first mate

James, Have you remembered your decision about double yellows on Chesterfield yet? I have given you all the information you need to find out, including an email from a council officer stating the date you were consulted. Your decision will also be on record.

I am really now understanding what RCH meant when she suggested democracy was dead in ED. It is now crystal clear that James and his Labour buddies cannot be trusted to listen or to learn. I also agree about use of the word "hysterical" to characterise the majority view...most revealing.

The only sensible thing is to look at the whole area of ED, not just one road. If perception is being used by Cllrs as a decision making tool then we should be clear that perceived levels of speeding on Melbourne are no different from many other streets. Are we going to block every street in ED? In my view perception is hardly grounds to spends large amounts of tax payers money. Facts are what we need, hard facts. Descriptions of the DCC, councillors attending and their MO leave a very bad taste in the mouth.

I tend to think that those who get deeply addicted to the game of politics are often the last people you want steering major decisions, however those types are generally very good at the game- they have a game playing mentality.

Robin, please name and shame that councillor or perhaps someone else can do it. Thank you for trying to represent the wider majority view and please keep at it. Have you ever thought about standing as an independent? You'd get my vote. It is also good to know that councillors read the forum; all the more reason to keep using this as a primary means of communication to get things done for the community.

Yes, M$S fine, no quibble with that but the proposal to add another story plonk a penthouse on top is somewhat different, if as many if us suspect, the aim is to avoid a social housing quota. James Barber had said the last application would be called in and so. I am wondering if this has happened or what the latest is?

There has been a lot of very noisy activity on the old Iceland site today. Does anyone know what happened with the penthouse application? The people living in the flats must have gone, but it should be noted that those floors cannot be used as office space as they have been inhabited for the last few years.

I just wondered if there was any further news on a completion date for this work? ....anyone?

Melbourneresident, I think there is appalling behaviour by drivers everywhere(cyclists too) and I am sure that many of us have been on the receiving end of it. I still feel something imaginative could be done with one policeman and a number of parking wardens. Drivers who drive at high speed through residential streets or who abuse pedestrians should be reported and fined/ points on licence. Word gets around when there are consequences.

James, you asked: Hi first mate, I receive around a 100 councillor emails a day. So I don't recall the email. Could you narrow it down to a time so I can retrieve it more easily please? My reply, posted from another thread but reposted here to avoid taking the other thread off subject: Hi James, look up around 10 April 2014, the date S'wark state you were consulted about double yellows on Chesterfield? Don't think I can be any more precise. i'd imagine an email search on that date with the keywords Chesterfield and double yellows might be fruitful? However you know more about IT and technology than me I am sure, so apologies if I am teaching granny to suck eggs. Please see below the email to you last month which states the date you were consulted about "new lengths of double yellows" on Chesterfield. Note the penultimate paragraph. I cannot think that you would require any more detail in order to respond to the very simple question, did you say "yes" or " no" to new "lengths of restrictions" that js, double yellow lines, when consulted on the matter on 10 April 2014? You seem to have omitted the name of the person that sent you the email below, but I am sure they could find your response when consulted on that date, that is 10 April 2014, were you to ask? Our Reference: 551054 ________________________________________ Dear Councillor Barber Thank you for your enquiry dated 12th August 2015, in which you requested information regarding yellow lines in the East Dulwich ward. I believe you are referring to the recent making and publication of a 'consolidation order'. The traffic order which has been advertised is known as a 'consolidation order' which is exactly this -a consolidation of existing traffic orders to ensure these remain manageable and easy to follow. This London Borough of Southwark (Waiting and loading restrictions) Consolidation Order 2015(1) ('the 2015 Order') consolidates the London Borough of Southwark (Waiting and loading restrictions) Consolidation Order 2012(2) ('the 2012 Order') together with the 60 subsequent amendment orders amending the provisions of the 2012 Order. It is deemed best practice (e.g. in guidelines issued by the British Parking Association) for local authorities undertaking decriminalised parking enforcement to regularly consolidate and maintain the traffic orders forming a basis for that enforcement. This follows the Consolidation Order process laid out in Regulation 21 of the Local Authorities? Traffic Orders (Procedure) (England and Wales) Regulations 1996 (Statutory Instrument 1996 No. 2489). There are no new restrictions being introduced by way of this consolidation order. The yellow lines you have specifically queried at Ashbourne and Chesterfield and Melbourne Grove were originally included in an order made on 8 May 2014 as part of the Lordship Lane area traffic order and sign decluttering review . The name of the Order was the London Borough of Southwark (Waiting and loading restrictions) (Amendment No. 32) Order 2014(3) ('the 2014 Order'). As part of our review process, surveys on street were undertaken by an officer to check that the road markings in existence matched the traffic orders. In the case of Ashbourne Grove and Melbourne Grove the traffic order waiting and loading definitions would have been amended to reflect more closely the markings as existed on street. Chesterfield Road had new lengths of restrictions installed at this time. Statutory stakeholders and ward members including yourself were consulted in the process of making the 2014 Order, on 10 April 2014. I trust this addresses your concerns but if you have any questions about this response please do not hesitate to contact me. " Edited 3 time(s). Last edit was today, 10:05am by first mate.

