Huguenot

Have they been eating cake again? It's not nutritious and there's always the threat of type 2 diabetes, do they need to make work for themselves these days?

Suffolk?

Oystercard is a TFL related scheme for integrated transport within London, whereas the rail franchises are the responsibility of the Department for Transport. When the last tender for South Central came up a few years ago Red Ken was firmly on the govt.'s no Christmas card list and so Oystercard was not included as part of the franchise terms. Govt. policy has now changed and the current South Western franchise has the inclusion of Oystercard facilities as a pre-requisite for the winning bid. Hence on the SW area (trains running in and out of Waterloo to the south coast mostly) you'll see Oystercard facilities up and running by 2009. Sadly although we can expect to see Oystercard on all new London-based franchises, the South Central area doesn't come up for re-tender until 2009 earliest. Since I can't see GoVia spending cash on the installation of something that wasn't in their franchise bid (their shareholders would do their nuts), and I can't see the govt. allowing Red Ken to force them to renegotiate their franchise contracts over something that would make him look good, I can't see Oystercard coming to ED before 2010. The alternative would be for TFL to fund the installation, maybe that's what all these daft Venezuelan oil contracts are intended to find the money for?

I blame the trades unions.... ;-)

Smashing! What do you think of West Ham's current form?

Bob's got a point. If there's a mean and spiteful exchange on the forum Quaywe's always a part of it, pretending he's not. However he does add a certain thrill, and I know the site would be a less interesting place without him; he only tells us because he cares. He doesn't realise when he's being hurtful ;-)

After the substantial local trader pressure against the parking limitations on LL imposed a couple of years ago, can anyone give us actual details about the impact on commercial revenues? It seems an improvement to me?

Ham? That's Boxing Day shorely...? There should be legislation!

If we date them by the films, the first is Lionel's Bart's Oliver - dating this to 1968. The second one was a Town Like Alice, released in 1956. The final one must be the earliest - Ingrid Bergman in Joan of Arc would date this to 1948!!

Seconded anyone? Not up for consideration is the People's Independent Secular State of Peckham's Outer Territories

How about William 'Bonkers' Blake. We could celebrate the now sadly discontinued tradition of 9 year old boys taking heroin on Peckham Rye with a swerving bronze opium poppy. Our lives are less colourful as a result. Bring back the Angels. Or indeed William Joyce used to stamp his ground at ED before being hanged for the niggling oik that he was. We could commemorate his fleeting career as Lord Haw Haw with a substantial bakelite radio. This would no doubt send a riotously independent signal to the rest of the nation. On the subject of quislings, independence and exile, Henry St John, 1st Viscount Bolingbroke, notorious peacemonger and frenchie-lover was sometime owner and resident of Friern Manor. It is on these hallowed lands that the majority of ED is built. As with Blake, he also took his turn cavorting naked on the park. As with Joyce he sowed some of his diseased garlick-munching discord from comfort overseas. We could and should celebrate his republicanism and influence on both the American revolution and US constitution with an internally lit fibre-glass Dubya sporting hooped shirt, baguette & onions shouldering a US flag and waving a pilgrim's hat. Yes, turn in your graves you yankee monkees, without ED you would be nothing. In fact I propose the creation of the Bolingbroke Blake Society as a vehicle for ED dissidence, heavy drinking and a focus for the establishment of the Republic of East Dulwich. We could embark on a series of goodwill capers designed to demonstrate the smiling face of the people's nation. It could, of course, exist independently of the National Monument at Goose Green Roundabout

