Alleyn's coaches causing traffic problems YET AGAIN - and here's the photos you wanted

[Zebedee Tring]

Then what about the coaches using the driveway in front of the main school entrance or elsewhere on the site that isn't open space? Why should we have to have the coaches parked on the public highway belching out fumes?

[huncamunca]

The school insurance wont cover vehicles like this on site

[Zebedee Tring]

So why couldn't Alleyns require the coach companies to obtain their own insurance for this?

As for the open space at the school being zoned as "metropolitan open space", Alleyns obtained planning permission for a performing arts centre (or something like that) on part of their "metropolitan open space". But of course this meant dosh for the school, and they aren't interested in the local residents who are affected by the bloody coaches.

[James Barber]

The strip proposed to tarmac over is down a slope and covered in trees.

The road is wide and can take coach parking if all users are careful and considerate.

Building on Metropolitican Open Land is a big deal - else by now we'd have no parks or green spaces. The Alleyns Performing arts theatre is the home of National Youth Theatre and I'd guess, as I wasn't on the planning committee for that - that the public good of the NYT was viewed as outweighing the loss of part of a playing field.

The coach service avoids many hundreds of car driving individual pupils to this and other school that share the coach service. Last time this topic came up I went and found out how many kids are moved a day and was amazed.

The Dulwich Safe Routes to School group, which I've attended as a Southwark Cyclists rep in the past, has promoted walking and cycling to this and all other schools in the area. But the coaches are bringing kids from locations to far to walk or cycle from.

[Zebedee Tring]

James, you've mentioned that there is a strip of land that could be tarmacked over. Do Alleyns have any specific proposals to tarmac over this land for use as parking for coaches? If not, it would be very helpful if you could suggest to the school that they should take this action on the ground that it is a subject of great concern for many local residents. If they care what locals residents thinks, then they really should do something about this.

[peterstorm1985]

Zebedee Tring Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> James, you've mentioned that there is a strip of

> land that could be tarmacked over. Do Alleyns have

> any specific proposals to tarmac over this land

> for use as parking for coaches? If not, it would

> be very helpful if you could suggest to the school

> that they should take this action on the ground

> that it is a subject of great concern for many

> local residents. If they care what locals

> residents thinks, then they really should do

> something about this.

I don't think James is saying that there is a strip of land that could be covered in tarmac. I think his point is that the strip of land that some people have suggested could be used is in fact not suitable because it is on a slope and covered with trees. The last bit about the trees is pretty important.

Roads make quite good car parks as long as the vehicle is switched off. Leaving the engine running is what really annoys me.

[Curmudgeon]

James Barber Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> The road is wide and can take coach parking if all

> users are careful and considerate.

What? That is simply not true! The coaches are currently parking both sides on the single yellow lines (actually leaving a space in the designated 'bus' area) so that it narrows to one lane and makes driving round the bollards dangerous

>

> The coach service avoids many hundreds of car

> driving individual pupils to this and other school

> that share the coach service. Last time this topic

> came up I went and found out how many kids are

> moved a day and was amazed.

But they park illegally and inconsiderately!

> The Dulwich Safe Routes to School group, which

> I've attended as a Southwark Cyclists rep in the

> past, has promoted walking and cycling to this and

> all other schools in the area. But the coaches are

> bringing kids from locations to far to walk or

> cycle from.

There were 11 coaches up that road last week .. 11!

[James Barber]

Hi Zebedee Tring,

Earlier posts by others suggested digging up and tarmacing some of their grounds. I was responding to those.

I think the idea of digging up green space is at best unhelpful and a distraction from the root cause. The odd coach is parking slightly outside the coach bays occassionally during very short periods at the start and end of the school day.

The other suggestion was coaches driving up the relatively narrow road that arcs to the front door and back again from Towlney Road. My hunch is that it would'nt be wide enough for coaches to over take each other. You'd also have issues of coaches emerging into Towley Road. Not practical in my mind.

I really think a sense of proportion is required. If the coach drivers aren't sticknig to the bays then we work on that.

Realy irony to me is that we've had other thread suggesting leniency from parking enforcement.

[Zebedee Tring]

James, since your party allegedly has a great concern for the environment and is opposed to excessive pollution, perhaps you could use your influence to get Alleyns to require the coach drivers not to keep their engines running for hours while they are waiting in the road.

As for your suggestion that some of us are not keeping a sense of proportion, you might personally be a bit more concerned about the problem if you lived in one of the roads leading to Townley Road and regularly had to walk and/or drive along Townley.

[James Barber]

Hi Sebedee Tring,

I'll happilly contact the school and ask that they request coach drivers to not leave engines running needlessly.

I'll also make a point of travelling more along Townley Road at school morning times to experiences the problems for the next fortnight.

[Zebedee Tring]

Many thanks, James. I hope that you have more luck than other people who have complained about the problem in the past.

[Curmudgeon]

James Barber Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Hi Zebedee Tring,

> Earlier posts by others suggested digging up and

> tarmacing some of their grounds. I was responding

> to those.

> I think the idea of digging up green space is at

> best unhelpful and a distraction from the root

> cause. The odd coach is parking slightly outside

> the coach bays occassionally during very short

> periods at the start and end of the school day.

>

You really haven't experienced it have you James? "The odd coach is parking slightly outside the coach bays occassionally during very short periods at the start and end of the school day." is beyond politics and is an outright lie I'm afraid.

