JoeLeg

Nah, that was pure Keith Richards!

Yeah, I really hope you're right Foxy. Because one thing I always felt about East Dulwich (and remember I've lived here almost all my life), is that racism isn't particularly prevalent (given the proviso you accurately point that it's everywhere, just beneath the surface). If someone feels able to say that out loud in the queue for a shop then it's because they feel things have changed. But they will be challenged. I'll give you that, I doubt you would've stayed silent if you'd heard it. I know I wouldn't.

Probably, yeah. But it won't make much difference to us, we still get screwed because some politicians didn't really believe the EU would do it.

"So much for the 'bail-in'. Also, so much for any suggestions the rest of the EU can just ignore the effect of the UK leaving and carry on without engaging with the UK constructively." I really, really hope you're right, and I really, really hope that whatever path we go down is one where the UK is able to work alongside the rest of Europe, and Europe is willing to make compromises for the long term good... ...but I'm not that optimistic. I think they'll make it hard for us, just to teach us a lesson.

I did read all the post. I saw what you'd said. I'm trying to work out why engaging in a game of "I'm more Labour than you" is relevant to the original point of this thread. It just looks like you can't or won't respond to the other points, so resort to the only thing you feel you can say. So I've actually answered my own question, it was just you asserting yourself again.

DulwichFox Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I was a Active member of the Labour Party . I was > at the meeting when Tessa Jowel was selected.. > > I rejected the Labour Party when Tony Blair > sanctioned the invasion of Iraq .. > ..and still tries to justify it today even though > we now know it was based on lies.. > > Never voted Labour since.. > > Won't be voting for Corbyn .. > > Foxy And what does that have to do with this thread, or the points people have made? Or are you just wanting to assert yourself again? I swear sometimes you seem to go clear off the tracks....

uncleglen Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > So our credit rating is now on a par with France, > Belgium, New Zealand, China, Abu Dhabi, Austria, > Finland, Kuwait Saudi.....the end is nigh The company I work for is on the brink of expanding, and thus being able to bring more jobs to our area and generally help it prosper. But yesterday the bank called the owners in for a meeting to tell them that - as a direct result of Brexit and the downgrading of credit ratings - it was no longer guaranteed that we would be able to borrow what we hoped for. For us it looks like we will still be able to scrap together enough and run it on a shoestring at first (using good old British ingenuity!), but I can imagine many others have had their plans shattered altogether. Even we still aren't definite that we will get the reduced deal. So yes, it had already had an effect on small businesses.

Sorry, who is 'you' exactly, and what weren't they listening about?

Toffee Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > My point is why would 77,000 people try to mess up > a legit petition. I wont be posting on this > subject anymore, I dont like the inference that > i'm some kind of racist. Well, Foxy said that quite a few of those same from North Korea, which is either hackers or the Norks being their usual mental selves - either way those can be discounted. Regardless the fraud has been found out, which is good. However, I'm struggling to see where anyone insinuated racism on your part? I've certainly pointed out issues regarding how my wife feels now, and my feelings about how some demographics have acted with their votes, and I stand by those, but I don't believe I accused you of racism (certainly apologise if you thought I meant that).

(Edited, double post)

"I assume based on the timing of your posts (e.g. 3.32pm) that you are not at the sharp end of things in the markets." To be fair, based on the timings of your posts one might assume the same of you. Genuine question (because I have no expertise in markets/finance) what is your area of knowledge/expertise?

"We have all long known his ambition to become The U.K. Prime Minister and he will most likely acheive that ambition." And that's the problem with him - he only joined the Leave campaign because he felt it gave him the best chance to be PM. He never really thought they would win, but that in losing by a narrow margin he could claim a moral victory and that he was speaking for a large swath of the population. He would then ride that wave into number ten. But now he's been given an actual mandate to act on that he didn't actually want; it will fall to him to enact Article 50 and I'm not convinced he wants to.

Yeah, but that's just dumb. It won't take long for the petition commitee to get wise to that and then that person is - rightly - going to get a visit from the police.

