Moped crash scams around Barry Road/Underhill/Goodrich

[Happyme5]

It is horrible.  And so wrong that insurance companies are doing Jack'''':::: about this.  Other than paying out and costing us the consumer huge hikes on our policies.  It really isn't good.  It will get worse again when there are regular school runs.  

[malumbu]

I was told from a contact of another copycat incident today on Woodwarde, motor scooter, women with two children in the car, rider keeps his helmet on and face 3/4 covered, maybe Italian?

I often post against reactionary posts but this one is real.  And specifying a likely nationality is not racist.

If it happens to you admit nothing, beyond giving your name and address don't give any further information, and 999, at the scene if you get the opportunity, but this is a stressful situation where you are likely to feel vulnerable so as soon as you can.  They will have a number of similar reports so this will build intelligence.

I reckon it is the same person but riding under different names.

PM me for more details.  If you are on Woodwarde and saw anything again PM me.

By all means write to Ellie asking her to raise the issues over the ease that some get away with this sort of insurance scam with the insurers' representatives, and what more government should be doing.

[Happyme5]

Best advice I have ever seen here on this topic is get front and rear dash cams.   The incident I saw involved one chap pretending to have been hit and one chap filming obviously after the initial contact/ deliberate crash into the car by the moped.   I saw from the filming part.  My husband then said after when I mentioned something that it was a probably a crash for cash scam. If we see anything like this again I hope that we would stop and offer support to the car driver who is the real victim.   And it is fine and factual to mention a person who is using EAL as an angle in their professional criminality.....   

[Nigello]

What is EAL? 

[Penguin68]

Or you could tell the con-merchant that you're an uninsured driver, and to go whistle...

[Happyme5]

English as a Additional Language.

[KidKruger]

I think there are some cyclists doing this, too.

[first mate]

On 30/08/2024 at 12:00, Penguin68 said:

Or you could tell the con-merchant that you're an uninsured driver, and to go whistle...

Genuine question. Can the moped 'victim' check to see if you are insured and then take action anyway? Plus would there be implications for the driver in stating they are not insured when they are?

Might another course of action be to hold tight and insist on calling the police - who probably would not come out- before releasing any details?

[malumbu]

I've never heard of a cyclist doing this.  The person is on a motor scooter rather than moped.  If you see a newish motor scooter, with no stickers identifying it as a delivery scooter, with most of face covered be on your guard.  If you did consider yourself vulnerable following a confrontation then the police should attend.  I feel vulnerable and threatened.  Blues and twos (sirens and blue lights) 

[Penguin68]

1 hour ago, first mate said:

Genuine question. Can the moped 'victim' check to see if you are insured and then take action anyway? Plus would there be implications for the driver in stating they are not insured when they are?

I think you can find out insurance status on the DVL site - but not necessarily the name of the insurance company. However, as a scammer (as opposed to a genuine accident victim) taking the case up with the police might not be a first port of call. The very fact that, as described, a 'quite fortuitous' 3rd party record of the incident may exist might suggest some problems with the veracity of the incident, together with proof of ownership of the moped, driving licence etc might discourage the scammer from pursuing this. They operate on a blackmail basis, and bringing in the authorities to support such an action may be self defeating. My original suggestion was, of course, tongue-in-cheek - but if you believe that you've been a victim of a scam I wouldn't hold back or try to be a good citizen. 

Of course claiming you are uninsured is an offence (you are meant to exchange insurance details) but believing you are a victim of an Insurance scam may be a defense. Victims of crime are allowed to defend themselves.

[Happyme5]

I am not aware of cyclists doing this but it wouldn't surprise me.  Plus I have seen a moped doing doing this.  So who knows.  Maybe it is a free for all.  As in free for for all except car drivers.  

[Penguin68]

28 minutes ago, Happyme5 said:

I am not aware of cyclists doing this but it wouldn't surprise me.

I would not describe a con merchant and criminal such as this as 'a cyclist', as I wouldn't describe a ram raider as 'a motorist'. They are, if they exist, 'criminals using bicycles'. As opposed to a cyclist jumping a red light who is a criminal cyclist. 

[malumbu]

This has turned from a useful thread warning about criminals in our area to yet another attack on cyclists.  A shame.

Edited September 3, 2024 by malumbu

[Happyme5]

As I have said.  I am not aware of cyclists being involved in crash for cash scams.  But I have witnessed mopeds.  Maybe the cyclist thing is the delivery cyclist that might happened to be a "Witness" and film the result of the so called accident.  I have seen that B4.  On Crystal Palace Rd.   

 

Another thought do cyclists have insurance. Similar to car insurance.  Because  I thought the crash for cash scams worked so well for the baddies because of the quick exchange through motor vehicle insurances.  Someone will not doubt know more about it than I do. Any thoughts???

Plus there are more than one individual doing this.  It will increase again. As I said B4 the school runs are back on. And other posts have stated that the scammers like to pick on pricey cars with a woman driver and a car full of kids.  But I am sure that they will pick on any vehicle other than a police car.   

