New T Charge

[Penguin68]

As most will know, the new T Charge starts today - it is headlined as effecting cars registered pre 2006, but in fact (although cars from 2006 had to be engineered to the Euro 4/ IV standard) some pre 2006 cars were also engineeered to the higher standard.

It is worth checking https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/emissions-surcharge/compliance-checker if your car is compliant or not; I was pleased to discover that my petrol car, pre 2006 registered, in fact was compliant and therefore not subject to the additional charge.

[rendelharris]

Just to reiterate, although as Penguin says some pre-2006 cars are exempt, don't assume that just because your car is post-2006 and not diesel you won't be charged - TfL suggests anyone with a car made up to 2008 should check.

[singalto]

Thank you for that, Penguin68. My car is pre 06 and so I thought it would automatically require the T charge but doesn't.

[Nigello]

Interesting to note that some say the charge will be punitive especially on people with less money because they are more likely to have older cars.

[Sue]

Thanks for posting the link, Penguin68.

My ancient Micra is eligible but as I avoid the congestion charge zone anyway I should be OK.

[rupert james]

Silly question no doubt.

What is the mot emission test for?

Are they not the same thing as this T charge?

[JohnL]

"Your vehicle is not subject to the T-Charge" - it's like getting a not guilty (not really) :)

[Penguin68]

What is the mot emission test for?

Are they not the same thing as this T charge?

The MOT test is for an individual vehicle and tests whether it is meeting that vehicle's (and road legal) standards - some which are engineered to meet the Euro 4/IV standards will fail them and need repair. The MOT test checks road legal emissions.

The T Charge is looking at classes of vehicles to determine whether they have been engineered to a higher (now) than road legal standard. It assumes that vehicles engineered to the standard which are emitting more than these standards will be picked op on during MOT tests.

So MOT is about Road Legal, and the T charge about a general standard higher than road legal.

[rupert james]

Thank you appreciated

[malumbu]

MOT test does a rudimentary examination of emissions based on opacity (ie smoky exhausts). This fails to capture small particles of pollution or nitrogen dioxide, responsible for most of the early deaths associated with pollution.

[DulwichFox]

If Sadiq Khan was serious about pollution he would BAN polluting vehicles from central London.

How can you have a system where it is OK to pollute the air as long as you PAY.

It is the Biggest Money Making SCAM ever.

Khan could not give a Damn about peoples health. He wants to raise money to cover for failing council policies.

DulwichFox

[Louisa]

Another money grabbing scheme for a cash rich devolved power. They?ve had it in their grasp to ban polluting vehicles from central London for years now, why are we still waiting? They don?t care about pollution, they care about grand standing and lining their pockets whilst doing so. Shameful. If you care about global warming BAN certain vehicles from central London with immediate effect.

Louisa.

[nxjen]

And they speak as one voice

[DulwichFox]

My 1997 Ford Escort Encore Auto 1600cc is not exempt the T charge.

Not too bothered.. I either walk Under (3 miles) or use my Freedom pass

I drive 800 - 1,000 miles a year these days.

DulwichFox

[malumbu]

So why do you have a car DF? Would't it be cheaper to use Zip car, Uber, cabs, to compliment your already good environmental example. And hire on the odd occasion of a long distance. And that goes for many others too.

Not sure why you are all getting hot headed about Sadiq. Same could be said about Ken (C charge and LEZ) and Boris (ULEZ).

[DulwichFox]

malumbu Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> So why do you have a car DF? Would't it be

> cheaper to use Zip car, Uber, cabs, to compliment

> your already good environmental example. And hire

> on the odd occasion of a long distance. And that

> goes for many others too.

>

> Not sure why you are all getting hot headed about

> Sadiq. Same could be said about Ken (C charge and

> LEZ) and Boris (ULEZ).

I used to do more millage when my mother was alive. She passed away in 2012 and I've just kept in on.

It is still in good condition, Difficult getting new tyres .. Kwik-Fit do not stock them .

I use it for shopping and I have used it to ferry wood and other heavy goods

Probably will get rid of soon and may not replace it. only 57,000 ish miles on clock.

Foxy

[Chick]

Thanks for the link.

