Official animal lover/animal welfare thread

[aquarius moon]

As you all probably know, I regularly post on this forum regarding my opinion of animals/animal welfare/vegetarianism etc. Whether it's dogs, cats, foxes, squirrels, rats, mice, pigeons, snails, ants etc.

As far as I am concerned, they all have a right to live.

I was taking part in a discussion on another thread earlier regarding mice, and how it is much better to dispose of them humanely rather than kill them.

I then opened the newspaper to find that some sick person killed his dog by hanging it, because it stole food from his fridge.

This disgusting abuse of animals is becoming all too common. There are similar stories in the papers on a weekly basis.

If children are encouraged and taught from an early age to love and respect animals, there would not be so much animal cruelty.

Being vegetarian seems to be a sore point on this forum, as the meat eaters like to come out in force & make themselves feel better by trying to justify it.

However, this thread is simply for animal lovers (not just vegetarians) to have their say. Any topics are open to discussion.

It sickens me to read/hear of any kind of animal abuse.

I'm pretty sure I have been put on this planet, to speak for the animals/birds/insects etc.

I am trying, but not everybody listens.

[Marmora Man]

Animals should not be abused but the idea that every living thing has a right to life is not one I can subscribe to.

Many many animals are only alive because they have been bred for slaughter. Appropriate abattoirs that reduce stress also allow meat eaters like me to enjoy a better steak.

[Pearson]

Haha! "official"

Just as a starting point: Big difference between someone who hangs their dog and someone who bins a poisoned mouse!

One thing i've never liked about vegetarians... i have to pamper for their anti meat whims if invited round for dinner (reluctantly) whilst they never bloody well cook me a steak when i'm round at theirs!! bha!

[DJKillaQueen]

Being vegetarian seems to be a sore point on this forum

No it isn't.....

as the meat eaters like to come out in force & make themselves feel better by trying to justify it.

Because some vegetarians can't help but cast all meat eaters as being somehow inhuman.

I love animals. And I eat some types of ethically reared meat/ fish too.

[aquarius moon]

I respect your opinion, but what about the in-appropriate abattoirs?!

[Pearson]

Nice points well made MM & DJKQ (as always)

[Pearson]

aquarius moon Wrote:

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> I respect your opinion, but what about the

> in-appropriate abattoirs?!

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I don't think anyone would disagree with you on that one.

But there are bad eggs in all walks of life, causes awaiting

[katie1997]

aquarius moon - doesn't matter if not everybody listens, at least you are trying. Thats a lovely reason to feel that you have been put on this planet btw (tu)

I too feel sickened to read/hear about animal abuse; it was disturbing to hear about that poor dog in your post.

This is my personal opinion, I don't think being a vegetarian is a sore point on this forum, I think its more a case of anything goes in the lounge. So expect people to post in all manner of ways from empathising up to being deliberately combatative, or silly, straying from topic and so on. Doesn't mean that invalidates the original intention of your post.

k xx

[aquarius moon]

P.S. Can I just point out that this thread is not about being vegetarian. I was just making an observation on what I've encountered so far on this forum.

This is simply about being kind to all animals & hopefully to stop their abuse.

[PeckhamRose]

"but what about the in-appropriate abattoirs"

What about them?

I tell you one thing, I think it is bad enough the way chickens are treated for use by Kentucky Fried Chicken but my friend (ok I will be dead honest, NOT my friend, it was ME, having my annual fast food fix whilst I was out on the road all day), went to KFC by Brick lane and there was a leaflet saying it was all halal chicken. So now they're not even stunned before they're killed. I couldn't be doing with that so walked right out again. Honest I did.

Then I heard that 80% of New Zealand lambs are killed using Halal method, but that they are stunned (there was a documentary about it a few weeks ago). They can't be stunned AND labelled Halal and that was the point of the article.

I have to confess, I cook meat because it's quick and I don't particularly like cooking, and am not very inventive. But I do see myself moving more towards trying to think harder and thus acting upon my feelings towards becoming a vegetarian.

Wish me luck.

[DJKillaQueen]

I think it's heartbreaking the things some people do animals. What can we do to stop some animal owners doing what that owner did to that poor dog. And they are just the ones that get caught.

[aquarius moon]

Thankyou,katie1997 x

[DJKillaQueen]

A lot of Halal meat is stunned first though in the UK (because it shortens the process of slaughter), which makes sense when you have hundreds of animals each day......I can't remember where I found that out (will try to though)....

[aquarius moon]

PeckhamRose Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> "but what about the in-appropriate abattoirs"

> What about them?

