Grand National

[holloway]

Thought I'd start a thread about tomorrow's race.

'Walk in the Mill' as a (rank) outside choice ew, amateur jockey but won loads at Aintree.

'Total Recall' as the winner, though fell in Cheltenham gold cup, looked solid beforehand.

Apologies to anyone against horse racing.

Good luck to all taking part.!

[Blah Blah]

Well you can apologise, but there are good reasons to oppose horse racing from an animal welfare perspective. I will spare the usual complaints about injury and training cruelty and ask just this. What on earth is the point of horse racing? Betting on animals whipped to run as fast as they can around a track! What purpose does it serve?

[Mick Mac]

Great fun.

Horses are treated better than any other animal i can think of.

[DulwichFox]

I don't like Horse Racing.

[oliviaandmilo]

Another form of addiction, sadly for thousands! Too many gambling shops around, making people rich on the misery of others. Personally hate it!

[uncleglen]

I always look and see how many of the poor creatures were put down after- it used to be a lot...especially the National Hunt races obviously-

and as for the proliferation of gambling most of you voted for her!

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1474933/Opponents-of-new-gambling-law-are-snobs-says-Tessa-Jowell.html

[rendelharris]

uncleglen Wrote:

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> I always look and see how many of the poor

> creatures were put down after- it used to be a

> lot...especially the National Hunt races

> obviously-

> and as for the proliferation of gambling most of

> you voted for her!

> https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1474933/Op

> ponents-of-new-gambling-law-are-snobs-says-Tessa-J

> owell.html

And you presumably voted for the current lot, who could this month have reduced the maximum bet on fixed-odds terminals to ?2 (as requested by the opposition) but decided (under pressure from the bookmakers, who, in an odd coincidence, are major party donors) to set it so that a gambler can still lose ?30 every twenty seconds. It's this government that has also rejected Labour's call for a compulsory levy on bookmakers to pay for gambling addiction treatment.

[DulwichFox]

There are too many Horses in The Grand National. 2018 40 horses.

In the interest of safety, maybe the maximum number of horses in any race should be limited to 8 horses.

A total of 82 horses have died during the actual Grand National race.

Since 2000 11 have passed away during the event.

Since the start of 2018, 43 horses have passed away on race courses across the country.

Sport of Kings. ? No. I don't think so.

DulwichFox

[SpringTime]

I don't follow horse racing really, but I do like the National. It's the only occasion in the year I visit the bookies. No fatalities in the main race I understand - and none since 2012 which is a good thing. And this year I won, hurrah!

[Blah Blah]

A horse died at Aintree three days ago. The Grand National was always designed to be a testing curcuit with more regard for spectacle than the safety of horses. Even though today, more focus is on safety, a horse stil dies jumping Becher's Brook, and for what? So someone somewhere can make a few quid. To me, horse racing is no different to fox hunting. It pushes horses to their limits and opens them up to completely preventable stress and injury just so that someone can get a jolly somewhere. The saddest thing is how those horses that do manage to survive a life of racing end up when their trainers no longer want them.

[SpringTime]

Blah Blah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> A horse died at Aintree three days ago. The Grand

> National was always designed to be a testing

> curcuit with more regard for spectacle than the

> safety of horses. Even though today, more focus is

> on safety, a horse stil dies jumping Becher's

> Brook, and for what? So someone somewhere can make

> a few quid. To me, horse racing is no different to

> fox hunting. It pushes horses to their limits and

> opens them up to completely preventable stress and

> injury just so that someone can get a jolly

> somewhere. The saddest thing is how those horses

> that do manage to survive a life of racing end up

> when their trainers no longer want them.

Wild horses die too.

[rendelharris]

SpringTime Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Blah Blah Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > A horse died at Aintree three days ago. The

> Grand

> > National was always designed to be a testing

> > curcuit with more regard for spectacle than the

> > safety of horses. Even though today, more focus

> is

> > on safety, a horse stil dies jumping Becher's

> > Brook, and for what? So someone somewhere can

> make

> > a few quid. To me, horse racing is no different

> to

> > fox hunting. It pushes horses to their limits

> and

> > opens them up to completely preventable stress

> and

> > injury just so that someone can get a jolly

> > somewhere. The saddest thing is how those

> horses

> > that do manage to survive a life of racing end

> up

> > when their trainers no longer want them.

>

>

> Wild horses die too.

Not by breaking their necks jumping obstacles they're urged on to face by humans with whips, they don't. Horses aren't natural jumpers, they'll always go round an obstacle unless danger threatens.

[Quia Differt]

rendelharris Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> uncleglen Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > I always look and see how many of the poor

> > creatures were put down after- it used to be a

> > lot...especially the National Hunt races

> > obviously-

> > and as for the proliferation of gambling most

> of

> > you voted for her!

> >

> https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/1474933/Op

>

> >

> ponents-of-new-gambling-law-are-snobs-says-Tessa-J

>

> > owell.html

>

> And you presumably voted for the current lot, who

> could this month have reduced the maximum bet on

> fixed-odds terminals to ?2 (as requested by the

> opposition) but decided (under pressure from the

> bookmakers, who, in an odd coincidence, are major

> party donors) to set it so that a gambler can

> still lose ?30 every twenty seconds. It's this

> government that has also rejected Labour's call

> for a compulsory levy on bookmakers to pay for

> gambling addiction treatment.

