LondonMix

i-rate, when you say they will lose their jobs "there" did they indicate they were being given the opportunity to transfer to other stores? It is sad. Hopefully, whatever becomes of the shop will generate at least equivalent new employment.

I agree. There are people on Mumsnet and an article in the telegraph that claim creating a basic mezzanine out of a loft is a few thousand (mumsnet said 3k). Given the work involved this seems incredible.

To all of our ED architects and builders, I was wondering if anyone has ever created a mezzanine floor and how costly this is? I've seen articles saying to create one out of some of your loft space is just a few thousand pounds but somehow that seems too good to be true!

Do you know what will happen to the shop? Hopefully it won't be left vacant.

Health Involvement, thanks for the update.

References to the Nazis in the context of this conversation are wholly uncalled for! I agree with Bob. I am unfortunate enough to know someone who has committed suicide and have a few friends / family who have been suicidal at different points in their lives. Your ideas about a very complex mental health issue are far too simplistic. Again, anything can tip a suicidal person over the edge. Your idea of justice would require us to investigate and arrest scores of people every time a suicide occurred, particularly as you are including events that are only the straw pushing someone over the edge.

I agree. It's a pretty big leap to assume that just because they are puerile that they wouldn't be disturbed by someone's death. The fact that they did this prank doesn?t suggest that they are sociopaths in and of itself. DJKillaQueen Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Michael Palaeologus Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > "The DJs were devastated", actually "Gutted" > was > > the elegant phrase that they used. > > > > Of course they are gutted, their career is at > an > > end and they have to answer questions about > their > > conduct. Gutting indeed. > > That's a very cynical repsonse to what seemed to > me genuine distress from the DJs.

Try taking the tube to Blackfriars. Its about an extra 8 minutes further along than getting off at Victoria. Then from there you can take a train to Demark Hill that takes 10 minutes. Overall your journey (if you time it right) shouldn't be materially longer. Good luck! LM Hilbs Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I am sadly one of those who have lost the Victoria > connection. Going to work in the morning seems to > be ok, as I can still get on the Kent trains, but > the evening is a different story. Having done a > bit of research it seems that once the last Kent > train goes from Victoria through Denmark Hill at > 19.39 I just can't get back that way. My > alternative seems to be Olympia to CJ and then the > ELL to DH (work in West Kensington), which I > reckon is going to add a good 30 mins to my > journey in the evening. Anybody got any thoughts?

The council are providing grants for shops on the south-end of LL to smarten up signage etc. Its part of a regeneration scheme. Stevelock Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Lordship Lane needs a Marks and Sparks food hall > instead of the Co Op if you ask me. There are also > far too many indian restaurants? a petition for > signage should be drawn up so that all outlets > have a well designed, tasteful sign. Most do but > the odd one here and there stands out like a sore > thumb and lets the side down. This would improve > the image of the lane and make ed even more > desirable with a simple cosmetic facelift such as > signage. A good sign and shop front should be > consistent throughout the lane

I doubt that helped her mental well-being...

Does anyone know what the punishment is for bullying as a form of harrasment and how easy it is to make a case?

Yes agree entirely with your post. That others can harm the mental well-being of others intentionally or unintentionally I think we all can acknowledge (parents, institutions, etc can all be culpable of that). Being criminally culpable for a suicide I think is a very different thing all together though.

The Italian place on Melbourne grove is good, cheap and does yummy pizzas. ED needs another nursury. An American breakfast / brunch place would be cool as would a steakhouse.

Exactly! At least the thread has moved on from debating the merits of throwing the DJs in jail... ???? Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > 'much better now' is confidential patient > information in the same way that 'she's dead' > would have been

Yes, that would be negligent homicide (a much reduced form of sentence) and would be a criminal offence because it is a foreseeable consequence of that action. Pulling a prank of this nature does not have suicide as a foreseeable consequence by any stretch of the imagination. Based on your logic, whenever anyone committed suicide an investigation would need to be launched and anyone who may be deemed to have made that person unhappy in anyway should be arrested. Do you hear how insane that sounds! Can you imagine a world that operated this way? Michael Palaeologus Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Somebody gets in car and drives along quite > safely, they answer their mobile phone, they run > somebody over. > > Of course they didnt mean to run the person over, > they didnt leave the house intending to harm > anybody. However their actions in answering the > phone contributed to them hurting somebody. > Therefore there is jeopardy. > > This is not a "draconian eye for eye nonsense", > dont be simplistic. This is people being > responsible for the impact of what they do. > > As Quids notes, phoning a Hospital to seek > information about a Patient is wrong. That it then > may have led, in part, to a suicide, should be > investigated and if it is found to have a causal > link to the death, there is jeopardy. > > I do not think that they are entirely culpable, I > think that they may be partly culpable because > their prank and its broadcasting was bullying.

