CPZ: Proposed Controlled Parking in East Dulwich

[singalto]

Eileen, at the drop in session last Saturday, Joanna told me that extending the double yellow lines as they have and turning the white lines at dropped curbs into extra long double yellow lines would increase parking in the CPZ by 40%.

[James Barber]

What would I do if I were still a councillor - I'd knock on every door in the consultation area making sure people were aware of these proposals.

I would hold street stalls on Lordship Lane making sure people were aware.

I'd then read the consultation report, consider all the qualitative comments and thoughts from that door knocking, street stalls and indeed the forum and form a conclusion.

My perception currently is those living near the station have problems and I suspect most complaints come form there. That IF it were implemented it would need to be very time limited with direct hours of operations on different sides of Lordship Lane and Grove Vale. That it would need to be implemented and planned in conjunction with the West Peckham CPZ proposal.

But CPZ's do tend to go as dominos.

[The Nappy Lady]

James, I asked about different times zones on different roads within the area and was told it wasn't possible and if it comes in the entire zone will have controlled parking across the same times. BONKERS!!!!

[intexasatthe moment]

As Mark T has said the Barry Rd proposals for traffic calming need to be considered in conjuction with the CPZ proposals for that road .

I don't know if the comments made at the drop in re Barry Rd are being taken into account and if a revised scheme will be presented ,but it would be useful to know whether the proposed traffic pillows are to be retained and what impact ,if any ,they will have on parking .

FWIW I don't think it was a question of the representatives ( a Southwark engagement officer and staff from the consultancy agency ) denying knowledge of the CPZ .From answers to other questions ,they genuinely had no knowledge of the area - no clue that traffic pillows had been tried previously and removed because buses were unable to clear them ,no knowledge that the Barry Rd /Underhill Rd junction had seen several RTA ,no familiarity with local road names etc .

More worringly there was an astonishing arrogance - when I asked whether TfL had been involved in the peoposals I was told that there was no need for this as Barry Rd was a road maintained by Southwark .

[intexasatthe moment]

Is it just me that doesn't understand the assertion that the CPZ will increase parking spaces ?

"Eileen, at the drop in session last Saturday, Joanna told me that extending the double yellow lines as they have and turning the white lines at dropped curbs into extra long double yellow lines would increase parking in the CPZ by 40%."

Where I live on Barry Rd as I look out of my window I can see 5 car parking spaces that would be removed by the proposed extension of double yellow lines either side of dropped curbs . And as there have been zero traffic incidents in the last 30 years at any of these dropped curbs I can see no rationale for extending waiting restrictions .

[alex_b]

I don?t get it either Texas, with the parklets, bike lockers and double yellows, Adys road is losing dozens of spaces. Even with the reduction in ?commuter? parking I still think the scheme will lead to a net loss in available spaces for residents.

[singalto]

I noticed that as the CPZ ?discussion? was coming to an end and someone asked about the hours of operation, Joanna quietly said that these had not been agreed and that they would consider 24 hours 7 days a week as a possibility. As far as I understand, 98 people over 3 years have asked for this. The door knocking comment about parking being the main thing people complained about puzzled me. Not one of our current local councillors has ever knocked on my door. Do they ask the question? Yes, parking where I live can be difficult but no, I still don?t want a CPZ. I don?t want LLto return to what it was 25 years ago. I also thought the chairman?s comment about Brexit was totally out of place.

[eastdulwichhenry]

If the East Dulwich CPZ comes into effect, will it be part of the same zone as the Dog Kennel Hill? i.e. will permits bought for one of the areas be valid in the other?

[MarkT]

let's be clear on what is meant by promise of 40% increase in parking.

As I understand it they mean that if on a typical street before introduction of the CPZ you might have a choice of 10 available (ie currently empty) spaces to park your car, after introduction of the CPZ you would have choice of 14 spaces.

In the marking out of the CPZ, there is a reduction in the total length of kerbside where someone could legally park.

To achieve their promised 40% increase therefore, they must aim to deter, or outlaw, far more than 40% of pre CPZ parked cars.

The post CPZ available length of kerbside allocated for Permit only or Pay to park is precisely measurable. The pre CPZ available length of kerbside is not. For example when parking close to a dropped kerb, do you encroach on the sloping end? Do you have the permission of the resident to park across the dropped kerb? (completely legal under national law) Where 2 dropped kerbs are close together, can you fit a small car in between.

I do not know if the Council measures or counts parking spaces pre CPZ, though they produce photos to demonstrate a parking nightmare. I would think that they would not include dropped kerbs in such a measure of parkable kerbside, so their estimate of the loss would fall short of reality.

[goldilocks]

No - it would be a separate zone.

eastdulwichhenry Wrote:

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> If the East Dulwich CPZ comes into effect, will it

> be part of the same zone as the Dog Kennel Hill?

> i.e. will permits bought for one of the areas be

> valid in the other?

[goldilocks]

I think that whilst its possible Peckham West and East Dulwich could, if implemented, have the same hours of operation, there hasn't been anything defined as yet, but I suspect the person answering your question was responding to whether a whole zone (eg ED OR Peckham W) would have the same hours of operation, rather than whether both zones would be the same.

