Digital ID

[CPR Dave]

19 minutes ago, malumbu said:

And gov is proposing cards for those with no smart phones.  

Why? Why not just accept driving licence cards or passports as we do already?

Anyway this is good to know. I will get my "Digital ID" in paper form and the government can stay out of my business on my phone.

Edited September 29 by CPR Dave

[Earl Aelfheah]

1 hour ago, Insuflo said:

It plays into the notion that immigration is the greatest threat facing this country and the root of all problems- it is not.

This is my main objection. I don't like the rhetoric. In terms of a 'digital ID', we already have one effectively, they're just formalising it / giving it a name. 

[malumbu]

@Insuflo

Couldn't agree more - the whole focus on immigration.  Wrote to Ellie yesterday on this saying in my peer group there are more important issues.

Don't necessarily agree on other things you have posted but this is the forum at its best having real debate 

[Sephiroth]

1 hour ago, CPR Dave said:

The other extremely inept political approach in the delivery of this policy, out of the blue, was calling it a BritCard and somehow expecting Irish citizens working in Northern Ireland to get on board with the idea. 

Yep.  Yet completely in keeping with this mad post-Brexit country 

58 minutes ago, Insuflo said:

Not if you remember the introduction of the Poll Tax. It galvanised a massive opposition, which eventually persuaded the Tories to bin Thatcher. It could be an anti-Starmer /Reeves focus within the labour movement.

Yeah but the poll tax was manifestly unfair financially where the richest millionaire paid same as a single pensioner in a one bed flat 

this id thing is just… hysterical 

[Spartacus]

I think digital id is potentially a good thing, number of reasons for that.

Eventually it will encompass services you already have from the goverment, your driving licence,  you NI number, your gov gateway (all obvious extensions) 

Services like photo card driving licences have already proved to have flaws, including Mr Smith, who looks similar to Mr Green,  passing Mr Greens test to get Mr Green a "dodgy" dtiving licence as an example. 

Digital id may also ensure only people entitled to NHS care get it and health tourists pay to use our health service. 

However, whilst I think.its a good idea, social media will ensure it is still born. Over the weekend I've seen so many anti digital id posts, including Kier as Davros leading the Labour Daleks (did make me chuckle) , comparisons to 1984 and even a song about it. Someone posted "what would happen if we all refused to sign up" and how within 31 days it would topple the government. 

Will it actually happen maybe , but I have a feeling, like most things whatever way it goes both sides will again employ project fear and misinformation. 

Edited September 29 by Spartacus

[Angelina]

we need more information - the actual facts on intended use and benefits - now and in the future, otherwise we're just speculating

[David Peckham]

2 hours ago, malumbu said:

A citizen poll put it at 37 for and 32 against.

 

That's why I said 'in some form' - that figure increases to 57% when asked if they were in favour of a 'National ID Card', rather than a digital one on their phone.

That suggests a couple of things to me: firstly that the majority of people aren't mad enough to rebel over a perceived Orwellian assault on their civil liberties and, secondly, that 20% of people are worried about someone sussing that they've been looking at 'BigTits.Com' or some-such on their mobile.

[alice]

3 hours ago, malumbu said:

It will, the extent and whether it is worth it is of course another question. 

Well I say it won’t for those who work ‘ cash in hand’

 

 

[malumbu]

I don't think it is simple as that.  Firstly many people born in the UK and legally allowed to live in the UK work for cash be it all of their working time or mates rates.

Digital ID will make it easier to prove that someone is not legally allowed to work in the UK.  It will also help where a company has an agreement with an individual who may be legal but permitted to sell on hours to others.  And for those using fake driving licenses hiring mopeds to do deliveries. Obviously you have to catch them at it. 

How much  of a deterrent this is to dodgy and reputable employers, and those with no right to work in the UK is unclear.  But that question will be asked.

On a separate matter poll tax was an awful idea and many in the then Tory party were not in board.  This is not in the same league.

And to go political how are you going to get your takeaways if there is nobody to make them and deliver them? Will be good for the more ethical companies.  

[alice]

M you say my answer is simplistic but you haven’t explained why people who work cash in hand (whether they’re legally entitled to work or not) how will they be scooped up by this new ID card system? They won’t. they’re working outside that system.

[Spartacus]

2 hours ago, malumbu said:

And to go political how are you going to get your takeaways if there is nobody to make them and deliver them? Will be good for the more ethical companies.  

Blimey 

Digital id solves the obesity crisis 🤣

[Angelina]

It’s about data. Data is money. Don't be fooled about it being to control illegal workers. It’s not.

Can you imagine the world in twenty years time?

A lot changes in a short time, in ways you cannot imagine

[Sephiroth]

I’m glad we still barter for everything 

 

no wait.  We write cheques now 

 

- taps nose - 

[jazzer]

its called a PASSPORT, you know, that thing with biometric data, no digi id needed

[CPR Dave]

Well the politics of this, inevitably, has proved entirely unpalatable for the general public. 

35% of voters approved of a digital ID scheme in the summer. 

Since Starmer imposed his forced ID scheme, the net approval rating has plummeted to -14%. Let me spell that out. Minus fourteen per cent of voters want his Brit Card.

 

The Guardian blame this on the Prime Minister and his "reverse Midas touch".

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/oct/01/keir-starmer-labour-collapse-public-support-digital-id-cards

[Angelina]

Is Blair involved or not. Strong denials

[jazzer]

But his son designed it, so effectively YES. 

[Angelina]

And the donation to Blair’s Insitution? 

It stinks.

Talk about the “create a problem then sell the solution” trick. We don’t need id cards. Yet, make them compulsory, certain investors make millions, but whose money is it? What could that money be better used for?

 

 

[David Peckham]

3 hours ago, CPR Dave said:

Well the politics of this, inevitably, has proved entirely unpalatable for the general public. 

35% of voters approved of a digital ID scheme in the summer. 

Since Starmer imposed his forced ID scheme, the net approval rating has plummeted to -14%. Let me spell that out. Minus fourteen per cent of voters want his Brit Card.

 

The Guardian blame this on the Prime Minister and his "reverse Midas touch".

https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2025/oct/01/keir-starmer-labour-collapse-public-support-digital-id-cards

I've got to disagree with your numbers there - you're comparing apples and oranges.

Support for the scheme has reduced from 53% prior to Starmer's announcement to 35% after it, opposition to it has increased from 19% to 49%, but 35% of the public still support it, not -14%. That is impossible + the lowest it could be is 0%. Net approval has decreased from +34% to -14%.

The Guardian story seems like a hatchet job on Starmer's popularity and it makes you wonder what their agenda is, given the rumours around a leadership challenge.

Starmer has clearly done a f*cking dreadful job on articulating any benefits of the system - if, indeed, there are any - but he's not helped by unverified social media stories about the involvement of Blair's son, stories which have been denied by all parties involved.

Edited October 1 by David Peckham

[CPR Dave]

1. They are not my numbers.

2. You are comparing different surveys to obfuscate. I assume that is deliberate.

3. The only mathematical complaint you might have had is that 53% minus 19% is a +34% approval rather than +35%. I assume that was down to an earlier rounding error that worked in the government's favour.

[paco]

On 29/09/2025 at 11:02, malumbu said:

Whilst instinctively I'm against this I already have a government ID, pay my taxes through this, renew my passport and driving licence.

Polling suggests a slight majority will support this 

It would be good to get views on the concept rather than the politics.

Let's see how long that lasts!

We can talk the politics at the Forum drinks.

When do the forum drinks take place?