Today however the situation was vastly improved proving that it can be managed properly.

[James Barber]

One of the Alleyn's team responded very quickly today, as the head teacher is away, but I've only just had chance to read and pass on the response.

They have contacted the Foundation Coach Service manager and have requested coach drivers don't leave engines running and park more carefully. When he gets a resppnse he'll let me know.

Apparently some of the islands make manuevring the coaches tricky so i'll pass that ot one of the village ward councillors to see if this can be looked at.

[Zebedee Tring]

James, if the Foundation Coach Service manager has taken any action on this, then it clearly hasn't made any impression on the driver of Excalibur coach YN06JXA who at 3.20 this afternoon was parked partially on the yellow line with his engine pumping out fumes.

I think that you need to keep up the pressure on this. I'm sure that plenty of people in the area affected by the problem won't let things rest.

[Curmudgeon]

Ongoing idiocy from the coaches outside Alleyn's yet again.

one of them managed to try to do a 3 point turn yesterday while the Alleyn's security guard watched, doing nothing.

They are STILL running their engines

There are still far too many and they park outside the coach spaces

And yet it's still justifiable is it?

Taxes - Public Road - Parking Regulations

JamesBarber I'm ashamed of Southwark for doing nothing about this

[Townleygreen]

>> Curmudgeon said: There are still far too many

Would you prefer them to come by car, then? Surely far worse.

(can't take issue with your other points, though)

[James Barber]

Hi Curmudgeon,

I'm not sure I understand.

You've said they're are too many but when one avoids doing a big circuit of the area to face the other way, by undertaking a 3 point turn intead, you criticise them.

Genuinely which would you prefer?

I will in the mean time contact the school and ask what enforcement they will undertake about coaches leaving engines running.

Edited as I got out of bed the wrong side!

[EDmummy]

Get out of the wrong side of the bed this morning, James?! The honest truth is that this problem has been ongoing for far longer than Labour has been in power in Southwark and you were asked to do something on many occassions when you were in power.

[Zebedee Tring]

This is not a political issue and should not be turned into a Lib Dem/Con versus Labour issue. It is an Alleyns/coach operators issue and it is up to them to sort this problem out, with pressure from the Council/individual Councillors regardless of which party they belong to. I see that it is nearly the first anniversary of my last email on this thread and I am concerned what should be an easily resolvable problem is still continuing.

[Curmudgeon]

James Barber Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Hi Curmudgeon,

> I'm not sure I understand.

> You've said they're are too many but when one

> avoids doing a big circuit of the area to face the

> other way, by undertaking a 3 point turn intead,

> you criticise them.

> Genuinely which would you prefer?

>

> I will in the mean time contact the school and ask

> what enforcement they will undertake about coaches

> leaving engines running.

>

> Edited as I got out of bed the wrong side!

I'm sorry I thought you knew the width of Turney Road - can you imagine a full-size coach doing a 3 point turn on it?

Genuinely? I would prefer Parking enforcement to be fair across the borough and that a blind eye not be turned because it's a private school.

I have no issue with coaches driving down the road in any direction - I have an issue with them parking outside the designated coach bays, on both sides of the roads, on yellow lines and causing obstructions for the rest of us.... drivers, pedestrians and cycles. I also have an issue with them leaving their engines running.

Equity in all things

[kristen]

I've been cycling down this road with my daughter every school day morning for the past 3 years.

It's no exaggeration to say that almost every morning there's some near miss - however this is normally not due to the coach drivers.

The main problem for us are the car drivers and these are normally parents dropping children off at Alleyns, dangers include cars suddenly doing three point turns, drivers parking illegally and more unpredictably children leaping out of cars - either side - and opening doors in our path.

My daughter is now 15 and I still don't feel comfortable letting her cycle to school alone.

In my experience the coach drivers behave relatively responsibly when compared to the other road users.

[Curmudgeon]

Well today when I passed by there were only 2 coaches

Both parked outside the coach bays (which were empty) on the yellow lines and directly opposite each other

law to themselves

[Zebedee Tring]

These coach drivers are taking the proverbial Michael if they aren't even using the designated bays. It seems if they won't change their selfish habits unless they are hit in the pocket. It would be a good thing if this happened.

[James Barber]

The feedback I've had is that the coach service carries between 250 and 300 Alleyns pupils to and from (out of a total of over 1100) so that obviously results in a large number of cars taken off the road in respect of Alleyn?s alone, let alone the other schools. It also clearly points to predominantly local pupils.

?

As you know, the School Coach Services are run out of Dulwich College and I quote below a message I received from them via the Alleyns bursur.

?

"I will speak to the operators about engines running. Re parking in the bays, the number of coaches we have exceeds bay space. So some coaches pick up on the single yellow lines which they are legally allowed to do so. We have tried to minimise disruption to the residents by saying to the operators that they are not allowed to be there before 2.45pm."

If anyone spots anything contrary to this please email me direct so I can get o the case immediately and ideally tell me the registration, time and date.

[Zebedee Tring]

(1) If they have insufficient bay space, they should make the excess coaches park on the Alleyns land. (No doubt we will have some response on the lines of "We can't use urban open space land" or the like).

(2) I have seen several coaches parked on the yellow lines for considerable periods and not just picking up passengers - that's not legally allowed. Some have parked on the yellow lines when there has been space in the bays.

So Alleyns response is really not good enough.