Edited September 3, 2024 by Happyme5
Typo

[Penguin68]

22 hours ago, malumbu said:

This has turned from a useful thread warning about criminals in our area to yet another attack on cyclists.  A shame.

If this is a response to my previous post then can I point out that I specifically condemned just the use of the word 'cyclist' to describe a con-merchant faking an accident (and indeed expressed some doubt that someone on a bicycle would/ could do so). I then did point out what a 'criminal cyclist' would look like - jumping red lights is a criminal offence and (some) cyclists do do this. Some cyclists, in their role as cyclists, do cycle criminally. Lots of people in different roles act criminally (a car driver jumping a red light is equally criminal). Your pathological need to defend anyone on a bicycle from any criticism is very noticeable - I would prefer just to defend the class of cyclists when they are associated, as a class, with non cycling offences - staging fake accidents, by whatever means, is not an offence specific to a type of vehicular use.

[Happyme5]

You have a fair point.   And cyclists can be very aggressive in lets say their "riding style" and if you get hit by a speeding bike on the pavement or otherwise it does bloody hurt.   

[Pugwash]

This scam was mentioned in the I paper last week- it is all over the country. Police recommend that anyone affected immediately notify your insurance agencies.

Also attend your local Police SNT meetings or Cuppa with a Copper informal sessions and report these incidents.

[KidKruger]

8 hours ago, Penguin68 said:

If this is a response to my previous post then can I point out that I specifically condemned just the use of the word 'cyclist' to describe a con-merchant faking an accident (and indeed expressed some doubt that someone on a bicycle would/ could do so). I then did point out what a 'criminal cyclist' would look like - jumping red lights is a criminal offence and (some) cyclists do do this. Some cyclists, in their role as cyclists, do cycle criminally. Lots of people in different roles act criminally (a car driver jumping a red light is equally criminal). Your pathological need to defend anyone on a bicycle from any criticism is very noticeable - I would prefer just to defend the class of cyclists when they are associated, as a class, with non cycling offences - staging fake accidents, by whatever means, is not an offence specific to a type of vehicular use.

the bloke I saw do it was riding a bike and had a helmet on, he was a cyclist, no ?

If I had said 'every single cyclist under the sun' you may have a point though.

I don't think a dispute over terminology is required here !

[AllisonAdler]

This just happened to me at the roundabout at Underhill and Langton Rise. I approached the roundabout, indicating left to proceed onto Langton Rise as I approached. There was a moped coming to the roundabout on Underhill from the opposite direction, so I looked to see if he was indicating, which he wasn't, so looking once more, I began slowly to proceed left, at which point, he careened across the junction, then slowed well before nearing my car, but then just apparently deliberately continued on and crashed into my car door. He immediately began taking photos, all the while asserting that it was my fault. He tried to tell me that I didn't need to take photos, but of course I did. He said that he was fine (three times, including to a passing Deliveroo driver). We exchanged insurance information, and I drove home to report it immediately.

[Happyme5]

Ohh Alison.  It is so awful.  I am glad you are not hurt.   There aren't any words really that you could use on a public forum to describe the true feelings and thoughts that I and others all have.   I guess you didn't have any dash cam footage.  On the slightest off chance it is possible that anyone has video doorbell footage.   It is beyond a joke.  The next thing it will be a parked car that blame.....    Could you describe the model type of moped driver etc. I wonder do know if it is registered locally.  Stupid question I suppose. How would we know and what good would knowing do.   Just glad you are OK.   Please do report this to whoever you can local MP and other in government.  Try to get this out forward as a serious issue.  Some other people on this forum have made some great responses and recommended a good course of action.  Take care.  

Edited September 11, 2024 by Happyme5
Added

[malumbu]

Please report to the police as an insurance scam

[AllisonAdler]

21 hours ago, malumbu said:

Please report to the police as an insurance scam

I have now done this. For anyone else in this situation, if there is no injury and no photographic evidence of an actual traffic offence, when you try to fill out the online incident reporting form, it will effectively try to boot you off the system at the end. If you keep scrolling down the last page after that, however, there is a new form that you can fill out by pressing the blue 'start' button at the bottom. Also, I encourage everyone to contact your local crime liaison officer, if you have one, with reports of any incidents like this. I'm writing to Ellie Reeves today as well, and investing in a dashcam.

[Happyme5]

Brilliant response to the whole incident.  I hope that Ellie Reeves can offer you and us some support.   Maybe a good one to ask at PM's questions.... 

[malumbu]

In this situation 999, the next time it happens do it at the scene.  I am vulnerable and being threatened.  He only crashes into female drivers, often with young children in the car

Edited September 13, 2024 by malumbu

[Pugwash]

if like me you do not have a mobile phone- you cannot take pictures of the scene. I would probably not give my insurance details over, but on returning home would notify both police and insurance company of this scam.