63 Bus route extension to Honor Oak Park Station

[Medley]

No, as the 363 goes to C Palace and the 63 terminates at Honor Oak, by the Forest Hill Tavern

[dbboy]

People seem to be forgetting the P12 and P4 bus routes which already provide cover from Brenchley Gardens to Brockley Rise and along Honor Oak Park through to Lewisham

[James Barber]

Hi dbboy,

I hate changing buses. I especially hate changing buses when I'm with kids and/or heavy bags.

Taking one bus to an East London Line station I would have thought really helpful. As helpful would be real time bus information but that's another argument.

[dbboy]

All you need to do is walk from Forest Hill Tavern (Forest Hill Road), or the first bus stop in Woodvale to Brenchley Gardens, it takes a few minutes either way even with kids and heavy bags.

[H]

dbboy Wrote:

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> All you need to do is walk from Forest Hill Tavern

> (Forest Hill Road), or the first bus stop in

> Woodvale to Brenchley Gardens, it takes a few

> minutes either way even with kids and heavy bags.

Great, except for those with mobility problems.

For those with PAYG on Oyster they need to pay twice having to change buses. I personally would like to see the 63 extended and have signed the petition. Thank you to everyone who has raised this issue, I hope you succeed.

[Vagueman]

Seems like a good idea to me. I don't think the p12 actually enters se22, but heads off to Nunhead, while the p4 only briefly between Woodvale and the Harvester, so for the majority of East Dulwich these aren't options without changing buses (both buses can be a bit unpredictable at peak periods too).

If you're commuting via Honor Oak then you don't want to add an extra 15 minutes to your journey time and the extra expense of two buses (if you're travelling on by ELR or Rail why buy a bus pass?). If you're a parent with a buggy, changing buses isn't fun - and there's no guarantee there'll be space for a buggy on the next bus.

An extended 63 would also open up a few of the restaurants down in Honor Oak to the residents of East Dulwich.

Of course traffic might be a problem - who know's until a trial run takes place? If Cabrini school parents are causing traffic problems, then they should be told to sort the problem out. Should we miss out on a handy bus service because of a school run? Perhaps a regular bus service will get people driving their children to school less.

As a resident of Wood Vale please don't mess with the N63/363 though.

[Nero]

What about one of the buses that are used on the 42 route? They are larger than the type that run the P13/484 routes but not as big as a double-decker.

[dbboy]

H Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> dbboy Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > All you need to do is walk from Forest Hill

> Tavern

> > (Forest Hill Road), or the first bus stop in

> > Woodvale to Brenchley Gardens, it takes a few

> > minutes either way even with kids and heavy

> bags.

>

>

> Great, except for those with mobility problems.

>

> For those with PAYG on Oyster they need to pay

> twice having to change buses. I personally would

> like to see the 63 extended and have signed the

> petition. Thank you to everyone who has raised

> this issue, I hope you succeed.

Unlikely to be an issue as if the intention is to travel from Honor Oak Park station as its very probable Oyster PAYG would be used for the forward or return journey.

The issue of sorting out traffic issues at cabrini school is not going to work without police intervention. Parents park up both sides of Forest Hill Road, into Honor Oak Road and the sround the bend into Honor Oak Park, on the pavements plus the bottom of Netherby and Canonbie Roads causing traffic chaos especially in term time. This in turn delays both buses and cars trying to proceed along these routes. Adding a further or extending a current bus route will further compound the congestion. The roads were not desighed for this level of traffic. Lets stick with what we've got (which in effect is not a bad service with two bus routes serving this stretch of road.

[Vagueman]

But as stated earlier the two bus routes don't serve East Dulwich, which is why quite a few people want this extension.

Perhaps the councillors could investigate the problems caused by the school run and work on solutions with the school, if this is such a major issue. It seems a shame to scrap a potentially useful service for many, just because of two hours of bad parental parking.

[H]

dbboy Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> H Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > dbboy Wrote:

> >

> --------------------------------------------------

>

> > -----

> > > All you need to do is walk from Forest Hill

> > Tavern

> > > (Forest Hill Road), or the first bus stop in

> > > Woodvale to Brenchley Gardens, it takes a few

> > > minutes either way even with kids and heavy

> > bags.

>

> >

> >

> > Great, except for those with mobility problems.

>

> >

> > For those with PAYG on Oyster they need to pay

> > twice having to change buses. I personally

> would

> > like to see the 63 extended and have signed the

> > petition. Thank you to everyone who has raised

> > this issue, I hope you succeed.

>

> Unlikely to be an issue as if the intention is to

> travel from Honor Oak Park station as its very

> probable Oyster PAYG would be used for the forward

> or return journey.

>

> The issue of sorting out traffic issues at cabrini

> school is not going to work without police

> intervention. Parents park up both sides of Forest

> Hill Road, into Honor Oak Road and the sround the

> bend into Honor Oak Park, on the pavements plus

> the bottom of Netherby and Canonbie Roads causing

> traffic chaos especially in term time. This in

> turn delays both buses and cars trying to proceed

> along these routes. Adding a further or extending

> a current bus route will further compound the

> congestion. The roads were not desighed for this

> level of traffic. Lets stick with what we've got

> (which in effect is not a bad service with two bus

> routes serving this stretch of road.

Return journey to London Bridge from Honor Oak using one bus and one train journey on peak would be 2 lots of ?2.60 on the train and 2 lots of ?1.20 on the bus, making ?7.60 in total. With two buses involved for each leg of the journey you will be capping at the daily rate of ?8.60. So that is ?1 difference each day during peak hours. Multiply this over the year and I think you will find it adds up. For off peak journeys there is no difference as the cap is at ?6.30.

