Horniman Gardens - Proposed changes to the Gardens

[Angelina]

My parents came up to London for a birthday treat recently - my dad rarely come up so it was a huge deal.

They went to Kew gardens and said it was completely overrun with noisy school children. She said parts of it were unbearable due to poor behaviour and lack of adult control - with the odd tantrum thrown in for good measure.

They cut their visit short which is a real pity.

Now, they are not anti-children, but it's important to remember these places mean different things to different people.

Perhaps if there are known hours when groups of children visit it would be more manageable. Or if children were actually managed.

[first mate]

I wish posters would stop falling back on easy insults like 'nimby' and 'curmudgeon' in order to justify a point. Whenever perceptions about noise impact differ from the views they hold and by extension think everyone else should also hold, there is a tendency to start to attack the poster for daring to express an opposite or different view. As Angelina points out, her parents are not anti children and just because they found noise levels at Kew intolerable does not make them curmudgeons either (a nasty and unecessary comment). It is a fact that hearing changes with age and this may have some bearing on lowered tolerance to certain sounds. All of these parks are shared spaces for the use of all, we should remember that.

As it happens, I do not have a problem with the Horniman plans, they seem okay to me, but I am sympathetic to concerns about noise and feel those concerns should be expressed without posters feeling they will be shot down in flames for so doing.

[wulfhound]

Kew has been over-marketed and is, nowadays, often overcrowded as a result. It's a huge site but the problem isn't really kids per se, it's just too many people full stop.

There are lots of nice parks which are almost deserted or at least have plenty of space, but people would rather go somewhere that the activities are obvious - even if you have to queue for half an hour and pay an arm and a leg to get in. I'd bet that in any day at Kew there are more people from Tooting, Wimbledon, Streatham, Mitcham etc. than on any of those suburbs' respective Commons.

(As to Dulwich's common.. it's mostly a golf course. You won't have a problem with crowds there but what a grossly wasteful use of inner London land. Nothing against golf, but go play it in Suffolk or Scotland or somewhere. And then we wonder why the parks are crowded).

[Applespider]

The old boating pool has goal posts in it but I've rarely seen very many kids in it. The new kinder cafe and adventure playground is in the corner with lots of residential properties around it which are suddenly going to become a lot noisier. There's already an adventure playground in the Horniman Triangle.

If they want to redevelop it to something other than an old concrete pool, it would be lovely to make it something designed to be quieter. A well-being & mindfulness garden perhaps that's designed for people to slow down and take time out? The rest of the site could potentially become so manic that a quiet space might be very welcome for visitors.

[dbboy]

I wonder if those properties/households who are going to be in close proximity to the new Kinder cafe are aware of the intentions of the Gardens of the changes that are being planned and the impact it will have on their family life?

Do planning regulations apply to the Gardens or can they do as they please and build what ever they like in the grounds of the Gardens. How sightly or unsightly will the two proposed walkways from the terrace where the bandstand is to the nature walk over the dog field and former boating lake to the nature trail?

Bet you didn't know that The Gardens have taken back control of the nature walk and it no longer is the responsibility of Lewisham Council (Lewisham have legally handed ownership back to the Hornimans).

Who will be responsible for the night walk path which runs from London Road to Westwood Park in parallel to the nature walk?

Will, do the Hornimans intend to open the entire length of the nature walk from London Road to the gates on Langton Rise behind all the odd numbered houses on that part of Westwood Park? Security issue me thinks???

The proposed changes open up a whole can of questions which I think the Hornimans need to provide answers to?

Please take the time to respond both positively and negatively, depending on your point of view to the proposals put forward by the Hornimans. The 22nd July, the cut off date for responses to be received is fast approaching, make your views known.

[AylwardS]

A reminder you have until 22nd JULY 2019 to provide your feedback, positive or negative.

You can read more about these plans online or via a display in the Museum -

[horniman.ac.uk]

This is informal consultation and there will be formal planning consultation but its worth making your views known.

The visitor numbers are more than they anticipated so there will be changes and in the main they look ok from my point of view but we all use the museum and gardens. differently.

Good point from Angelina about children being managed visiting at certain times or maybe certain areas could be kept child free. The gardens are big enough and people could then chose where / when to visit.

[dbboy]

Its the final opportunity to make post any thoughts you have about the changes to the Horniman Museum and Gardens, pls take the time to let them know what you think about the "proposed" changes.

[savvygirl]

I think it is proposed that there is direct access from the old boating lake area onto the nature trail. The nature trail itself is an area of biodiversity, a place of tranquillity for varied species of wildlife. My concern is that if it is used by parents, their kiddies and their dogs as just another cut through to London Road that peace and tranquillity will be lost. I really think the nature trail should be protected and access onto it restricted within certain hours, which I believe is the case at present.

[EPB]

Awulfhound Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

As to Dulwich's common.. it's mostly a golf course. You won't have a problem with crowds there

but what a grossly wasteful use of inner London land. Nothing against golf, but go play it in

> Suffolk or Scotland or somewhere.

And then we wonder why the parks are crowded.

It?s not actually ?mostly a golf course?. If you look it up on a map you?ll see that sports

grounds and playing fields take up an almost equal amount of space.

[EPB]

Awulfhound Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

?As to Dulwich's common.. it's mostly a golf course. You won't have a problem with crowds there

but what a grossly wasteful use of inner London land. Nothing against golf, but go play it in

> Suffolk or Scotland or somewhere.

And then we wonder why the parks are crowded.?

It?s not actually ?mostly a golf course?. If you look it up on a map you?ll see that sports grounds and

playing fields take up an almost equal amount of space.