That's not how the law works. Culpability is in part determined by intent and reasonable foreseeable consequence. What you are describing is some kind of draconian, unthinking "eye for an eye" nonsense. Michael Palaeologus Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > We seem to be swinging wildly from one extreme to > another - the 21st Century culture of blame is > wrong ergo, nobody is to blame. Twaddle. > > You cant legislate pranks out of existance, but > you can ensure that people know that if they cause > harm, there is jeopardy. The degree of jeopardy is > dependent on the degree of harm caused. > > If no harm is caused, there is no jeopardy, if > somebody kills themselves, then there is jeopardy. > Not hard for anybody to understand and factor into > their decision whether to prank or not to prank. > > Similar to any other part of adult life. Act > sensibly, you are fine. Act like a cock and cause > harm, you are not fine. > That being the case, it is up to any given adult > to make their own decision. > > As you say their is a direct implication of > causality, albeit unproven. That is for the Police > to investigate. I believe that if causality is > proven, then there should be jeopardy for > perpetrators of the prank. If there is no causal > link, there is no jeopardy. However, if the latter > scenario is the case, perhaps they will think > twice before they prank again.

Very interesting. Thanks for the book recommendation!

Yes, until fairly recently academies were associated with being poor and in a neighborhood with failing schools-- hence the snobbery.

Anything about her medical condition or treatment qualifies. The appropriate response is, ?I cannot discuss her medical condition with you (unless she has given the hospital express permission to do so with specifically named people).? It's an entirely black and white issue. That is the only response I would ever expect my doctor / nurse to provide to anyone without my permission. Regarding the rest of this circus, while the prank was nasty and puerile, I think the nurse?s suicide was in no way a foreseeable consequence. If it does change the public?s attitude about the appropriateness of these kinds of pranks, that at least will be something though. StraferJack Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > have I missed the piece where they were trying to > "obtain confidential medical information" in the > call? > > http://www.nydailynews.com/entertainment/gossip/tr > anscript-djs-prank-call-london-nurse-article-1.121 > 5498 > > it's hardly asking for a fax of the records is it?

Good point and agree entirely. srisky Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Just to clarify the point about breaching > confidentiality - Kate Middleton may well have > given permission for certain information about her > condition to be passed on to certain people. If > the staff only divulged information according to > her explicit wishes then they haven't breached > confidentiality. Whether they followed protocol on > how to identify the caller is a different matter. > > > Attempting to obtain confidential medical > information under false pretence is beyond a prank > regardless of the subsequent turn of events.

Agree, in the rush hour 15-20 min is totally impossible womanofdulwich Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > If you have ever got to Victoria mainline station > at 8.20 am and thought you could just get on the > victoria line- believe me its not that easy- > queues/ platforms closed until queues clear. It > can take at least 10 mins from getting off the > train to getting on to the victoria line train > north bound.:(

If you look at the dept of education statistics you will see that ALL Harris Academies have value add scores above 1,000 that have been open long enough to have exam results. These include: ED Harris Girls, Harris Academy at Peckham, Harris Academy Crystal Palace, Harris Academy Bermondsey, Harris Academy Merton, Harris Academy South Norwood, Harris Academy Falconwood, and Purley. ED Boys, Chafford, Beckenham, Morden, Coleraine Park, Philip Lane, and Bromley don't yet have scores as they haven't been open long enough. Below are the Dept of education statistics backing this up. The dept of education calculate value add stats for English an Math combined so I don't know how the article you linked to purports to have just the English results anyway: http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=134225 http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=135311 http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=131747 http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=131897 http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=135249 http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=135677 http://www.education.gov.uk/cgi-bin/schools/performance/school.pl?urn=135955 Edited to add: I may be guilty of many things but presenting facts that are untrue without carefully reading or checking them is not one of them. I know my last statement to you was strong but you have (most likely unintentionally) done this several times on this thread (misquoting someone's salary, funding arrangements, claiming a company was making profit that wasn't etc etc etc) and I felt it was time to call you out on it is all.

Fuschia, if you read the article carefully, the stats you are quoting are for English value add only not all GCSEs... The article doesn't choose to present the value add score across both Math and English (which is the standard measure!) for whatever reason. The progress statistic is significant and is often correlated to the total Math and English value add scores. When looking at ED Harris Girls, (which has a very high value add score) the most significant progress was being made in math which suggests that Harris may or may not be better at progressing pupils in Math than English. The article provides incomplete information but what it does present shows that Harris is performing above national averages when Math and English are both taken into account. Again, that in and of itself is not all that is necessary to support Harris but please get your facts right.

Cooperation with the LA is important. Renata, is the reason you favour expanding Dulwich Hamlet (if that's true) despite it being an academy as well due to the fact you have found them easy to work with? How many extra places could be created via the expansion of Dulwich Hamlet and how would this be achieved? Would we still need to rely on bulges?

Yes, I am neither criticising businesses or government for the tax situation. I am only saying its hypocritical for the authorities to pretend they are "shocked!" by what's going on now. Government certainly take into account the income tax, VAT and national insurance revenue generated by the business community in determining what they think is the most beneficial tax policy for the country.