Controlled crying

[Fuschia]

Ruth: babies have shorter sleep cycles, hence often wake from naps after 45 mins or so.. IME this gradually stretches out, or you can resettle if they wake crying.

[Maki]

Just to share my experiences of CC.

When our baby was 7 months old or so she went through a period of waking up every 20 mins in the night and taking about 45 minutes to resettle. Of course after a month of this, I felt like I was actually a little crazy and went to the doc begging for happy pills! Instead she referred me to the sleep clinic and we were advised to do CC (they do not recommend this pre 8 months). We had tried ALL other methods. At some points we thought they were starting to work, but at that stage even 10 mins more sleep in an interval of sleep at that point was very exciting stuff!

Anyway, I went out as I couldn't face being there for the CC and it took my husband 2.5 hrs of leaving our baby to hysterically cry (being checked at increasing intervals). She slept for 4 hrs, woke up again and took an hour of CC to resettle. The next night took 30 mins and then she slept through.

Now she is 15 months and we have had to revert back to CC at least 5 times. Every time her routine is upset by teething/ holidays / other people putting her to bed, we have to re-do it.

It is SO hard to say whether given our experience I would choose to do the same thing again, but because I felt I was going mad I felt I had no choice. However, it is heart breaking. This is just my experience and other babies do not cry hysterically or for as long and may not need to have to go through CC more than once.

I would just say that unless you really are at your wits end, don't do it.

[Carrie]

With the proviso that my experience was some years ago now - but I would second the opinion that controlled crying does not work until they are over 8 months - I was referred to the sleep clinic when my twins were 6 months old and I had to return to work - despite getting no more than 45 minutes uninterrupted sleep at a time throughout the night. They told me then that they would not normally take on anyone whose baby was less than 9 months old but made an exception as my case was so bad!! Indeed the controlled crying technique did not work until they were nearly 9 months old when they first slept through the whole night( although I hasten to add that I did not leave them crying at night for 3 months!)

I had made the mistake of feeding them to sleep (initially it was much easier to cope that way) - so when they woke up they did not know how to get themselves back to sleep. The first stage was to switch the night time feeds from breast to bottle - then over time diluting the feeds more and more so that eventually they were just getting water. That had a dramatic effect on the number of times they woke up and the number of hours of uninterrupted sleep I could get, so by the time I did try the controlled crying technique I was much stronger mentally (and physically)

Do speak to your health visitor/gp and get a referral to the sleep clinic - it is a fantastic resource - and don't try controlled crying just yet - from what I have gathered your baby is just too young for it to work effectively and it will just shred your nerves even further when you are already at a low ebb from sleep deprivation.

I know a lot of people regard controlled crying in a negative light- but I can truthfully say that I have two happy, bright, loving 16 year old daughters who do not appear to have suffered in any way from their experience of controlled crying - and sometimes it becomes the only option left!

[intexasatthe moment]

I'll spare you the gory details of lack of sleep but my experience mirrors Maki's.

Sleep clinic when baby 10 months . Controlled crying .Some sleep .

Had to repeat process after any change in routine - teeth,illness ,trips away.

Maybe there's an optimum time to introduce CC ,obviously not too young when you're setting yourself up for lots of distress and failure ,but maybe not too old as well ?

[bigbob]

Ruth I was where you are, I felt worried about CC but was exhausted having had no sleep for months - littlebob woke every 90 mins for a comfort feed and would not sleep in the day even though I tried and tried and read every and I mean every book and tried the techniques and gave them all chance to work.

Also felt didn't want to do anything else but be led by him while he was very little.

In the end at about 8 months I did CC starting at bedtime after introducing a bedtime routine - 6.30 bath, PJs on in bedroom with lights dimmed, last feed, teeth, story, bed. I tried first the leaving then going back after few mins and checking method but found it very upsetting for me and him, so did the leaving method.

First night he cried for 40 mins (very very very hard but he was SUCH a bad sleeper as I say) I sat on the stairs and cried as well which looking back was a bit silly. Next night 30 min, then 20 min, 20 min, 10 min 10 min, 5 min and then just down to no mins - now he giggles and is pleased about it being bedtime AND naptime! He was still then waking twice a night for a feed and the time it took for him to go back to sleep after those feeds reduced in two nights and no crying after the 7pm routine started.

He then dropped the two night feeds on his own gradually and with no CC in about two weeks.

He was/is a small baby and slow gainer but his trajectory stayed exactly the same after he dropped night feeds which I had been worried about. Daytime naps also improved gradually after he had learned to settle himself to sleep.

