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messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by L16579 13 July, 2018 23:31

Weíre considering taking £450k for our 2 bed conversion now the markets taken a tumble. Family situation otherwise we would hang on for a year or so and hope to get nearer the £550k the estate agents were sure it was worth in March. I think there has been a lot of over pricing by the local estate agents which hasnít helped.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by fishbiscuits 16 July, 2018 10:38

L16579 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think there has been a lot of over pricing by the local
> estate agents which hasnít helped.

This is what I can't work out. If the housing market has stalled, why haven't asking prices come down? Why are agents still putting on 2 bed flats at 550K, 3 bed houses at 950K?

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Mick Mac 16 July, 2018 15:38

fishbiscuits Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> L16579 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I think there has been a lot of over pricing by
> the local
> > estate agents which hasnít helped.
>
> This is what I can't work out. If the housing
> market has stalled, why haven't asking prices come
> down? Why are agents still putting on 2 bed flats
> at 550K, 3 bed houses at 950K?

About a third of the rightmove added in last 24 hours properties on any given day are shown as "reduced" - surely thats a reduction in asking prices.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by JohnL 16 July, 2018 16:00

Mick Mac Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> fishbiscuits Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > L16579 Wrote:
> >
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> > -----
> > > I think there has been a lot of over pricing
> by
> > the local
> > > estate agents which hasnít helped.
> >
> > This is what I can't work out. If the housing
> > market has stalled, why haven't asking prices
> come
> > down? Why are agents still putting on 2 bed
> flats
> > at 550K, 3 bed houses at 950K?
>
> About a third of the rightmove added in last 24
> hours properties on any given day are shown as
> "reduced" - surely thats a reduction in asking
> prices.

Unless you're DFS House Sales.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Blackcurrant 16 July, 2018 16:26

fishbiscuits Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> L16579 Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > I think there has been a lot of over pricing by
> the local
> > estate agents which hasnít helped.
>
> This is what I can't work out. If the housing
> market has stalled, why haven't asking prices come
> down? Why are agents still putting on 2 bed flats
> at 550K, 3 bed houses at 950K?

Estate agents don't much care what houses actually sell for. They just want the instruction. The business model is based on turnover, not high prices. So agents compete for instructions by inflating sellers' hopes with claims they can get a higher price than other agents. Then, when the house has languished unsold for 10 weeks, they hope the seller will cut the price to market value and get a sale. As a result, in a falling market most sellers end up stuck above high-tide mark, while the few buyers around only offer on the bargains.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Mick Mac 16 July, 2018 16:26

Unless you're DFS House Sales.

Yes - there is that....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was 2018:07:16:17:04:16 by Mick Mac.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by bsand 18 July, 2018 10:16

Condition , location and price get all these in place and you will have a sale. My dad said buy the worse house on the best street if you can. Check out nethouseprices.co.uk to see what actual sales have been similar to your recently. Tis a buyer's market at the moment if you're not prepared to discount then buyers will look to sellers who will. When you see falling prices the market psychology goes into reverse. If I wait I might get it cheaper next month , year plus if you're mortgaged - valuers are starting to downvalue to protect the bank's equity interest in the purchase. Plus there is a vast oversupply of central rabbit hutches waiting to glut the market with help to buy, big discounts and freebies such as 'no stamp duty' free furniture , iphones and the like to tempt prospects.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was 2018:07:18:10:20:46 by bsand.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Mark 18 July, 2018 10:48

L16579 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I think there has been a lot of over pricing by the local
> estate agents which hasnít helped.

I'll refer you to a classic EDF posts "Want to be an Estate Agent?" posted by MrBen [www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk]

It's a favourite because 2 days later an estate agents came round to ours and did exactly that (except number 5 as we didn't use them).

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by ed26 20 July, 2018 14:39

>
> Estate agents don't much care what houses actually
> sell for. They just want the instruction. The
> business model is based on turnover, not high
> prices. So agents compete for instructions by
> inflating sellers' hopes with claims they can get
> a higher price than other agents. Then, when the
> house has languished unsold for 10 weeks, they
> hope the seller will cut the price to market value
> and get a sale. As a result, in a falling market
> most sellers end up stuck above high-tide mark,
> while the few buyers around only offer on the
> bargains.


The percentage model is totally biased against customers and favours the agent. If you're charging 2% of a sale price (no idea what rates are around here at the moment) and the asking price is £1m, an agent doesn't care whether they get 2% of £1m or 2% of £900K, as it's just the difference of £18K in the bank or £20K that may come later if they are fortunate.

