die hard like you refuses now, even with the evidence hitting you in the face, to discuss it. Now debate like an adult or give it up.

[TheCat]

Sure. Even though all the words above are copy and paste from what 'you guys' have said when anyone post something a bit lighthearted. But when someone who disagrees with the EDF zeitgiest posts it, it's "whataboutery trolling"

Of course, when you guys post it, it's just fighting the good fight....

Understood.

'Debate like an adult'...God you make me laugh. And the funniest thing is you actually are serious. If you actually read and listened to anything I personally have said over the years, you wouldn't be claiming rubbish like "there wasn't even any acknowledgement of job losses".

You seemingly would prefer to 'debate' against a charactiture of what you think a leaver is, rather than what I (and some others) have actually said on here. But to be fair that would involve actual thinking, so sorry if asking too much.

I dont know how many times I've acknowledge various drawbacks of brexit. Of course there are. But to then be constantly told that 'no one acknowledge any downside, not even one" and 'there are no positives about brexit, not one' just shows a lack of any intention to have this 'grown-up' debate you apparently so crave....

[Sephiroth]

You have acknowledged job losses and downsides yes cat. But as I?ve said repeatedly if Brexit was sold as your version it wouldn?t have passed.

In the wider world, your version of Brexit simply is not what was sold

[TheCat]

Sephiroth Wrote:

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> You have acknowledged job losses and downsides yes

> cat. But as I?ve said repeatedly if Brexit was

> sold as your version it wouldn?t have passed.

>

> In the wider world, your version of Brexit simply

> is not what was sold

That may indeed be true.

But I have my own reasons and rationale for supporting brexit (again, as I've said many times). But as one of the few vocal leavers on this forum, it appears all remainer rage at any and all leavers can often be focussed on my comments, regardless of what has actually been said. I really don't care what was written on the side of a bus, or how distasteful some other leaver supporters may or may not be. I find some prominent remain supporters to be quite odious, but I hope I"'ve never conflated them with you.

I find you odious for completely independent reasons:)

[Blah Blah]

And yet Cat, still you persist with the passive aggressive attitude. You continue to accuse everyone of never listening to you, or reading your posts properly. People do read your posts properly and when they counter argue with a response you can't argue with, you resort to this passive aggressive victim complex crap. The number of times you derail threads with this egotistic nonsense is exhausting. The last word belongs to no-one, and especially not you.

[Blah Blah]

Sephiroth Wrote:

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> You have acknowledged job losses and downsides yes cat. But as I?ve said repeatedly if Brexit was sold as your version it wouldn?t have passed.

> In the wider world, your version of Brexit simply is not what was sold

This is exactly it. Brexit is a con trick that is going to impact most on those who voted for it (as the fishing sector is finding out).

[TheCat]

It's funny how people are only egotistic/exhausting/passive aggressive when they disagree with you. It's very easy to gloss over the same characteristics/flaws in other people's posts when one agrees with what they are saying.

The number of times you've chosen to not reply/change the topic/make wild assumptions when faced with an argument you can't or won't engage with is quite long....

So please be careful about throwing too many of those stones.

[Blah Blah]

And there you prove my point perfectly. I rest my case.

[Blah Blah]

diable rouge Wrote:

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> You're certainly a gambler Cat, and a reckless one

> at that.

> I'm afraid you're going to have to dismiss the

> first 5 years of that 5-10 year plan of yours,

> given that the 'muppets' that delivered Brexit

> are, surprise, surprise, still in charge, and

> might well be for the full 10 years. Then what?

>

> I note no mention of the social impact Brexit is

> having, in particular as Seph alludes to, Northern

> Ireland and the peace process, all foreseen. Is

> that a price worth paying for your concept,

> acceptable collateral damage (no pun intended)?

> Which reminds me, you wouldn't have been living

> here during the Troubles, it wasn't nice, even on

> the Mainland. Will it need a couple of terrorist

> bombs to go off in London to make you sit up and

> notice?

>

> I thought that you could've at least pointed me in

> some direction beyond a simplistic 'concept', say

> a Norway style deal that would've at least

> addressed the issue of NI. A half-way house

> reflecting the closeness of the vote, gave both

> sides the opportunity to either later form closer

> ties with the EU or pull further away, depending

> how things went. Surely that's more in keeping

> with a 5-10 year plan than living in hope that one

> day a more competent Gov might or might not rock

> up...

And to be clear, THIS is the post Cat has avoided responding properly to for an entire page while he plays his usual silly games of deflection and troll psychology.

So Cat, will it really need a couple of terrorist bombs to go off for you to understand how precarious this all is for the GFA? Or do you genuinely not give a hoot.

[TheCat]

If you spent as much effort discussing the topic rather than discussing me and my posting style you might actually have a case to rest.

I'd like to try to stay on topic, but I don't really know what you want me to say. Even sephiroth has acknowledged that I have previously acknowledged job losses and downsides. So I don't know how you expect me to actually adress your 'case'...when your main point above seems to be that "there wasn't even any acknowledgement of job losses"....how many times would you like me to concede the same point?