History of North Cross Road? I understand the Dulwich / ED area was originally various manors formed when church lands were handed back to the gentry/layworker social institutions after the dissolution of the monasteries by big Harry the Eighth (in this case it was Bermondsey Abbey that got plundered). Lordship Lane was named after the boundary of two of these 'lordships' - Dulwich to the west and Camberwell Friern to the East. Camberwell Buckingham was to the north of East Dulwich Road (hence one could describe the roundabout at Goose Green as the centre of Camberwell, and not the 'mistake' of labelling that some locals attribute to the council sign that was once there). Nutfield Road, delivering the first few yards of North Cross Road was the first housing development of the area in Georgian times, but further development was handicapped by richer residents who prevented the growth of public transport into the area to keep out the riff-raff, The northern end of the Friern Manor (facing onto Goose Green) was developed in Georgian times into large upmarket houses with huge back gardens. The last of these can be seen standing opposite the Codfather at the north end of Oakhurst Grove. It's much reworked and hacked about. The old manor house of Friern was at the location now occupied St. Clement's Church on Friern Road. The Manor House had been sometime home of Lord Henry Bolingbroke (of the Treaty of Utrecht fame), and later became a dairy farm of almost 200 cattle before being flogged to the British Land Company in 1865. As unashamed property speculators, the BLC tried to ram as many house as possible onto the land they'd acquired over the next 15 years. The results were the extraordinary rectangular streets and densely packed houses of Fellbrigg and Ulverscroft etc. I understand the north end of this development was the south side of North Cross road. Hence these weren't originally developed as shops - and the areas immediately in front were the front gardens. This is why the walking area in front of ED, Anterior Trading etc. is part paved, part tarmacadam. The buldings north of North Cross road were conversely built piece-meal by small time developers following the wobbly lines of the gardens they bought from the Georgian houses on Goose Green. They built 3-20 houses at a time. Hence the north side of North Cross Road is more haphazard and loads of curvy roads like Crawthew and Worlingham. The whole of Oakhurst Grove was built on one garden to the west and another to the east. The whole ED area was struggling for decades with 25% vacant houses. Eventually the introduction of "workmen's" commuter-time rail tickets on the Southern Railway in 1904 made it a viable working class commuter belt, and it started to grow. The prosperity was short-lived as the first of two world wars less than ten years later messed up the place again, and the small shops had only just started to function normally again post-World War II and post-rationing by the time the first supermarket opened in 1962. They once more trashed the local (chain) stores that had been struggling to endure since being built 70 years before. If this is all true, one could make a pretty good case that North Cross Road and LL is just beginning to see its first ever period of sustained prosperity. The boutique shops are holding their own against the might of the supermarkets, and have a locality that is sufficiently densely populated to sustain them. It has certainly never had much of a 'heyday' to look back on! Was that what you wanted to know?

Hmm, with a history like that they sound a little scary. Anyone up for a quick knock and run?

How about Timothy Spall squabbling with a rearing Gloucestershire Old Spot? He's a local boy and I'm sure Peckham Rye was one massive pig farm? Perhaps there are other more erudite local historical figures we could have earnestly reading books on a concrete pedestal with the ED name? Failing that, if we go more mainstream I like the big vic signpost, but I reckon we need something that says 'you are here, and here is somewhere special' as well as guiding visitors elsewhere... This bloke on a bicycle's quite cool can't we pretend Elgar came from ED and nick this?

Ermm - not sure: the large house on the opposite corner to Uplands Pub and Plantnation (North East/Peckham side of the junction). Wholesale hairdressing supplies?? Bah! Hardly seems worth the level of protection they've got. Are you sure you're not part of the conspiracy? Have you had visitors late at night? That would still leave the chimneys and the bricked-up house... ;-)

When we link through a forum, can we link through to the most recent post rather than the first? It aids a quick ctach-up on the dialogue - and worked well when we did it on our Beijing forum (I'm back home now though!).

What are the symbols for East Dulwich, and what's the focal point? I can't think of any. There's no statue, no bandstand, no monolithic building... what could you put on the masthead for this forum that would be an instant identifier for the village? My vote is for installing a classic, timeless bit of sculpture on the goose green roundabout. None of that socialist claptrap with stainless steel representations of the dancing proletariat of course.... and no big plastic cats.

Crikey - with the Hazchem sign does that mean they're selling chemical weapons too...?

Apart from ending the peculiar debate on whether GBK is a bad thing if it belongs to a chain, and a good thing if not, there is one thing that would add substantively to improve thriving East Duwlich... knocking down those shocking buildings that house Somerfield, the Haart - Winkworth arcade, and the particular monstrosity that is Icelend. Can't we petition someone, walk in circles waving placards or something? These aren't cutsie East Dulwich with boutique stores, this is bloody Hitchin through and through... Affirmative action... to the streets my friends!!!

Here's a few for you: On the junction of Upland Road and Crystal Palace Road is a large well-protected house, with huge gates, anti-climb fencing and reflective windows. It has no identifier apart from the sign 'HAZCHEM' on the hefty front door. Is there any substance to the rumour it's an MI5 safe-house? B) On the corner of Friern Road and Peckham Rye is a large upraised area populated by around 200 tiny concrete chimneys. Is it true that each of these is the sole entrance to a 4x4 cell designed specifically to house people who cheat in online best bar polls? At 238 Peckham Rye is an attractive double-fronted family home where all the windows have been senselessly bricked up. It also smells slightly of poo. Is it possible that this is the new home for East Dulwich's very own Miss Whiplash, and is well frequented as a local crack den for MPs? As you can tell, I need these questions resolved urgently... ;-)