A more equitable model would be to agree a listing fee for a price that any monkey could sell for (say £800K in this example) and then, say, 10%-15% of every £1 above this level. This way, the estate agent would be more realistic about the likely sale price and be incentivised to get the best price for their customer.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Abe_froeman 20 July, 2018 15:29

It's worse than that Ed, because the individuals who make the sale are competing against each other to earn 10% of that 2% commission.

So for the individual agents it's the difference between £2000 that might never materialise and £1800 cash this month that a colleague might take off you by closing the sale now at a lower price.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Blackcurrant 20 July, 2018 15:38

ed26 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Estate agents don't much care what houses
> actually
> > sell for. They just want the instruction. The
> > business model is based on turnover, not high
> > prices. So agents compete for instructions by
> > inflating sellers' hopes with claims they can
> get
> > a higher price than other agents. Then, when
> the
> > house has languished unsold for 10 weeks, they
> > hope the seller will cut the price to market
> value
> > and get a sale. As a result, in a falling
> market
> > most sellers end up stuck above high-tide mark,
> > while the few buyers around only offer on the
> > bargains.
>
>
> The percentage model is totally biased against
> customers and favours the agent. If you're
> charging 2% of a sale price (no idea what rates
> are around here at the moment) and the asking
> price is £1m, an agent doesn't care whether they
> get 2% of £1m or 2% of £900K, as it's just the
> difference of £18K in the bank or £20K that may
> come later if they are fortunate.
>
> A more equitable model would be to agree a listing
> fee for a price that any monkey could sell for
> (say £800K in this example) and then, say, 10%-15%
> of every £1 above this level. This way, the estate
> agent would be more realistic about the likely
> sale price and be incentivised to get the best
> price for their customer.

That assumes the estate agent has some degree of control over the price achieved, but the truth is that the final price is determined by the market and not the effort the agent puts into marketing the house.

Where they do sometimes earn their fee is in keeping chains from falling apart, but that's not usually a huge amount of work.

There's a good reason that it's usually the manager that visits all the prospective sellers and the grunts that do the selling - getting properties signed up is the most important part of the business.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by bsand 24 July, 2018 08:24

Rightmove and Zoopla have made the market more transparent than ever - couple with easily available land registry prices 'price discovery' isn't the black art it once was. If you have the time to intelligently and competently handling enquiries quickly and price appropriately to market I would be tempted to go with one of the online agents but be prepared to put the time in and realise they like to overprice to get the listing as there is a fee to pay sold or unsold. Agents will talk persuasively about cross marketing from different branches of the network but many are stand alone franchises with no incentive to to do so.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit was 2018:07:24:08:29:28 by bsand.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by DulwichLondoner 24 July, 2018 09:26

ed26 Wrote:

> A more equitable model would be to agree a listing
> fee for a price that any monkey could sell for
> (say £800K in this example) and then, say, 10%-15%
> of every £1 above this level. This way, the estate
> agent would be more realistic about the likely
> sale price and be incentivised to get the best
> price for their customer.

I have tried to negotiate something like this this year (the higher the price, the higher the commission) and only 1 out of 4 agents contacted would accept it

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Mick Mac 24 July, 2018 11:44

Blackcurrant Wrote:

>
> That assumes the estate agent has some degree of
> control over the price achieved,

They will in many cases. Once they have a genuinely interested party, they need to manage both the buyer and the seller to a price they are both willing to proceed at.

If you don't believe the agent has any impact on price, then use Purple Bricks. But although you save on commission you could well be losing much more than that on price.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by bsand 26 July, 2018 09:54

Yes they are selling - May sold prices ...


112 Landcroft Road, East Dulwich, London, SE22 9JW
Terraced, Freehold, Non-Newbuild
£940,000 18th May 2018
265 - 267 Lordship Lane, London, SE22 8JG
Freehold, Non-Newbuild
£66,000 17th May 2018
49 Hindmans Road, London, SE22 9NQ
Terraced, Freehold, Non-Newbuild
£890,000 16th May 2018
Flat A 26 Crawthew Grove, London, SE22 9AB
Flat, Leasehold, Non-Newbuild
£625,000 11th May 2018
The Ground Floor Flat At 43 St Francis Road, London, SE22 8DE
Flat, Leasehold, Non-Newbuild
£470,000 11th May 2018
1a Crystal Palace Road, London, SE22 9EX
Flat, Leasehold, Non-Newbuild
£487,500 10th May 2018
158 Peckham Rye, London, SE22 9QH
Terraced, Freehold, Non-Newbuild
£1,150,000 4th May 2018
38 Shawbury Road, London, SE22 9DH
Freehold, Non-Newbuild
£12,900 4th May 2018
184a Lordship Lane, London, SE22 8LR
Flat, Leasehold, Non-Newbuild
£625,000 4th May 2018