Post deleted and reposted on James Braber's thread to avoid taking this thread off subject.

Hi James, look up around 10 April 2014, the date S'wark state you were consulted about double yellows on Chesterfield? Don't think I can be any more precise. i'd imagine an email search on that date with the keywords Chesterfield and double yellows might be fruitful? However you know more about IT and technology than me I am sure, so apologies if I am teaching granny to suck eggs. Please see below the email to you last month which states the date you were consulted about "new lengths of double yellows" on Chesterfield. Note the penultimate paragraph. I cannot think that you would require any more detail in order to respond to the very simple question, did you say "yes" or " no" to new "lengths of restrictions" that js, double yellow lines, when consulted on the matter on 10 April 2014? You seem to have omitted the name of the person that sent you the email below, but I am sure they could find your response when consulted on that date, that is 10 April 2014, were you to ask? Our Reference: 551054 ________________________________________ Dear Councillor Barber Thank you for your enquiry dated 12th August 2015, in which you requested information regarding yellow lines in the East Dulwich ward. I believe you are referring to the recent making and publication of a 'consolidation order'. The traffic order which has been advertised is known as a 'consolidation order' which is exactly this -a consolidation of existing traffic orders to ensure these remain manageable and easy to follow. This London Borough of Southwark (Waiting and loading restrictions) Consolidation Order 2015(1) ('the 2015 Order') consolidates the London Borough of Southwark (Waiting and loading restrictions) Consolidation Order 2012(2) ('the 2012 Order') together with the 60 subsequent amendment orders amending the provisions of the 2012 Order. It is deemed best practice (e.g. in guidelines issued by the British Parking Association) for local authorities undertaking decriminalised parking enforcement to regularly consolidate and maintain the traffic orders forming a basis for that enforcement. This follows the Consolidation Order process laid out in Regulation 21 of the Local Authorities? Traffic Orders (Procedure) (England and Wales) Regulations 1996 (Statutory Instrument 1996 No. 2489). There are no new restrictions being introduced by way of this consolidation order. The yellow lines you have specifically queried at Ashbourne and Chesterfield and Melbourne Grove were originally included in an order made on 8 May 2014 as part of the Lordship Lane area traffic order and sign decluttering review . The name of the Order was the London Borough of Southwark (Waiting and loading restrictions) (Amendment No. 32) Order 2014(3) ('the 2014 Order'). As part of our review process, surveys on street were undertaken by an officer to check that the road markings in existence matched the traffic orders. In the case of Ashbourne Grove and Melbourne Grove the traffic order waiting and loading definitions would have been amended to reflect more closely the markings as existed on street. Chesterfield Road had new lengths of restrictions installed at this time. Statutory stakeholders and ward members including yourself were consulted in the process of making the 2014 Order, on 10 April 2014. I trust this addresses your concerns but if you have any questions about this response please do not hesitate to contact me. "

But surely S'wark and even the DCC would have known what would and would not be allowed by TFL before any works went ahead?

James Barber will know and perhaps it is he who should explain.

James, re the double yellows on Chesterfield, I am quoting the date you were consulted on this, that is the 10th April 2014. We know you were consulted on that date because that information is given in an email addressed to you from Southwark Council, that you chose to publish on this forum. It matters not if it was a DCC or some other means, all we know for sure is that you were consulted on that date. So, again, and I will keep asking, all I want to know is did you say "yes" to extended doubles on Chesterfield or did you say "no"? I am interested in your assertion about the busy wardens. I often see them around, parked up for lengthy periods in and around Lordhsip, monitoring life from the camera car, and others out on their scooters are never, it seems, too busy to miss dropping in on the carwash on the corner of LL for a "friendly" chat with the guys there. Yes, all that money from parking funds the good labours of the wardens but, a surplus you say? How about putting some of that money, or indeed all of it, to funding a police officer and wardens, dedicated to the speeding issue. A simple solution and one that might help us avoid digging up yet more roads to no avail or, heaven forfend, blocking them off completely.

