Dancers on the Goose Green Roundabout

[BrandNewGuy]

I give up.

[buddug]

What is your problem, exactly? I don't think you're being very honest with us here. It's not just a problem you have with the slightly dubious grammar of the organisation's statement is it?

[BrandNewGuy]

My problem is that I don't understand the first substantial phrase of the website's/organisation's 'manifesto', ie what it's about:

" ONE BILLION RISING IS:

A global strike

An invitation to dance

A call to men and women to refuse to participate in the status quo until rape and rape culture ends

An act of solidarity, demonstrating to women the commonality of their struggles and their power in numbers

A refusal to accept violence against women and girls as a given

A new time and a new way of being"

[buddug]

I think I'll just leave you to dig your own grave... ta ta.

[Gingerbeer]

BrandNewGuy-- I think (and I could be completely wrong about this, as Im not overly familiar with OneBillionRising) that their 'cause' is to bring awareness about places where say, marital rape as an example, is an accepted and normal practice. By joining in dancing, the participants are making an active statement of saying *I recognize this as a problem, I'm not turning a blind eye to it, and I don't think its acceptable*. I think the dancing is a form of positive protest (i.e. doing something joyful) rather than a negative one of traditional protesting, placards, signs reading Rape is Wrong! etc... (because who thinks its 'right' anyway?) Again, I could be totally off on this one...

[buddug]

Great stuff Gingerbeer. You get it. But don't waste your time on him. It's the cause he has a problem with, not the words.

[BrandNewGuy]

Yeah, of course...

[Huguenot]

Actually, I don't understand this phrase either :"refuse to participate in the status quo until rape and rape culture ends".

How do we 'refuse to participate in the status quo'? Do we not go to work, or eat meat or live in a house? Not have sex? What?

How will we know when rape culture has ended? For that matter, how will we know when rape has ended?

It's really not very helpful - as any fule kno, when faced with wooly or unachievable objectives the output is invariably to do nothing.

Furthermore, if we set targets based on OTHER people's behaviour or activities, the outputs are resentment, disengagement and poor cooperation.

[edhistory]

Huguenot Wrote:

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> as any fule kno,

You may need to explain rhis literary reference to the unenlightened of this thread.

John K

[Huguenot]

'Twas the way in which Nigel Molesworth, eponymous hero of Punch Magazine's precocious schoolboy comic strip, would highlight that he was about to state the bleedin' obvious.

[buddug]

Yawn.

[Gingerbeer]

To be fair Buddog, I dont think BrandNewGuy is taking issue with the idea of protesting against rape.

[Huguenot]

No response on that question then?

[buddug]

I'm sure you're right, Gingerbeer, but Huguenot's remark probably comes nearer to what's going on here: "Furthermore, if we set targets based on OTHER people's behaviour or activities, the outputs are resentment, disengagement and poor cooperation."

It's the same-old same-old. Just the mention of tackling rape brings a few highly defensive chaps out of the woodwork bleating that 'oh, you think all men are rapists blah blah.'

Well, actually, the wonderful thing about this VDay lark is that many men (who are not defensive and so sensitive, and who realise there is a problem) are joining in the protest, and don't feel 'resentment, disengagement and poor co-operation'. They are able to look outside themselves to the actual victims of this crime and want to support them. The more men the merrier, in my view. I found it very moving and heartening to see the large numbers of men who also came out in protest against the unbelievably hideous incident in India recently.

In fact, and it may be non-PC of me to say this, without the support of men who also believe the current situation is an outrage, this movement will be stymied. But you win some you lose some. Hey ho.

[Huguenot]

Well, leaving aside that you still haven't answered the question, it seems odd that you reward these sensitive guys who join in the protest by refusing to have sex with them until the 'end of the rape culture'.

Idiotic.

I share your desire to see the end of these horrific crimes, but I'm rather at a loss as to know how to help something that sets up such stupid conditions.

Since myself and my other half have a loving and satisfying relationship, she would rightly feel aggrieved if I refuse to have sex with her until racist Australians stop abusing Aborigines, or members of the BNP launch a multiracial kindergarten.

[buddug]

Now you're just being plain old silly, Hugeunot. Whoever said women are refusing to have sex with anyone until the 'end of the rape culture'!!!!?????! Now that's the biggest defensive reaction I've ever heard on this subject, and no mistake.

There's no reasoning with some people.

[Penguin68]

which Nigel Molesworth, eponymous hero of Punch Magazine's precocious schoolboy comic strip

The Molesworth books, written I think by Geoffrey Willuns, were illustrated by Searle, but they were never comic strips, and I'm not sure to what extent Nigel could have been described as precocious - he seemed to be a very typical prep-school boy, if somewhat more forthright than many. Many school boys also, like Nigel, saw through adults (particularly schoolmasters) without being precocious.

[Huguenot]

Sure buddug, if I'm wrong I'll stand corrected.

Can you explain what 'refuse to accept the status quo until the end of rape culture' means?

You seem happy to tell me what it doesn't mean, but not what it does mean?

[buddug]

Look, stop behaving like a troll, go and do a bit of reading, get your facts right, then put on your best dancing gear, get out there - and shake your booty for the sisters!

[edhistory]

Summary for page 3:

Some young people decided to hold, or join, an event on a local roundabout with the intention of stopping local traffic.

There is an issue about whether this was done with due regard for public safety.

John K

[DulwichDeviant]

DELETED

[buddug]

'Summary for page 3:

Some young people decided to hold, or join, an event on a local roundabout with the intention of stopping local traffic.

There is an issue about whether this was done with due regard for public safety.

John K'

http://www.cool-smileys.com/images/10.gif

[Huguenot]

I'm not behaving like a troll buddug.

Both BNG and myself don't understand the manifesto (we both understand the overall intent), we've asked perfectly reasonable questions which you refuse to answer.

Instead you've said nasty things about both of us.

It doesn't really hold the organisation in a good light if its followers abuse anyone who asked them questions about it?

I'm guessing that your refusal to answer means that you don't understand it either? Fine, just say so?

[Jessie]

I'm a woman with strong feminist leanings and I don't understand the manifesto either

[hpsaucey]

buddug Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> I'm sure you're right, Gingerbeer, but Huguenot's

> remark probably comes nearer to what's going on

> here: "Furthermore, if we set targets based on

> OTHER people's behaviour or activities, the

> outputs are resentment, disengagement and poor

> cooperation."

>

> It's the same-old same-old. Just the mention of

> tackling rape brings a few highly defensive chaps

> out of the woodwork bleating that 'oh, you think

> all men are rapists blah blah.'

>

> Well, actually, the wonderful thing about this

> VDay lark is that many men (who are not defensive

> and so sensitive, and who realise there is a

> problem) are joining in the protest, and don't

> feel 'resentment, disengagement and poor

> co-operation'. They are able to look outside

> themselves to the actual victims of this crime and

> want to support them. The more men the merrier, in

> my view. I found it very moving and heartening to

> see the large numbers of men who also came out in

> protest against the unbelievably hideous incident

> in India recently.

>

> In fact, and it may be non-PC of me to say this,

> without the support of men who also believe the

> current situation is an outrage, this movement

> will be stymied. But you win some you lose some.

> Hey ho.

Hear hear.... And, if you look closely it wasn't just women on Goose Green Roundabout or just women clapping and cheering...