Do vegans eat honey

[Blah Blah]

I became a vegatarian because of sausages lol.

It's each to their own isn't it? We can though all share a common interest in how our food is produced, whatever we eat. And bees are crucial to our eco system. They pollinate aomething like 70% of all plants growing on the planet. And they are in decline. So anything that helps to keep bees going is a good thing imo.

[LadyDeliah]

My dad has to have vitamin B12 injections and calcium tablets because being a vegan doesn't provide the required nutrients. All of the long term vegans I know have deficiency-related health problems.

Vegans in less developed countries obtain additional nutrients from insects etc in their food, but our food is blasted with chemicals and insect free, so vegans in developed countries often have diets lacking in important nutrients.

I understand why someone is vegan from an ethical point of view, just don't pretend it's a healthy option.

[Earl Aelfheah]

If you eat insects are you still a vegan?

[Earl Aelfheah]

I find vegans detached emotionally but extremely logical.

[Earl Aelfheah]

.. sorry that's Vulcans

[Salsaboy]

Depends if the insects have eaten meat or animal products.

rahrahrah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> If you eat insects are you still a vegan?

[Blah Blah]

LadyDeliah, most people long term end up deficient in something because we are so poorly educated about food, nutrition and are fed a diet of processed, manufactured rubbish. The whole food industry is guilty on that one.

All the vegans I know are pretty well educated in maintaining the right nutritional balance. B12 is found in soy milk and fortified soy products. It is possible to get enough B12 from that. And calcium is found in all kinds of things from leafy greens to fruit.

On the whole, vegetarians and vegans tend to be healthier long term than carnivores and live on average longer, and all the data supports that. But I like to think that any diet is healthy as long as the nutrient blance is right. It's not the diet that gets that wrong, but the person eating it.

[El Pibe]

My uncle (an original sixties hippy still living in what might be the last remaining commune still going in london from that period) was a committed vegan for many many years.

In the end he stopped because it 'sucked the joy out of life'.

He's still a veggie obviously, but i can see his point. I mean honey is actually a metaphor for the wondrous, perhaps divine, bountiful nature of this world.

It is all a *bit* hair shirt innit ;)

[Seabag]

El Pibe Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> My uncle (an original sixties hippy still living

> in what might be the last remaining commune still

> going in london from that period) was a committed

> vegan for many many years.

> In the end he stopped because it 'sucked the joy

> out of life'.

>

>

> It is all a *bit* hair shirt innit ;)

Or Hemp shirt, in this case i'd imagine

[El Pibe]

:D

[Blah Blah]

Ahhh, whatever happened to hemp :)

[hpsaucey]

Blah Blah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> LadyDeliah, most people long term end up deficient

> in something because we are so poorly educated

> about food, nutrition and are fed a diet of

> processed, manufactured rubbish. The whole food

> industry is guilty on that one.

>

> All the vegans I know are pretty well educated in

> maintaining the right nutritional balance. B12 is

> found in soy milk and fortified soy products. It

> is possible to get enough B12 from that. And

> calcium is found in all kinds of things from leafy

> greens to fruit.

>

> On the whole, vegetarians and vegans tend to be

> healthier long term than carnivores and live on

> average longer, and all the data supports that.

> But I like to think that any diet is healthy as

> long as the nutrient blance is right. It's not the

> diet that gets that wrong, but the person eating

> it.

I was vegan (with lapses into vegetarianism) for a fair few years. Some people are able to balance their diet like I was but I had to do it carefully. My OH on the other hand was not in good health whilst on a vegetarian diet. I think some people are constitutionally able to be vegan/veggie and some aren't.

[DaveR]

"On the whole, vegetarians and vegans tend to be healthier long term than carnivores and live on average longer, and all the data supports that."

I'm not sure that's true.

"According to pure vegetarian ideologists, people consuming vegetarian diet have better health and live longer than nonvegetarians, because persons consuming milk, dairy products, meat, eggs and fish are at health risk. In fact the most healthy people in Europe are inhabitants of Iceland, Switzerland and Scandinavia, consuming great amounts of food of animal origin. Meta-analysis of several prospective studies showed no significant differences in the mortality caused by colorectal, stomach, lung, prostate or breast cancers and stroke between vegetarians and "health-conscious" nonvegetarians. In vegetarians, a decrease of ischemic heart disease mortality was observed probably due to lower total serum cholesterol levels, lower prevalence of obesity and higher consumption of antioxidants. Very probably, an ample consumption of fruits and vegetables and not the exclusion of meat make vegetarians healthful."

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19166134

[Blah Blah]

I don't disagree with you Dave. There's data supporting all sides, and we have to take into account other things such as pollution, genes and lifestyle too. All of which are increasingly difficult to measure.

But we know too much sugar, fat, protein etc has impacts.

Actually the most interesting research has been that into fasting! Undereating changes the way the bodies cells operate, and the thinking now is that people who undereat (not starvation of course) increase their life expectancy. When we eat enough our cells replace themselves, replicating even the damaged cells. But when we undereat, our cells go into repair mode. It's thought that repair makes the body less susceptible to cancer for example.

[Brendan]

El Pibe Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> "Bees aren?t animals"?

They're actually a type of fruit. Like hedgehogs.

[Seabag]

I think the recent BBC programe on meat-diet etc concluded that; a mainly vegetairian type diet, with a little meat/fish proved healthiest

Less that 70g of meat per serving

I like to add a garnish of live Bee's, where possible

[DulwichFox]

A couple with 4 kids may well think about having a Bee for Sunday lunch.

They are not very big but at least everyone gets a leg.

Foxy