One police officer could manage and oversee a number of community wardens who might be tasked with monitoring speed and car regs. this might be a better use of wardens who whizz around on scooters and lurk in camera cars for hours on end with the sole aim to catch out cars with a bumper one inch over double yellows. What is the cost of the parking wardens and the camera cars? BTW James, on the issue of double yellows you still have not come back to me about whether you supported increasing double yellow on Chesterfield Grove, April 10th 2014?!!!!!

"This last point we should note as this has been said to the Southwark planners many times. We should not let Southwark's errors and intransigence to be used as a way to bring back the right hand turn ban idea." hopskip, that is a very good point. In the agenda driven game of traffic chess, currently played by the Council and our Councillors, I can see their next move will be to state the road is unsafe in terms of coaches and therefore the only viable and cost effective solution is to ban the right hand turn. They and the Councillor/ s supporting this will find a way to blame TFL or some other body for the cockup. Except it is not a cockup, I still believe they have always had one aim and will achieve it, by whatever means. Could the Council be forced to reverse this work and reinstate the former road design? Perhaps RCH would know? This meddling and tinkering, supported by our local Councillors- the persons who are meant to represent us, has to stop.

Sue, I agree, though multiple roadworks in the area is surely contributing to driver frustration? If we total all the money being spent on works, studies, redesign, allocation of funds from CGS- wouldn't that money be better spent funding a few cops to stop speeding cars and issue tickets? Word tends to get around that proper penalties are on the cards. Have you looked at the quality of workmanship on Nx? Badly laid and stone cut to go around existing lights looks like jigsaw- perhaps measurements were also miscalculated, along with everything else.

Edhistory, How so? Please do explain?

Why is James Barber pushing the original proposition when a larger group of residents are clearly against it? I do not understand how our local rep is allowed to be so partial in matters which could have such a major impact on the area? We all know James personal views on cycling, cars, parking and so on but it does not seem right that he can use his position as a platform to push a minority agenda, when so many see it as folly.

LM, Yes,there was an agreement in 2008 where it was stated that Harris would not use Rye and bussing arrangements were outlined. However, James is right, in so far as I can see there was not a stipulation within the planning document, it was not thought necessary since it states that were the school to want to hire it would go through the same process as other schools that use the Rye- so in theory Harris could change its mind. see http://moderngov.southwarksites.com/Data/Planning%20Committee/20080702/Agenda/Item%206%20AddendumReport.pdf Savage, Yes it would seem it is about upsetting the apple cart, since it is clear that Harris could apply to use the Rye if they wanted. As I have said before, the fear is that over time sections of the park simply become subsumed by school activities, because the school is just over the road.

LM, Agreed. I think FPRP just want to ensure that the part of the park does not become an extension of the school. There is no danger of this happening with other schools as they are not close enough. If you saw the original design presentation fir the school it was mocked up in such a way that the Rye opposite the school looked like it was part if the school. Offers by the school to fund pitch management in return for use may look a good idea at first but over time it could prove tricky, since the school could begin to make claims around ownership of sections of the park. It seems quite clear that Harris entered into an agreement with S'wark planning in 2008 to build the school with the clear and unambiguous proviso that they would not use the Rye for school activities. Harris signed up to this in full knowledge and any parents signing up to the school would have been clear, as would Councillors. Detractors made repeated questions about lack of space at the school and were told by Harris and supporters that this was not an issue and everything had been covered and they were confident that all the recreational needs of the boys would be met in full. It seems that having agreed terms Harris decided on a very sneaky long game to overturn this agreement and getting Councillors and parents to protest in vague terms is very effective. I would just ask what that protest actually means in reality? Is it about having the same rights of access as other schools in principle? Or does Harris actually want to transfer all its sports activities from fields in Dulwich Village to the Rye? If the latter then I would think there is a strong chance other schools will be booted off by the newcomer, which happens to be in prime position. On the surface the situation does look unfair but I suspect a little detail might be quite revealing. It would be useful to know the detail, exactly what it is Harris and its supporters want in this case?

James, are you saying that the building work will not impact on Ldship Lane in any way?

Well done rch.

Okay James, so if it was changed would other schools that currently make use of the Rye have to travel further to other locations? if so does that seem fair? Yes the girls school uses the Rye but not that much, or so it seems. What do you have in mind for Harris Boys usage? For instance, how may hours per week and at what times and in what areas? How many areas would be used and how many numbers of boys at a time? Would the Rye be used just for set supervised games of for a variety of leisure activities? It is fine to make protests on principle but until we have detail and a sense of the logistics and what would be the aim, it is really hard to get a sense of what would be involved. Out of interest, once Harris ED is up and running, will they too want to make use of the Rye or even Goose Green- again, not much space on that site for play or recreation? I guess they will also be bussed to Dulwich Village? You bave been very involved with this application so feel sure you will know what is planned?