[dbboy]

East Dulwich has a plethora of buses along Lorpship Lane going into town, 37, 484 and there are three railway stations, East, West and North Dulwich railway stations plus Herne Hill and Peckham Rye not far away either. All round a pretty good choice compared to other areas of south east London.

P12 from Peckham Rye/Heaton Arms goes to Honor Oak Park although a bit of a longer route. Sometimes you need to crack eggs!!!

[sfgutmann]

I am sorry to say that I find the contributions of dbboys to be depresssingly repetitive and so boring. I have stated that I am disabled. In fact I am assessed as requiring the highest rate of mobility support. Yet dbboys claims that the P12 is OK for my journey to HOP station. It would be if changing from the Forest Hill Tavern stop and reaching the P12 stop at Brenchley Gardens wasn't utterly exhausting and time consuming. All I asked for was that for about 2 hours in the morning and evening periods the 63 is extended for the distance of the 3 more stops. The buses could even come back to the stand at Honor Oak Forest Hill Tavern. Is that too much too ask?

[dbboy]

sfgutmann - sorry you find my "contributions to be depresssingly repetitive and so boring". I am stating facts.

[TJ]

dbboy, you are really on your own here.

The service in general is required to help link the underground to overground network, to pass a highly populated commuter area and to reduce the time it takes to get around london.

We are all busy and changing to the local P busses, which run less frequently and are not so reliable is not a solution, but a major compromise. Surely, you can appreciate having busses running from an station to where people live is a good idea?!

By using the school run parents as an excuse, points to the possibility you may be one of those parents yourself and are trying to reduce the reasons why parking there should be clamped down on?

We all have our points of view and this post is here to support it.

Please set up your own post called down with the proposed 63 buss extension and see what support you get.

[bil]

TJ: Well said!

[Vagueman]

Dbboy, you said in a previous post that you live on the hill, so you therefore you are well serviced by the p12 and p4 and have no need to change buses. That's great for you, but you need to think of the needs of others.

We are arguing for a service for people from East Dulwich following the route of the 63. The fact that you are ignoring is that none of Peckham Rye Station, Peckham Rye/Heaton Road bus stop, West Dulwich, Brenchley Gardens, Nunhead, North Dulwich and Herne Hill are actually in Se22 and the P4 and P12 only brush the edges of SE22, so none of these will provide the service that an extended 63 route would.

Then add the fact that Honor Oak Park will be on the ELL, whereas none of the above stations or East Dulwich Station will be in the near future. If you look at Se23.com people from Forest Hill want this service too.

One other fact to note - I travelled yesterday on th p4 past the Cabrini School during school pick up time and there was no sign of the traffic mayhem you stated. All traffic was running smoothly. Would one bus every 8-10 minutes really turn this road to gridlock?

I'm not saying this extension is not without issues - would the turnaround on Brockley Rise work? - but to be so dismissive of an idea that will benefit a great number of people in both se22 and se23, just because it is something that does not meet your needs, seems wrong in my opinion.

[dbboy]

sfgutmann, tj and vagueman lets wait and see what the outcome of tfl's decision is??

Although you don't like the opinion I'm expressing as it happens to oppose to your own, everyone is entitled to express an opinion, this is a public forum and that's exactly what i'm doing, I won't pipe down as you would like but will continue to state facts.

[TJ]

TFL are sitting on their hands - we all know this.

This is a forum for SE22 residents - are you a se22 resident db?

[SeanMacGabhann]

dbboy - facts inform decisions and choices - they don't inherently mean anything. If you contract some horrible disease and you go to the doctor for help - he or she saying "well you have a horrible disease, it's a fact" isn't what you are after. What you are after is some joined up decision making which leads to the formulation of some cure AND a system which delivers that to you at minimum cost

It IS a public forum and you are expressing your opinion - no one is preventing you - but if people disagree with you is there any need to get quite so defensive?

[TJ]

Unless he wants to catch a bus towards Rye Lane / town..

Vagueman Wrote:

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> Dbboy, you said in a previous post that you live

> on the hill, so you therefore you are well

> serviced by the p12 and p4 and have no need to

> change buses. That's great for you, but you need

> to think of the needs of others.

> We are arguing for a service for people from East

> Dulwich following the route of the 63. The fact

> that you are ignoring is that none of Peckham Rye

> Station, Peckham Rye/Heaton Road bus stop, West

> Dulwich, Brenchley Gardens, Nunhead, North Dulwich

> and Herne Hill are actually in Se22 and the P4 and

> P12 only brush the edges of SE22, so none of these

> will provide the service that an extended 63 route

> would.

> Then add the fact that Honor Oak Park will be on

> the ELL, whereas none of the above stations or

> East Dulwich Station will be in the near future.

> If you look at Se23.com people from Forest Hill

> want this service too.

> One other fact to note - I travelled yesterday

> on th p4 past the Cabrini School during school

> pick up time and there was no sign of the traffic

> mayhem you stated. All traffic was running

> smoothly. Would one bus every 8-10 minutes really

> turn this road to gridlock?

> I'm not saying this extension is not without

> issues - would the turnaround on Brockley Rise

> work? - but to be so dismissive of an idea that

> will benefit a great number of people in both se22

> and se23, just because it is something that does

> not meet your needs, seems wrong in my opinion.

[Vagueman]

Dbboy, I have no problem with a difference of opinion - the extension isn't problem free, and your issue is with the school parking is worth raising, but you seem dismissive of other peoples needs and were presenting as facts what were merely opinions. For example you state that there is no need for the extension - the need is there, whether it is worth the cost and extra traffic is the matter for debate.

[stardotbmp]

I've never really got to understand why the claims of no turnaround persist. The #172 and #P12 both turn around at the end of HOP without problems.