researching family history in Camberwell and Dog Kennel Hill

[harman1932]

Hi, I am new to this forum and searching for any information about my family's history. I live in West Yorkshire so have difficulty in accessing it other than online.

My great grandfather was Frederick Harman, born in Camberwell. He fought in WW1 then moved here. I would love to find information about his siblings and find living relatives if possible. His father was William Harman and lived at Fernie House, Dog Kennel Hill for the last few years of his life (he died in the 1940s). Frederick had a half brother called Albert who married Emily, and they had a son also called Albert. I know that he lived at 1 Fernie House also for most of the 1940s and 50s. I assume that Fernie House is no longer there as I can't see it on any recent maps.

Frederick had a sister called Jane who I believe married a Samuel Garbutt in 1921, and they had several children.

If anyone knows of any information that might help me find Harman folk from the area I would be most grateful.

Regards

Carole

[GSJ57]

PM'd you

[harman1932]

Thank you very much for your research, I had found this info via ancestry but struggle to get much further with it. Yes it is my family tree you saw on ancestry. What I really need to do is get down there and find the parish records myself but never seem to have the time. I have been researching the Harmans for several years now and it makes it more difficult that my great grandad, his father and siblings are not on the 1911 census, plus his miltary records were destroyed by the fire at the War Office!! So I have a gap from 1901 and 1918 when he got married here in Yorkshire.

If you were to come across any other information I would be forever in your debt.

Thank you again.

Carole

[intexasatthe moment]

You might find it helpful to repost this in "The Lounge " section to get a wider audience .

I think Fernie House is still there - one of the blocks on the Dog Kennel Hill Estate .This shows location http://www.mouseprice.com/property-information/ref-613926/flat+1+fernie+house+dog+kennel+hill+estate+london+se22+

People sometimes write to the letters dept of the local newspaper - The South London Press - with similar requests for help .

[GSJ57]

I didn't realize you didn't have the 1911... here are the details:

35 South St, Walworth (1 room)

William Harman 43 widowed Firewood cutter

Fredrich Harman 16 Bottle washer

Sidney Harman 10

Frank Harman 6

I agree - you might get more response in the Lounge!

[Vik]

Fernie House is indeed still there, I'm happy to take some photos for you if you'd like to see where he lived.

[harman1932]

Thank you but that's a different family - William was the father, and as well as Frederick there was William, Harry and Jane.

I had a look on google maps and couldn't see Fernie House, but I'm not very good at navigating so I'll have a look at the site you suggested, thank you. That would be great if you could email a photo.

Thanks again

Carole

PS I have to say it is lovely that people on here have been so helpful :-)

[GSJ57]

Sorry about that - I was going by the occupation being the same as on the marriage certificate. I'll keep looking for you.

[intexasatthe moment]

ooh maybe they're related to Harriet Harman's husband !

[Vik]

The link below shows Fernie House, I'll get down there this week and see if I can get a pic of the front doors side of the block.

https://maps.google.co.uk/?ll=51.463942,-0.07956&spn=0.000747,0.001742&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=51.463864,-0.079498&panoid=nHzmnGY0KLo4v67LNWxBkQ&cbp=12,173.54,,0,-2.87

[Vik]

https://maps.google.co.uk/?ll=51.463942,-0.07956&spn=0.000747,0.001742&t=h&z=20&layer=c&cbll=51.463864,-0.079498&panoid=nHzmnGY0KLo4v67LNWxBkQ&cbp=12,173.54,,0,-2.87

[GSJ57]

Carole - I had a closer look and I really believe that the William Harman with his sons on the 1911 is your family. He remarried in 1913 to Hannah Rivett, and in 1911 she was living at 29 South Street, just 3 houses away from William at 35. The ages for William and Frederick match, as does the occupation of William. Sidney and Frank would not have been born yet and the missing Harry, Jane and William could be explained by William age 20 would probably be on his own. Jane and William ages 11 and 13 could have been sent to live with relatives or even sent away to school, as their mother died a couple of years previously. As William and the boys were only living in 1 room, there probably just wasn't enough room for everyone.

What do you think?

[harman1932]

After you explain it this way yes it does make sense - I feel really stupid because I've come across this record several times before and discarded the diea that they could be my Harmans because of Sidney and Frank, and even though I knew he remarried to Hannah Rivett it didn't occur to me that the addresses were so close! Thank you very much - I will be busy tonight exploring this more :-)

Vik - thank you to you also.

You have all been very helpful.

Carole

[skylorikeet]

intexasatthe moment Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> ooh maybe they're related to Harriet Harman's

> husband !

Harman is her own name, her husband's name is Jack Dromey. Would love this branch of the Harmans to be related to Harriet but they probably aren't as Harriet's family were prominent Harley St doctors and she's related to Neville Chamberlain and Lord Longford.

[harman1932]

Yes I'm 100% sure there is no money in my family history!!

[harman1932]

GSJ57 I've had another look at my infor and think more and more that you are right - the electoral rolls show William and Hannah with Sidney and Frank through the 1930s at Fernie House. I have ordered Frank's birth certificate to confirm his mother's name.

Carole

[GSJ57]

I had a feeling it was right....glad to help!