I do see both sides of this debate but like you I was desperate and getting ill (tonsillitis and stuff) both from sleep deprivation and bf-ing all day and all night. You don't seem harsh at all!

good luck and look after yourself

[liberty]

This is such a difficult subject, because it is so hard to get it right. It never worked for me, and as I result, I felt that 50% of the time I was sleep depraved, and feeling very not with it. How can you be when you are always tired. I tried the controlled crying buy my daughter could cry for hours, literally. It was amazing how much energy she had. I thought she would get ill if she continued, but she was so head strong, and just did not give up. After a couple of hours of going back and forth, I gave in to her. This went on for ages. I really think it depends on the child. I suffered so many years, with it. And then when she started sleeping through the night, I got pregnant again....and it all started up again. DD no 2 was just the same. So it was really hard. Sadly this went on for year,s and then I go insommia. But the good news is I am better now.

[Saila]

sorry if i'm repeating someone but here goes...

our baby kept waking at 3am from about 6 wks old to 2.5mnths. I wasn't that sleep deprived by this one stop feed at 3am as he fed quite quickly. However at 2.5months old we moved him into his own room. He slept through two nights later for the first time and has ever since. We also swaddled him at first to stop his jerky arm movements waking himself up.

I put him down awake from the very beginning (gina ford advice) and at first he did cry for 5-10mins or so b4 going to sleep. If longer it was because he was still hungry. Now he doesn't cry at all when he's put down, just winges a little and falls asleep.

Oh and the baby monitor on LOW sensitivty really helped too!

i think they're not meant to have more than 4 hours during the day (7am-7pm) at about 3months?? saying that mine sleeps a little longer cos he neeeds more than the average baby his age it seems. I do go on his signals like that 'coughing cry' which tells me he's getting tired.

Much more than 4hrs can disrupt their nighttime sleep apparently.

This is all very GF but it has really worked for me and the baby's seems very happy with it

[anna75]

let me throw my experience which may be atypical but otoh may be useful.

1. we had no clue what we were doing with our first child.

2. she led everything and we responded to her "requests" - too quiet and squeaky to be termed demands.

3. she got herself through the night around 7 weeks which we thought a fluke. however it kept repeating night after night after night.

same with our other child though second time round obviously we knew a bit more.

my theory is FOR OUR CHILDREN AT LEAST - shock horror - IT HAS LITTLE TO DO WITH HOW MUCH THEY EAT !!

i think it is more to do with melatonin production by the pineal gland. when our ch were not eating owing to injections or terrible snuffles for exmaple, they still got through the night, to our utter surprise.

now, applying this to Ruth's baby....I'm less sure.

a lot of walks in the light during the day perhaps?

PS Ruth, I am truly sorry you are going through this. I cldn't do it. I know that for sure. I take my hat off to you. xx

[Ruth_Baldock]

Well, is a bit of an update called for? I think so...

Sebastian is now able to, mostly, settle himself IN HIS COT (and sometimes pram) in the day for his naps, no problem. We're following baby whisperer's E.A.S.Y routine, and it is working really well...in the day. In the evening, this happens:

-Bath at 6pm, tummy time and small breast feed, in bed by 6.45pm

-7pm, finally drops off to sleep after a bit of chatting/whining.

-9pm wakes up, usually has another feed, or a small cuddle, falls asleep again within 15 mins.

-11.40pm- wakes up and will not re-settle. He has also got into the habit of crying hyterically, like he's really sad and upset and distraught when he wakes up- so much so that last night both DH and myself ran upstairs when we heard him crying like that. He's got us wrapped around his teeny tiny little finger, thats for sure.

Basically, he thinks that after every period of sleep there is a period of getting up for play/cuddles. If I can 'crack' this habit of his at night time,we should be home and dry...

Still, things ARE looking up and there is hope, I am trying to stay more positive. I don't think CC will ever work for us, and Sebastian knows it, the cheeky monkey!!

[alieh]

Ruth, I have a baby Sebastian too and a cheeky sleeper - maybe it comes with the name??

But sounds like you're doing brilliantly. We had great luck with the EASY thing during the day too - some weeks better than others, but overall it worked for us.

It sounds like you're doing the right thing for your baby by responding quickly in the evenings, but just keep on with making sure your response at those times reinforce nighttime (dark, quiet, shushing, etc.) and he'll eventually get the hint.

One thing that we discovered was that a 7 pm was too late at that age for our Sebastian. It may be contributing to making him more unsettled in the evening - i.e. he drops off knackered at 7 pm but is overtired and so has the adrenaline going when he wakes at 11 pm. You could try bringing bedtime forward a bit, skipping bath if necessary? You could also try gradually pushing that 9 pm feed a teeny bit later every day, so cuddle for a bit first then feed at 9:30 or 10:00, which might help him get over that 11:30 pm hump.