Sadly, predictably and somewhat inevitably, the powerful Bookmakers Lobby got their way, as always.

However ( ! ) there is one teensy-weensy little problem with your analysis is that it was NOT The Tories who brought in these dreaded FOBT's it was "Friends Of The Common Man and Working Class- The LABOUR Party who were responsible for this atrocity that has ruined so many people's lives.

An example of who suffers from these machines is Oxford where in David Cameron's Constituency there is only ONE Betting Shop while in nearby constituencies they proliferate. The reason ? Boomakers know that the more desperate and poorer someone is the less judgment and self-discipline they have and these people are much more likely to lose the little money they have.

It's a disgrace but in the same way all Governments benefit in taxes from Smoking then Gambling will never really be reined in. Too much loss of income for The Chancellor of the day.

You are right in that it now can take1 minute 20 seconds to lose ?120 instead of 20 seconds to lose ?100.

If only the general public knew how many FOBT's are demolished by angry punters they would be shocked but it is awful publicity for The Bookmakers who hush it up and install a new machine asap. :(

[rendelharris]

Quia Differt Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> However ( ! ) there is one teensy-weensy little

> problem with your analysis is that it was NOT The

> Tories who brought in these dreaded FOBT's it was

> "Friends Of The Common Man and Working Class- The

> LABOUR Party who were responsible for this

> atrocity that has ruined so many people's lives.

I believe I actually acknowledged that above; I don't deny that the Labour party under Tony Blair did indeed introduce this. The current Labour party, and especially shadow chancellor Tom Watson, are campaigning to rectify this, and the government are refusing to do so.

[Blah Blah]

Everything dies eventualy Springtime but as Rendel says, wild horses tend to die from natural illness not forced gymnastics and most wild horses also live on open land that is easy for them to roam.

[Seabag]

SpringTime Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Blah Blah Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > A horse died at Aintree three days ago. The

> Grand

> > National was always designed to be a testing

> > curcuit with more regard for spectacle than the

> > safety of horses. Even though today, more focus

> is

> > on safety, a horse stil dies jumping Becher's

> > Brook, and for what? So someone somewhere can

> make

> > a few quid. To me, horse racing is no different

> to

> > fox hunting. It pushes horses to their limits

> and

> > opens them up to completely preventable stress

> and

> > injury just so that someone can get a jolly

> > somewhere. The saddest thing is how those

> horses

> > that do manage to survive a life of racing end

> up

> > when their trainers no longer want them.

>

>

> Wild horses die too.

Stupid comment.

[Quia Differt]

rendelharris Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Quia Differt Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

>

> >

> > " LABOUR Party who were responsible for this

> > atrocity that has ruined so many people's

> lives."

rendelharris:

>

> I believe I actually acknowledged that above; I

> don't deny that the Labour party under Tony Blair

> did indeed introduce this.

Only in invisible ink ! lol

Your 2 contributions on the 16th and 17th April on this thread did not contain any visible acknowledgement. :)

Anyhoo here is a You Tube clip that says it all ....

Just put " Guy gets mad, watch till end " and the 40 second clip admirably sums it all up...:)

[rendelharris]

Quia Differt Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Your 2 contributions on the 16th and 17th April on

> this thread did not contain any visible

> acknowledgement. :)

UG said we voted for Tessa Jowell who introduced them, I replied "And presumably you voted for..." - tacit acknowledgement, sorry if it wasn't obvious enough for you. Still, focus on nitpicking rather than the point I made, which is that although Labour introduced them it is Labour who are now campaigning to mitigate the harm they do and the Tories who are refusing to do so.

[Quia Differt]

>

> UG said we voted for Tessa Jowell who introduced

> them, I replied "And presumably you voted for..."

> - tacit acknowledgement, sorry if it wasn't

> obvious enough for you. Still, focus on

> nitpicking rather than the point I made, which is

> that although Labour introduced them it is Labour

> who are now campaigning to mitigate the harm they

> do and the Tories who are refusing to do so.

We will leave it at that then.

Same old story, irrespective of Party affiliations.

When in power Labour wanted to raise millions by their introduction.

When in power Tories want to retain millions for their continuation.

Plus les choses changent, plus elles restent les m?mes....:)

[civilservant]

Mick Mac Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Great fun.

> Horses are treated better than any other animal i

> can think of.

i would love to agree that this is true, but fear that it is not - this is just the latest example http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43813364

[Mick Mac]

civilservant Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Mick Mac Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Great fun.

> > Horses are treated better than any other animal

> i

> > can think of.

>

> i would love to agree that this is true, but fear

> that it is not - this is just the latest example

> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43813364

But these are not racehorses - one of the examples in the article is a Shetland pony living in a flat.

[Help-Ma-Boab]

Was it a one bedroom or two bedroom flat?

Mick Mac Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> civilservant Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > Mick Mac Wrote:

> >

> --------------------------------------------------

>

> > -----

> > > Great fun.

> > > Horses are treated better than any other

> animal

> > i

> > > can think of.

> >

> > i would love to agree that this is true, but

> fear

> > that it is not - this is just the latest example

>

> > http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-43813364

>

> But these are not racehorses - one of the examples

> in the article is a Shetland pony living in a

> flat.