Racism and homophobia - where we are in 2008

[Tony.London Suburbs]

"In some ways sexism seems to be more socially and politically acceptable than racism or homophobia. At work or in a bar you frequently hear people making casually sexist comments (often women too) and getting ONLY an appreciative laugh in response"

SeanMacGabhann Wrote:

I'm dragging this up from a couple of weeks ago...

Am I to conclude that you would like a more robust and heartier response to sexist comments?:X:))

[Tony.London Suburbs]

lozzyloz Wrote:

Surely if you're a gay chav that makes you a gay gay chav but then the two gays would cancel each other out leaving you just a chav.

Surely some grey chavs,by the laws of average,must be gay,as well...

[SeanMacGabhann]

I wouldn't want to lose "cheeky banter", but much like James "gay" argument, context is everything. Mostly I just would like to see less victims of abuse end up in hospitals I guess..

[Tony.London Suburbs]

SeanMacGabhann Wrote:

I wouldn't want to lose "cheeky banter", but much like James "gay" argument, context is everything.

Mostly I just would like to see less victims of abuse end up in hospitals I guess..

Sean:You won't get anyone argue with the second sentence on here or (hopefully) anywhere else...

"Cheeky Banter"..mmmm...in 1978 when the "Boyz"(Not Guilty) locked Jill Plank in a cupboard for a whole lunch hour until they returned from "The Witness Box"..does that count in those Pre-PC Times or even now...::o

[Huguenot]

Very much agreed SMG.

Interesting points from others though. I often hear 'girl' or 'woman' used as a word meaning shit - "don't be such a big girl", "he's being an old woman". On recent review I probably hear it more often than the term 'gay' as an insult, which TBH I simply very rarely hear.

But then I don't listen to fat prats on the radio.

Did you know that 'prat' actually means the female front bottom? Did you also notice how I turned 'fat' into an insult when these poor guys are just victims of their metabolism?

I could have said 'berk', but that also means female front bottom etc. etc.

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Huguenot Wrote:

Very much agreed SMG.>

> Interesting points from others though. I often

> hear 'girl' or 'woman' used as a word meaning shit

> - "don't be such a big girl", "he's being an old

> woman".

Funnily enough on Match Of The Day last Saturday Mark Lawrenson said "tackled like a big jessie" and I'll be perfectly honest I got really irritated when Ray Stubbs did his "pc" bit and brought him to task on it.It did not ring true as Ray must have heard much worse 1,000 times b4 and not said anything.He then mentioned it again at the end of the programme by saying "Goodbye from our 2 Jessies!"..Alab Shearer laughed but,significantly,Lawrenson did not!

If we are being honest B++ch" is mentioned ad nauseum,ad infinitum by (young,usually) Women in addition to Men plus the "Big Girls Blouse" other type comments...

I know in my all-male work environment if 2 Guys continually bicker then the cry will go up "GIRLS!"...or if someone does go on and on and on they get "'ark at her"....not saying its right but its life,innit....

[Brendan]

The fact that you guys are all being so level headed about this and clearly considering all sides of the argument fairly and properly can only mean one of two things. You?re either a bunch of bum hungry, closet cases or you?re hoping that the ?reconstructed? thing will get you laid.

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Last thought b4 I go out now.

In balance I have to say in our sub-conscious we do give Men a much harder time in everyday languageI feel. but as Men are expected to "take it on the chin" they are fair game.

I'll give you a quick example.If someone criticises a Male trait like "Aggression" etc(Yes! I know NOT every Man and Yes I Know "some" Women) but surely we can all see that during our lifetime that there are far more aggressive occurrences by Men.Simple things really and there are other not-so=commendable "Male" traits that most/all can easily identify.

Now when these are mentioned casually on TV,for example,no-one disputes this and no-one "counterbalances" this by mentioning "Female" traits that are not positive.The conversation continues to flow...however if a negative Female trait is mentioned and highlighted then 8/10 the perpetrator will DELIBERATELY mention a "positive" one or mention a "negative" Male trait to balance the earlier comment.It,literally,happens all the time and no-one thinks twice about it.....anyway don't want anyone to think that I am b++ching so I'll go now....oh#! shoot!

[Tony.London Suburbs]

Tony.London Suburbs Wrote:

Last thought b4 I go out now. In balance I have to say in our sub-conscious we do give Men a much harder time in everyday

languageI feel. but as Men are expected to "take it on the chin" they are fair game. I'll give you a quick example.If someone criticises a Male trait like "Aggression" etc(Yes! I know NOT every Man and Yes I Know "some" Women)

but surely we can all see that during our lifetime> that there are far more aggressive occurrences by

Men.Simple things really and there are other not-so=commendable "Male" traits that most/all can easily identify.

Now when these are mentioned casually on TV,for example,no-one disputes this and no-one

"counterbalances" this by mentioning "Female" traits that are not positive.The conversation

continues to flow...however if a negative Female trait is mentioned and highlighted then 8/10 the

perpetrator will DELIBERATELY mention a "positive"

Classic example as soon as I walk thru' the door.Old builder called "Grumpy Old Sod" by Colin and Justin-Interior Designers followed by them seeing a "fit" Young Builder so they say to the older Guy "Look at you,a clapped-out old banger!".."we could be working with this Guy instead"...no comeback at all,things continued.Can you imagine that happening to a Female "victim" being called a "grumpy old sod" and better still "a clapped-out old banger"...me neither:))

[Moos]

Er, TLS, that's pretty much exactly what people have been saying.

Basically, what it comes down to is that in 'real life' women and people from perceived 'other' groups get more of a hard time than white heterosexual middle-class men. On TV and in the liberal media it's generally the other way around, which is unfair. But then all that money and power must be something of a compensation?

[mockney piers]

"But then all that money and power must be something of a compensation?"

You better believe it pumpkin!!!

[Moos]

*giggles inanely*

[RosieH]

Tony, bless you, this is merely redressing the balance for all the years the female form has been hostage to the male gaze both on and off screen.

[Brendan]

Fair point toots.

Although as a middle class, white, heterosexual, male I would really like to know where my money and power is. Maybe they handed them out after assembly one day when I was smoking behind the stables.

[Moos]

Yeah, Brendan, you MUST be a loser... all those advantages, and you're not ruling the world yet? What have you been doing?

Edited to say - arargh, now I'm worried Brendan is offended...please reply!

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

He's quite famous for his flounces.

[Moos]

I've done it now. All those months of carefully cultivating the nice-old-Moos persona, and one careless post reveals the bitch beneath.

[Brendan]

Wasn't flouncing. Was in a meeting. It was about summat worky, quite possibly involving money and/or power

?and stationary.

[david_carnell]

Have you been stealing it again?

[Brendan]

Colonising and civilising is the way I prefer to refer to it.

[RosieH]

yeah, patriarchal imperialism's rampant even in the stationery cupboard

[david_carnell]

You Safa's....constantly segregating your paperclips!

[Moos]

Rampant, rampant? How dare you employ that sexist terminology.

[Brendan]

Is this the giant bunny thread?

[RosieH]

david_carnell Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> You Safa's....constantly segregating your

> paperclips!

I get the special yonic ones from a little shop in stoke newington