Cyclist visibility

[malumbu]

2 hours ago, Rockets said:

Absolutely right. But, as the previous pages show, wearing bright clothes and having lights (especially at night) will probably help you to be seen. And this, after all, was the whole point of the original post.

 

You have ignored mine, and many other posts.  If you get hit by a car, when you are riding in the correct position, with lights on at nigh,t then it is the driver's fault.  They will be prosecuted if the police get involved.  It is not the cyclists fault.  Even without lights on you may well be prosecuted.

Whether I have a fluorescent bikini on, lasers coming out of my helmet, and a sound system, that is irrelevant. 

[Rockets]

 @malumbu yes we understand that but do you agree that wearing bright clothes and having working lights will help you to be seen. That, after all, was the whole point of the thread not whether a driver gets prosecuted if they rear-end a cyclist.

[HeadNun]

21 minutes ago, malumbu said:

 

Whether I have a fluorescent bikini on, lasers coming out of my helmet, and a sound system, that is irrelevant. 

Blimey, in my head we've gone from Alan Partridge to Borat

[first mate]

43 minutes ago, malumbu said:

You have ignored mine, and many other posts.  If you get hit by a car, when you are riding in the correct position, with lights on at nigh,t then it is the driver's fault.  They will be prosecuted if the police get involved.  It is not the cyclists fault.  Even without lights on you may well be prosecuted.

Surely both driver and cyclist might be prosecuted? The cyclist at night without lights on would be cycling illegally. 

[malumbu]

2 hours ago, Rockets said:

 @malumbu yes we understand that but do you agree that wearing bright clothes and having working lights will help you to be seen. That, after all, was the whole point of the thread not whether a driver gets prosecuted if they rear-end a cyclist.

Nope I don't believe bright clothes make a big difference, the article I posted earlier reviewed the evidence and considered that things that were moving such as reflectors on pedals caught the attention better.  It may be that we remember someone in bright clothing whilst clocking everyone else, as giving space to cyclists is an automatic/subconscious thing (as is much of driving) that we learn.

1 hour ago, first mate said:

Surely both driver and cyclist might be prosecuted? The cyclist at night without lights on would be cycling illegally. 

A big difference between a £40 fixed penalty notice and being done for dangerous driving, careless driving etc.

[Rockets]

3 hours ago, malumbu said:

Nope I don't believe bright clothes make a big difference, the article I posted earlier reviewed the evidence and considered that things that were moving such as reflectors on pedals caught the attention better.

What about lights? You didn't answer that bit.....

Millions of people would respectfully disagree with you on the bright clothes issue. Remember the wise words from the fighter pilot...always wear high contrast clothes and a helmet...as a cyclist myself both seem like very, very sensible suggestions.

[malumbu]

Read the article.  I have already said that you should use lights at night.  Rather than tell me why you are right, have a look at the study.  Millions of cyclists don't know about road position, don't always look behind or to the side before turning, it doesn't make them right.  Here's a useful video to improve your cycling and reduce the likelihood of a motorist not 'seeing' you.  It does not feature bright clothing.  It is from someone who is a professional cycling instructor and will provide you with a lesson or two.  From about 3 and a half minutes lots on position.  

 

 

[Moovart]

Malumbu just checking if you have red green colour blindness? And I'm not being rude or facetious.  Because he is actually wearing a bright red T shirt and a patterned very visible helmet 👍

[Spartacus]

It is also a video shot in the day, not at night, and as we know, night time or dusk is when bright clothing could make a difference to the cyclists visibility. 🫣

[malumbu]

Depends how you define bright.  It's hardly a fluorescent yellow/hi vis.  But everyday wear. As per the picture here.  One is even wearing all black,  Well I am pleased you looked at the video @Moovart  Looking at the comments on YouTube perhaps one of them ranting about cyclists is a member of this forum.

This cycling team have a different way of attracting attention, sorry for any offence.!

[Rockets]

@malumbu he is a very good cyclist - wearing a helmet, bright clothing, his positioning is very good, very well balanced between protecting himself and being mindful of allowing traffic to flow. He is what I would consider a well trained considerate cyclist (I count myself in that category too if you don't mind me saying!). The problem is there are so many people who have never had any sort of cycle training and just jump on a bike (Lime bike) and just wing it - putting themselves and others in danger. He certainly hasn't read articles saying he should take primary position and then just dumps himself there for the entirety of his journey - nor is his cycling erratic - you know that Lime bike look where the rider is hurtling along, often with phone in hand, weaving across the carriageway and using mind control to indicate they are about to turn!

His comment about creating a positive road culture is spot on and I wish more cyclists would subscribe to that. Those described by @Angelina were doing the polar opposite. If all cyclists cycled like him I doubt anyone would have any gripes - but the big challenge is they don't.

[malumbu]

He mainly adopts the primary position.  He cycles a good door widths away from parked car doors.  You argued long and hard that primary position is not the norm in inner London.  Make your mind up.  

[Rockets]

39 minutes ago, malumbu said:

You argued long and hard that primary position is not the norm in inner London.  Make your mind up.  

He is a very considerate cyclist - mindful of his own safety but also mindful of vehicles wishing to pass him. Do you wish more cyclists cycled like that?

[Earl Aelfheah]

It's good advice in that video. The 'life saver' check / over the shoulder check is so important. Those two things, position and observation are probably the biggest things you can do to try and stay safe. That said, when you spend most of your time in primary position, which is usually right in London, you will inevitably get occasional, angry responses, especially on less quiet roads than the ones in the video. It's not uncommon to have cars overtake on the wrong side of a traffic island for example, it you correctly take primary position to prevent being squeezed.

I like how calm he is. Ogmios' School of Zen motoring is another good example of how temperament is another important factor in making our roads safer and more pleasant.