Penguin68 Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> As most will know, the new T Charge starts today -

> it is headlined as effecting cars registered pre

> 2006, but in fact (although cars from 2006 had to

> be engineered to the Euro 4/ IV standard) some pre

> 2006 cars were also engineeered to the higher

> standard.

>

> It is worth checking

> https://tfl.gov.uk/modes/driving/emissions-surchar

> ge/compliance-checker if your car is compliant or

> not; I was pleased to discover that my petrol car,

> pre 2006 registered, in fact was compliant and

> therefore not subject to the additional charge.

[Sue]

In relation to two posts above, I really don't see how polluting vehicles could suddenly be banned from an area altogether.

And I'd like to know what evidence there is for anybody "lining their pockets" from this charge, or for it being "The Biggest Money Making SCAM ever."

And as for "Khan could not give a Damn about peoples health. He wants to raise money to cover for failing council policies", I received the email below a couple of days ago:

Dear Sue,

Londoners have suffered for too long because of the Tories' refusal to act on air pollution. It's Labour that are taking real action to clean our air.

The Toxicity Charge ? the T-charge ? starts today. It's part of my commitment to clean up London's dangerously polluted air, which contributes to thousands of premature deaths each year in our city. It damages health throughout our lives ? leading to smaller lungs in children, and greater risk of dementia, cancer and strokes when we get older.

As of today, older and more polluting vehicles driving in the central London Congestion Charge Zone will need to meet minimum emission standards, or pay an additional ?10 daily T-charge. This is in addition to the Congestion Charge and will operate from 07:00 to 18:00, Monday to Friday.

This is only one part of my clean air plan, working alongside our fantastic Labour Councils to tackle this public health emergency. We are leading by example by cleaning up TfL's bus and taxi fleets, tackling pollution outside schools and introducing more cycle lanes.

In the coming weeks we will be launching a London-wide Labour Party campaign on Air Quality. I look forward to working with you to take our message to the doorstep.

Yours sincerely,

Sadiq Khan

Labour's Mayor of London

And if anybody wants to use this to have a go at Labour, please first tell me exactly what the Tory government are doing about air quality.

Edited for typo

[DulwichFox]

Sue Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> In relation to two posts above, I really don't see

> how polluting vehicles could suddenly be banned

> from an area altogether.

>

> And I'd like to know what evidence there is for

> anybody "lining their pockets" from this charge,

> or for it being "The Biggest Money Making SCAM

> ever."

>

> And as for "Khan could not give a Damn about

> peoples health. He wants to raise money to cover

> for failing council policies", I received the

> email below a couple of days ago:

>

>

We will have to wait and see how you feel about The charges after 2018/19 when

a further clean air act comes into force.

When the congestion charge is expected to rise..

The T charge is expected to rise

Sidiq Khan wants to expand the Congestion Zone to cover everything within the North / South circular.

On top of that there is talk about charging per mile for motorways.

We already effectively pay per mile when we buy petrol.

Thousands of people die from tobacco related diseases each year but despite having banned it from public places

refuses to ban it totally. Why. because it raise ?millions in Tax.

Recreational Drugs are totally banned. Why.. Because there No Revenue.. (Tax)

And where drugs are concerned money is raised by imposing Fines.

OK if its not a Scam.. Its a Sham

Foxy

[Nigello]

His Lordship the Mayor could easily cut pollution by requiring traffic wardens/police to instruct car engine idlers to switch off or be fined. (Why they don't do this anyway I will never know.) The fact that simple, easily understood and fair methods like this are not used is baffling and depressing - it could be made to happen very quickly, with no fanfare or fuss, so perhaps that is why it isn't!

[Sue]

Nigello Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> His Lordship the Mayor could easily cut pollution

> by requiring traffic wardens/police to instruct

> car engine idlers to switch off or be fined. (Why

> they don't do this anyway I will never know.) The

> fact that simple, easily understood and fair

> methods like this are not used is baffling and

> depressing - it could be made to happen very

> quickly, with no fanfare or fuss, so perhaps that

> is why it isn't!

Maybe you could suggest it to the appropriate person via the appropriate channels?

No use posting about it on here!!

