Electricity and gas prices going up - what will you do?

[Nigello]

It looks like many of the smaller fuel firms will go belly up, and maybe sooner than later.

What, then will you do in terms of dealing with price rises? Shop around, use less power, or both? (I changed my tariff to lock me in till mid '22. I will be switching off lights/standbys and generally using less power as a result. Great for the planet?!

[diable rouge]

[TheCat]

Price rationing demand...who says capitalism is killing the planet:)

Recklessa adoption of renewables has made this situation an inevitability for some time unfort. Don't get me wrong, IM all for the energy transition/Paris Agreement etc etc, but it has to be managed properly, or this is what you end up with...

[Nigello]

Maybe you are right if you say that the silver lining could be that emissions are fewer, despite the hardships some will face.

[jazzer]

See link for those who have gone bust since January 2021 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58626018

If you're on a fixed tariff, probably safest to sit tight and wait till the tariff ends, then shop around either with your current supplier or with others in the market. Found comparing ?/Kwh easiest way to do this.

Or

Check out price comparison sites, bearing in mind they don't do it for free.

Or

If you're not on a fixed tariff (variable) I believe, hope that your supplier is not one of the four currently teetering on going bust and switch to a 12 month fixed tariff ASAP.

Or

If your supplier does go bust, Energy UK will switch you to a new supplier, your gas and elecricity will not go off, they guarantee that.

And finally of you're with Bulb because someone on here was encouraging people to switch, just hope the Govt stump up the cash to bail out that supplier!!!!!!!!!!!

[womanofdulwich]

Not enough wind this year? Who knew?

[Dogkennelhillbilly]

TheCat Wrote:

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> Recklessa adoption of renewables has made this

> situation an inevitability for some time unfort.

> Don't get me wrong, IM all for the energy

> transition/Paris Agreement etc etc, but it has to

> be managed properly, or this is what you end up

> with...

Rubbish. It's certainly been less windy than usual in the last month, and that's meant renewables couldn't do much heavy lifting over the last few weeks - but that's against the background of:

- high European demand for gas last year

- high Asian demand for gas now

- Russia getting aggro over gas pipeline to Germany

- fire at UK-France interconnector

- proliferation of thinly capitalised, small staffed energy intermediaries that operated on wafer thin margins and didn't hedge against price rises

None of which was the result of "reckless adoption of renewables".

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-58090533

[malumbu]

It's cost not supply - we produce about half our own gas and are plugged into the Norweigian fields through interconnectors. The Norweigians took a stategic decision not to sell or burn or their gas - helped of course by producing their electricity from hydro.

It all went wrong when Thatcher privatised the market, but of course many were happy to get rich quickly. She did an about turn on nuclear otherwise we would be like France. Instead we burned much of our gas to produce electricity. We were ahead of the game on renewables 30 or 40 years ago. Privatising the market meant we lost much of our expertise and capability, but some still remains. The Chinese took the opportunity to expand in energy markets.

I worked in energy markets a few years ago, nuclear before that, and in more recent years transport. Turned me into a bit of a bore!

[TheCat]

@dogkennellhillbilly: when you don't have enough baseload generation, becuase you've shutdown your coal fired baseload (at the same time as retirement of much of the domestic nuclear baseload capacity) in favour of reliance on intermittent renewable supply for a large portion of your needs, it leaves you vulnerable to things like spikes in gas prices and failure of interconnectors.

So it has everything to do with reckless acceleration of changes in the generation mix.

[SpringTime]

Even in a Victorian building we rarely have the heating on. This year will be no different. Being a little more frugal than normal, and being sure to wear thermals, only using devices etc when absolutely necessary, will see our bills lower. Really gets my goat when I visit households with shorts, t shirts or vests, and the heating on full blast. Edwina's clumsy advice does have some precision for all.

