What the Dulwich Estate is doing to Herne Hill

[Tessmo]

Neighbouring Herne Hill - community action is live and well...

http://www.hernehill.org.uk/news/herne-hill-cross-roads

[Earl Aelfheah]

Edward Alleyn must be spinning in his grave.

[nxjen]

rahrahrah Wrote:

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> Edward Alleyn must be spinning in his grave.

People keep saying this but he was of a very different age and the provisions he made were for the circumstances of the early 17th century. Whilst being concerned about Edward Alleyn's sensibilities, it might be well to consider that he was a successful businessman whose interests included brothels. He was also the "master of the king's games of bears, bulls and dogs" that is he organised the cruel and barbaric "entertainments" of bear- and bull- baiting.

[edhistory]

The Herne Hill "blog" has the Dulwich Estate raising the rent of one shop only.

Details are on the Hindwoods site www.hindwoods.co.uk

It is not a rent increase as can be seen from the sales particulars.

John K

[mikeb]

John - not sure what you mean. On Hindmans, 18 Half Moon Lane is for rent at ?42k p.a. for new FRI lease. How can you tell the rent hasn't gone up? or are you talking about a different property?

[Jeremy]

Don't see the point of a petition to retain a music venue. It's a classic case of use it or lose it - as much as you may like the idea of a local venue, not enough people used it.

[Jah Lush]

Jeremy there are times when you come across as a complete philistine and this is one of those times.

[Jeremy]

Ignoring your uncalled-for aggression... I used to go to loads of gigs (from when I was a teenager, up to when I became a family man and my social life went down the pan). I've also played in quite a few bands, including touring bands. So I certainly don't mean to come across as unappreciative of music or the value of socialising..

Music venues are disappearing around the country mainly for two reasons - property development, and people not going out to watch live music. The former can be countered to an extent by community action (assets of community value, etc), but any arts facility can only exist when enough people want to use it. I went to quite a few gigs at the Half Moon from 2000 onwards, I think I've only seen it busy once.

[Otta]

He has a point. The music / comedy part of the pub was hardly full (or even open) every night and bringing the custom in to keep the place going.

[Otta]

Cross posted.

[Jah Lush]

*Sighs*

The OP wasn't about the Half Moon in particular but about the increase in rents by Network Rail and Dulwich estates on independent traders in Herne Hill.

[Jeremy]

Sorry - the link (in the OP) mentions the venue at the Half moon a few times, and includes a link to a petition. That is the bit I was specifically referring to. I can't help thinking that if people had used it more, then the new owner would realise that it was worth keeping. And a petition wouldn't be necessary.

On the plus side, at least in HH you're in walking distance to places like the Hootananny and the excellent Windmill, and various other pubs that have music.

[snowy]

The Half Moon doesn't have a new owner - it's got a new lease (a pub chain). Dulwich Estates remain the owner.

The previous landlord had opened up the back room again and had it full on a monthly basis. With completely different programming to the Windmill / Hoot.

The Dulwich Estate wanted to refurb the upper floors into flats. Southwark turned down their request for planning permission to do this.

The link to the wider Herne Hill / DE / Network Rail petition is here: https://www.change.org/p/dulwich-estates-dulwich-estates-to-behave-reasonably-and-charge-reasonable-rents?recruiter=229090021&utm_source=share_petition&utm_medium=copylink

[Otta]

snowy Wrote:

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> The previous landlord had opened up the back room

> again and had it full on a monthly basis. With

> completely different programming to the Windmill /

> Hoot.

Once a month is not great business for the pub.

[snowy]

That didn't matter. He was making money off the bar / food, and then experimenting as to whether there was a market for the back room - it was a time when HH was a little quieter than it is now.

[Jeremy]

If the back room can be viable then great, I would be really happy to see it survive. But they need some kind of plan to draw more punters - either that or reduce the size of the room (e.g. The Cavendish in Stockwell).

[Otta]

snowy Wrote:

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> That didn't matter. He was making money off the

> bar / food, and then experimenting as to whether

> there was a market for the back room

That was my point really. The music and comedy element would be most welcome but wouldn't be enough alone unless you had a really really dedicated promoter that never slept.

[Seabag]

snowy Wrote:

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> That didn't matter. He was making money off the

> bar / food, and then experimenting as to whether

> there was a market for the back room - it was a

> time when HH was a little quieter than it is now.

Zzzzz you work at a desk for 'someone' yes ?

[snowy]

Sorry, you're being a bit too oblique for me to understand seabag!

I do in fact work at a desk for 'someone' but that someone is nothing to do with DE / Fullers / the half moon / anything to do with the hospitality industry. Apologies if you thought I was some sort of schuck for someone with a vested interest.

I wasn't seeking a row - just perhaps carrying over some annoyance from another local forum, where people who didn't know the area of the background were deciding what would be right and wrong for the pub and that bit of HH.

[Otta]

snowy Wrote:

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> carrying over some annoyance from another local forum, where people who didn't know the area of the

> background were deciding what would be right and wrong for the pub and that bit of HH.

Was that the Herne Hill forum then?

[snowy]

haha, nope!