The Nappy Lady Wrote:

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> James, I asked about different times zones on

> different roads within the area and was told it

> wasn't possible and if it comes in the entire zone

> will have controlled parking across the same

> times. BONKERS!!!!

[eastdulwichhenry]

goldilocks Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> No - it would be a separate zone.

So that's a serious worry for people living in St Francis Rd and areas near the station. It's not as if buying a resident or visitor permit will even be an option then. They'll no longer be able to drive to events in ED and park in the streets. Legitimate measures to combat outsiders filling up our spaces should not have the effect of making life impossible for locals.

[Galileo]

eastdulwichhenry Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> goldilocks Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > No - it would be a separate zone.

>

> So that's a serious worry for people living in St

> Francis Rd and areas near the station. It's not as

> if buying a resident or visitor permit will even

> be an option then. They'll no longer be able to

> drive to events in ED and park in the streets.

> Legitimate measures to combat outsiders filling up

> our spaces should not have the effect of making

> life impossible for locals.

We can?t drive to events in ED as it stands - because we can?t then park anywhere near home again.

[rendelharris]

eastdulwichhenry Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> So that's a serious worry for people living in St

> Francis Rd and areas near the station. It's not as

> if buying a resident or visitor permit will even

> be an option then. They'll no longer be able to

> drive to events in ED and park in the streets.

Why on earth would someone in St.Francis Road need to drive to events in ED (unless disabled, in which case blue badge users can park anywhere in the CPZ without penalty)? It's a third of a mile away!

[goldilocks]

It would be a concern for people north of the station - eg St Francis road and northwards, but only for the hours that any CPZ implemented would be in operation. I guess they could still use the pay and display bays if expecting to be laden down with shopping (noting that the first 30 mins are still proposed to be free!)

Galileo Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> eastdulwichhenry Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > goldilocks Wrote:

> >

> --------------------------------------------------

>

> > -----

> > > No - it would be a separate zone.

> >

> > So that's a serious worry for people living in

> St

> > Francis Rd and areas near the station. It's not

> as

> > if buying a resident or visitor permit will

> even

> > be an option then. They'll no longer be able to

> > drive to events in ED and park in the streets.

> > Legitimate measures to combat outsiders filling

> up

> > our spaces should not have the effect of making

> > life impossible for locals.

>

> We can?t drive to events in ED as it stands -

> because we can?t then park anywhere near home

> again.

[rendelharris]

Am I missing something here? Under what circumstances would an able-bodied person need to drive from St.Francis Road to Lordship Lane, a distance of less than half a mile and with a choice of no fewer than six different buses that all go there from the end of the road? We live almost exactly the same distance (slightly further, in fact) from LL and have driven there precisely once, to collect a writing bureau from the St.Christopher's shop.

There are many pertinent arguments about the LL CPZ on here, but complaining that it'll curtail the ability to make one-third of a mile car journeys won't get much sympathy, I fear.

[Sue]

I just emailed the highways department about something unrelated to CPZ, and was amused to see this in the middle of their automatic reply:

"If your email is a request for a controlled parking zone please note that due to the volume of requests we receive, we are unable to respond to each individual email."

Volume of requests????!!!!

[mrwb]

I have just filled in the consultation on the Southwark council website:

https://consultations.southwark.gov.uk/environment-leisure/eastdulwichparking/consultation/intro/

I do hope everyone is filling it in and the local shops are directing those concerned about it to fill it in as well. Hopefully they will actually pay some attention to the results.

It seems to close on the 28th of February now so still plenty of time.

[Abe_froeman]

If you don't want it in ED it is probably a good idea to object to it in the separate West Peckham consultation too.

[intexasatthe moment]

Good point ,Abe .

[alex_b]

Abe_froeman Wrote:

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> If you don't want it in ED it is probably a good

> idea to object to it in the separate West Peckham

> consultation too.

The West Peckham consultation appears to have been extended until the 7th Feb.

[Rockets]

Does anyone have a contact at the SOS campaign? If so, could they PM me the details?

[intexasatthe moment]

MarkT

"let's be clear on what is meant by promise of 40% increase in parking.

As I understand it they mean that if on a typical street before introduction of the CPZ you might have a choice of 10 available (ie currently empty) spaces to park your car, after introduction of the CPZ you would have choice of 14 spaces."

thank you for that ,it has the ring of a LA explanation and you're probably right in saying that's how they calculate spaces .

It doesn't help me understand though ,how do 10 spoaces become 14 by marking out residents/pay and display spaces ?

( by the way when I say the proposed CPZ with residents parking and new waiting restrictions would remove 5 spaces near me I am not including "spaces" across dropped curbs )

[Abe_froeman]

I guess he means if there are 30 spaces currently that are on average occupied by 20 cars then after the CPZ there will be on avsrage only 16 cars parked there.

[intexasatthe moment]

Ok . I guess the assumption is that a number of parked cars are owned by non residents .Which I can see might be the case in roads near the station . But not so much in Barry Rd .And a number of other roads not near the station or LL.