[Sue]

DulwichFox Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> >

> We will have to wait and see how you feel about

> The charges after 2018/19 when

>

> a further clean air act comes into force.

>

> When the congestion charge is expected to rise..

>

> The T charge is expected to rise

>

> Sidiq Khan wants to expand the Congestion Zone to

> cover everything within the North / South

> circular.

>

> On top of that there is talk about charging per

> mile for motorways.

>

> We already effectively pay per mile when we buy

> petrol.

>

> Thousands of people die from tobacco related

> diseases each year but despite having banned it

> from public places

> refuses to ban it totally. Why. because it raise

> ?millions in Tax.

>

> Recreational Drugs are totally banned. Why..

> Because there No Revenue.. (Tax)

>

> And where drugs are concerned money is raised by

> imposing Fines.

>

> OK if its not a Scam.. Its a Sham

>

Sorry, I don't understand.

Are you saying that additional measures shouldn't be taken to cut pollution from motor vehicles (by deterring people from using them) because cigarettes aren't completely banned?

(BTW smoking is not "banned from public places", it is banned from public places which are inside.)

What would your solution be to improve the appalling air quality in London?

And why are Sadiq Khan's measures a "sham"?

[Nigello]

Sue,

Done - even before your peppish, good-natured encouragement.

I'll report back.

[uncleglen]

Sue Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> In relation to two posts above, I really don't see

> how polluting vehicles could suddenly be banned

> from an area altogether.

>

> And I'd like to know what evidence there is for

> anybody "lining their pockets" from this charge,

> or for it being "The Biggest Money Making SCAM

> ever."

>

> And as for "Khan could not give a Damn about

> peoples health. He wants to raise money to cover

> for failing council policies", I received the

> email below a couple of days ago:

>

>

> Dear Sue,

>

> Londoners have suffered for too long because of

> the Tories' refusal to act on air pollution. It's

> Labour that are taking real action to clean our

> air.

>

> The Toxicity Charge ? the T-charge ? starts today.

> It's part of my commitment to clean up London's

> dangerously polluted air, which contributes to

> thousands of premature deaths each year in our

> city. It damages health throughout our lives ?

> leading to smaller lungs in children, and greater

> risk of dementia, cancer and strokes when we get

> older.

>

> As of today, older and more polluting vehicles

> driving in the central London Congestion Charge

> Zone will need to meet minimum emission standards,

> or pay an additional ?10 daily T-charge. This is

> in addition to the Congestion Charge and will

> operate from 07:00 to 18:00, Monday to Friday.

>

> This is only one part of my clean air plan,

> working alongside our fantastic Labour Councils to

> tackle this public health emergency. We are

> leading by example by cleaning up TfL's bus and

> taxi fleets, tackling pollution outside schools

> and introducing more cycle lanes.

>

> In the coming weeks we will be launching a

> London-wide Labour Party campaign on Air Quality.

> I look forward to working with you to take our

> message to the doorstep.

>

> Yours sincerely,

>

> Sadiq Khan

> Labour's Mayor of London

>

>

> And if anybody wants to use this to have a go at

> Labour, please first tell me exactly what the Tory

> government are doing about air quality.

>

> Edited for typo

This is a pile of labour propaganda.

The man is a fool- where does he think people will drive now?- they will avoid the zone- just like they avoid the C zone- by using the ring roads etc....

Also if you go to East London where the roads are jam-packed all day long with old cars- it's rush hour 24/7 there are loads of children breathing in the fumes....

The way the e-mail is worded is sickening- The Tories are responsible for Air Pollution are they? What about the idiot motorists (like ex- Tower Hamlets mayor Luftur Rahman) who drive 5 minutes down the road- and as Nigello said- the ones who sit there idling.

Maybe the pollution is the fault of Tony Blair- who failed to educate an entire generation on environmental matters- despite his manifesto promises

[Sue]

Nigello Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Sue,

>

> Done - even before your peppish, good-natured

> encouragement.

>

> I'll report back.

Yeh sorry, I just reread it and I did sound a bit sharp.

Look forward to hearing the outcome, it's a good idea (though I suspect that given that the police aren't even investigating some crimes these days it's likely to be the traffic wardens who do it)