>

> I tell you one thing, I think it is bad enough the

> way chickens are treated for use by Kentucky Fried

> Chicken but my friend (ok I will be dead honest,

> NOT my friend, it was ME, having my annual fast

> food fix whilst I was out on the road all day),

> went to KFC by Brick lane and there was a leaflet

> saying it was all halal chicken. So now they're

> not even stunned before they're killed. I

> couldn't be doing with that so walked right out

> again. Honest I did.

>

> Then I heard that 80% of New Zealand lambs are

> killed using Halal method, but that they are

> stunned (there was a documentary about it a few

> weeks ago). They can't be stunned AND labelled

> Halal and that was the point of the article.

>

> I have to confess, I cook meat because it's quick

> and I don't particularly like cooking, and am not

> very inventive. But I do see myself moving more

> towards trying to think harder and thus acting

> upon my feelings towards becoming a vegetarian.

>

> Wish me luck.

I wish you loads of luck. If you need any advice about cooking vegetarian, let me know. I've been doing it for ages!

[PeckhamRose]

Well for starters I don't want to increase the dairy in my diet!

And the passion for pulses and beans that veggies have bores me to tears!

[Pearson]

I am completely with you with regards to cruelty.

But there are i guess, various levels of considered acceptance when it comes to the reasons for killing animals.

My stance is that we are all animals. The natural world IS in essence, a food chain (why else would Plankton exist ;-)

And for that reason, we must accept that may creatures are design to eat other creatures.

Humans maybe blessed with higher intelligence which allows them to decide what the may consume, we are after all top of the food chain. You cannot deny carnivorous animals meat by example.

(not sure if that's slipping off topic, but it's quite a wide opener.)

[woofmarkthedog]

My cat killed a mouse last night

Discuss

W**F

[aquarius moon]

PeckhamRose Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Well for starters I don't want to increase the

> dairy in my diet!

> And the passion for pulses and beans that veggies

> have bores me to tears!

I don't actually eat pulses or beans very often, just use a meat alternative in my recipes. You can make cottage pie, lasagne, curry, stew, chilli con carne, spag bol, sausage casserole, pies etc etc but without the meat.

You don't have to increase the dairy either. You can buy soya milk or another one called rice dream from sainsbury's.

You can buy veggie bacon & burgers from sainsburys too. There is a bigger variety of veggie alternatives in Holland & Barrett, but more expensive.

[katie1997]

woofmarkthedog Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> My cat killed a mouse last night

>

>

> Discuss

>

>

> W**F

Oh-kay, so did the cat eat it or leave it somewhere as a 'surprise'?

Back in the good old days when I shared a house with friends, our cat thoughtfully decided to leave a 'present' on the pillow of the only person in the house guaranteed to be absolutely terrified of this.

*discussing*

[woofmarkthedog]

On the path, perfectly laid on it's side & lightly, erm... " gnawed to death "

Sam, my youngest said "Oh it's like... who's the guy on a ten pound note? "

I looked on a tenner " Darwin ? "

" Yes Darwin, at Darwin's house he's got frog skeletons laid out on the table"

I smiled

W**F

[DJKillaQueen]

My cat killed a mouse last night

I bred a monster!

Was it Hector (or is it Dylan?) or Florence? I'll bet it was Florence!

[Jeremy]

aquarius moon, I appreciate the sentiment behind this thread, but it's hard to take it seriously when you proclaim yourself to be the official spokesperson for insects.

[Alec John Moore]

Hi PeckhamRose, you might find Meat Free Mondays gives you some food for thought on why eating less meat would be a good idea for you and it may even give you some ideas for food!

http://www.meatfreemondays.co.uk/why-have-meat-free-monday.html

Felicity Lawrence is also very good in my view on the complex set of reasons for why we should consider more carefully what we eat:

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Not-Label-What-Really-Plate/dp/0141015667/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1288955597&sr=1-2

And, if a good measure of the popularity of your cook book is the number of food-stained pages it has after a few months' use then our copy of linda's Kitchen would win - oven gloves down.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/offer-listing/0316877352/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1288955827&sr=1-1&condition=used

Don't mean to steer the thread away from animal loving/welfare, just trying to put it in a wider context.

[DJKillaQueen]

That gives me a very good question to ask. Moths....for those that have a problem with them, they eat everything. So people use whatever method to kill them off. Do they have a right to live?

It's a good question in relation to any kind of infestation.

On another point I saw an article in the paper describing that male chicks are killed because they don't lay eggs (including free range ones). They are literally put onto a conveyor belt alive which runs into a gassing chamber and they drop out of the end of that dead. What happens to them afterwards I don't know but it certainly brought a distaste to my mind.

[Alec John Moore]

Silk production involves killing the larvae of the moth, Bombyx mori, before it reaches maturity and eats throgh the cocoon.