Well, some people who voted to Leave have had choice words to say about those who voted Remain, so if all you're saying is that people have said nasty things about those who disagree with them then yes, that's gone on with both sides. I made the mistake of reading the comments section of an otherwise very interesting article on the Spectator website; all I can say is it makes the commentary on here seem like a 60's love fest. A lot of what Leave voters are saying about 'Remainiacs' (to use one of the nicer terms on there) is far worse than anything I've seen here. I don't deny such views exist on both sides, but then both sides need to take a good hard look at themselves and decide how they want the debate to go from this point. The actions of Boris and crew so far have given no clear indication of where we will end up so yes, this debate will continue. Probably now we all should take a breath and focus on the larger picture, which means talking about the implications of what has happened. Re: the petition. Well, it's less than 80,000 signatures out of over 3,000,000, so not a massive amount. Still not good I admit. Strange that N Korea seems involved, question is was it people using VPN tricks, or the Norks themselves getting involved (let's be fair, they have an odd sense of humour)? Either way it hasn't helped. Not quite sure what you mean by politics being a free-for-all; can you expand on that?

So no, you're not going to provide any links to back up your assertions that the Remain camp hijacked Jo Cox's murder. Ok then, I'm going to bed.

keano77 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Blah Blah Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > And I thought lies around immigration that may > > have led to a mentally vulnerable man murdering > an > > MP equally diplorable. > > Don't be silly blah blah. There is no causal link > here no matter how Remain tried to create one. The > man was unfortunately mentally unstable. Again, can you provide any links to anything to back that up?

But surely if Article 50 already allows for Govts to use it, they don't need an Act to go down that road? (Seriously, I've been lacking on sleep lately so it's possible I'm being really thick about this, but nowhere have I seen anything that said Parliament needed to be consulted. Very happy to be wrong about it)

Hang on, I thought they didn't need Parliamentary approval for Article 50, doesn't it come under executive powers or something? I read this only the other day, how the hell can I not remember it or where it was?

keano77 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Loz Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > Sorry, but I am not going to sit idly whilst > Boris > > and co drive this country over a cliff. > > What are you going to do then and > contribute to a new dynamic Britain, whinge and > talk Britain down or help unleash the potential? Openly criticising something we disagree with an analysing what's happened is an important part of working out what we think should happen. I don't see Loz talking Britain down (a phrase often used by people when they want to accuse someone of a lack of patriotism or generally not supporting the country; I'm sure that's not what you meant?), looks to me like he's wanting to get it back on what he sees as the right path. Again, that's democracy for you. Just because we disagree with you doesn't automatically make us wrong. And vice versa.

keano77 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Hi JoeLeg > > It was a very ugly campaign and both sides should > be ashamed of their exaggerated figures and spin > (some may say lies). > > Personally, I thought the hijacking of Jo Cox's > tragic death for Remain ends trumped any ?350m a > week fib. Well, I do say lies. You can of course disagree, and you're free to call it a 'fib', though I'm also free to say that when you allow the electorate to think that (and we all now they did), it goes a bit beyond a fib. But then that's the beauty of a democracy, we can hold differing opinions and talk about it, even after the event. I didn't seech hijack the tragic murder of Jo Cox anywhere; can you provide a link to anything backing that up?

Has he said if they will invoke Article 50? Surely they can't if he wants to keep all that? My head is strartong to hurt after all this ridiculousness...

keano77 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > heartblock Wrote: > -------------------------------------------------- > ----- > > I'll 'whinge' as much as I want to thanks and > > apart from Trump and Le Pen..... Who is in awe > of > > the stupid out vote based on lies. > > > Anyone who understands the idea of democracy. Surely part of living in a democracy is the right to moan about the outcome of you lose? Especially if it's a close run thing, and it looks like those who won lied to do so? Or is there a rule that says if you lose you have shut up? Didn't think this was liars poker...

Louisa Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-36637037 > > More breaking news. Boris confirms EU co operation > will begin immediately. > > Louisa. I'm really not entirely clear from reading that quite what Boris means will happen. Am I being stupid (not impossible on any given day, quite likely right now), or is that a massive fudge?

citylover Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > The upside? Ooo, so difficult, one has to take a > while...democracy back, Well, you were lied to during the campaign so does it still count? having a vote that counts, Again, is a vote based on lies and dissemblance worth having? > being a sovereign state again. Which is only worth it if we are better off than we were before. This is he bit which is highly debatable. All that pales in > comparison though to simply being able to tell > Juncker and co to get lost and for it to really > mean just that. Well, apart from the fact that it sounds like you voted just so you could stick two fingers up at Europe, we're all still waiting to find out if that's what the government will actually do...

DulwichFox Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > > This Petetion really is meaningless. Anyone can > sign it.. > > Is this the way people want elections to run if > they do not get the right result. ? > > Foxy Given that Farage said if the result was 52% for Remain that there would have to be another referendum, would you still hold the same position of that'd been the case?