[Nigello]

SpringTime - I agree with the 23C+ preferences for some people - so wasteful and damaging. Perhaps this episode will kickstart a wave of common sense, if not frugality, which would benefit the planet and people's pockets?

[womanofdulwich]

the worse thing is WFH sitting still at a pc. You need heating. You need it for each room someone is in and my bills were much higher last year.

[Sephiroth]

at some point, the voters are going to have to hold this government responsible for all the bad decisions they make

[Nigello]

https://www.moneysupermarket.com/gas-and-electricity/energy-saving-tips/ - some tips (but not including "put a jumper on"!)

[Sephiroth]

Let's have a look at how the government planned for this shall we?

Back when Brexit had yet to happen, but was being factored into decisions (ha - remember those heady days!)

Anyway - interesting thread here:

[redpost]

In this case I don't think its got much to do with brexit, more like tory incompetence and dogmatic free market approach. Mainly by allowing gas storage facilities (e.g. rough) to be shut down and allowing new energy providers to spring up with minimal requirements and market supervision.

These providers have a small capital base and inadequate hedging. They've made a profit for a few years and are now socialising the consequences of inadequate hedging by going bust and pushing the costs onto other consumers.

[Sephiroth]

I'm in agreement that Brexit has little to nothing to do with the cause

it will have a lot to do with how we recover

My point was more about the fact that there was a time when the government was looking ahead and planning - and decided to ignore any warning signs

[Nigello]

Back on topic, without the B word, what will YOU do as regards your heating and lighting needs this winter given the current circumstances? (Burning pro- and anti-Brexit documents, perhaps....?)

[KidKruger]

Surely everyone will use as much as they can or can afford to.

[Nigello]

You'd think that, but perhaps some don't know the best way to reduce energy use. It may sound silly, but how many know, for example, how much energy a charging phone/laptop or TV set on standby uses, or how much could be saved by turning the radiators down from 5 to 4, etc.?

Fuel price increases may push people to find out and economise.

[SpringTime]

KidKruger Wrote:

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> Surely everyone will use as much as they can or

> can afford to.

Nope, KK. We'll use as little as we can and be able to spend more on bills if we change our minds. 18? is easily warm enough indoors. If not then ask Mother Nature for some proper clothes.

[KidKruger]

tbf - the basic rule 'if you don't need it to burn energy then don't enable it' pretty much deals with it doesn't it ?

If people genuinely can't figure out whether they're burning energy they don't need to, it'll be sorted after a couple of bills.

That's just the reality, unless I'm missing something !

Nigello Wrote:

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> You'd think that, but perhaps some don't know the

> best way to reduce energy use. It may sound silly,

> but how many know, for example, how much energy a

> charging phone/laptop or TV set on standby uses,

> or how much could be saved by turning the

> radiators down from 5 to 4, etc.?

> Fuel price increases may push people to find out

> and economise.

[KidKruger]

nice to see someone actually deals with it like that.

SpringTime Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> KidKruger Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Surely everyone will use as much as they can or

> > can afford to.

>

> Nope, KK. We'll use as little as we can and be

> able to spend more on bills if we change our

> minds. 18? is easily warm enough indoors. If not

> then ask Mother Nature for some proper clothes.

[womanofdulwich]

Well as you are all so informed.Does leaving things like the and laptops on standby really use a lot of energy?

A lot of energy wasted in my household arguing this

[Nigello]

https://green-energy-efficient-homes.com/waste-electricity.html

Even with the PC itself turned off, the combined power draw of a cable or DSL modem, a wireless router, and a computer printer sitting idle and waiting for work to do, can exceed 50 watts (about the same draw as one moderately bright incandescent bulb or 4 compact fluorescent bulbs). That might not sound like much but that 50 watts when running continuously through the year works out to 50 x 24 x 365 watt hours, or 438,000 watt hours (438 kilowatt hours). That costs roughly $44 a year ? to keep your computer equipment running 168 hours a week, when you probably only need it running for 10 or 20 hours a week at most.