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by zoester 26 July, 2018 20:47

To chime in here, we just bought a 3 bed flat on upland road. It is newly renovated and we were prepared to pay the asking or close to it because it was so special. However, our mortgage valuation had different ideas. They undervalued the property by a big chunk so we ultimately ended up paying less than we first offered. The point Iím making isnít that we are total morons willing to over pay but that the people carrying out valuations for mortgage companies are down pricing because they can see the market has stalled. Itís worth bearing in mind that even if you are waiting for an offer on your property that is acceptable to you, it might not be worth that in the eyes of the lender. Of course it all depends on the buyers LTV but I do think that estate agents are generally guilty of over inflating prices to have you sign up with them only to lead you on a long road of price reductions and disappointment. Just my two pennies worth! Wishing everyone the best of luck and if you are really stuck try Nested. We have used them for both of our properties in order to make this move happen. Itís not a perfect solution because itís more expensive than the generic sales route but it does guarantee youíll be chain free in 90 days.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Carissa88 29 July, 2018 21:29

We are looking to sell at the moment but the estate agents have said how bad the market is at the moment. How did you find Nested? Quite an interesting idea!

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by bargee99 31 July, 2018 00:05

I commissioned "No Flies" in mid April. Sale complete and moved out before the end of May. Use the right people and ask a fair price and there doesn't seem to be a problem.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by KidKruger 31 July, 2018 12:03

On that note. Anyone sitting on £1m equity who doesn't sell before March 2019 may well find themselves sitting on £750K equity soon after. Sell now unless you can afford to lose that kind of money. You can always buy back in a couple of years later and actually turn a profit.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by fishbiscuits 31 July, 2018 13:00

bargee99 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Use the right people and ask a fair price

Yeah.. but I think the price really is the main factor. There is some utter crap on the market at around 1M... houses that need completely gutting. I don't get it!

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by JohnL 31 July, 2018 13:08

KidKruger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> On that note. Anyone sitting on £1m equity who
> doesn't sell before March 2019 may well find
> themselves sitting on £750K equity soon after.
> Sell now unless you can afford to lose that kind
> of money. You can always buy back in a couple of
> years later and actually turn a profit.

I really hope March 2019 becomes just another date in the calendar.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by dbboy 31 July, 2018 14:19

The market is tough out there and is only going to get tougher up to March 2019 and then for the following two years, so if you're selling, get onto your agent and badger them to get you viewings and make them earn their commission because you'll already find they have increased it and I can only assume it will be further increased to compensate for the slowness of the market. Don't be surprised if their commission rates increase over the next 24 months to 2% or even 2.5%.

You'll also slowly see Estate Agents closing their doors as competition between them intensifies. The benefit is the proven good agents will prosper while the remainder will gradually wither away. You'll already have noticed if you are a seller that some agents are continuing to make unsolicited approaches trying to entice sellers away from their agent. This type of activity by agents is likely to only increase, but on the plus side their will be far less of agents marketing through letter boxes. I'd guess the independents are even more at risk.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Abe_froeman 01 August, 2018 09:57

Ddboy i can assume you are trolling. Never in the history of mankind has a business enticed customers away from a competitor or avoided closing down by doubling thier prices. Commissions, if they mive at all, will move with house prices, not in the opposite direction.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by JohnL 01 August, 2018 10:22

Foxton's has made a loss and a large fall in sales too.

Maybe that new Rye Lane branch won't last (not that I know how well any specific branch does).

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by dbboy 01 August, 2018 14:06

No not trolling, Its a prediction, I maybe totally wrong, but watch, wait and see and judge in 2 1/2 years time.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by zoester 12 August, 2018 09:57

Carissa88 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> We are looking to sell at the moment but the
> estate agents have said how bad the market is at
> the moment. How did you find Nested? Quite an
> interesting idea!

Funnily enough through social media, thatís there they were doing most of their advertising. It just worked a miracle for and my boyfriend as we had a flat to sell each to find the purchase of our move to East Dulwich and without nested we wouldnít be here. My flat is only just going through the sale process after nearly a year on the market and my boyfriend has had 4 viewings on his flat in a highly desirable area east when the pricing is below that of similar properties. It really isnít as simple as Ďif the price is right then it will sellí. there are so many contributing factors so if you want to get moving quickly rather than stagnating on the market then you might as well talk to nested and see how the numbers would work for you. Theyíre on their way to completely changing the way people buy and sell property, your average estate agent is going to be hugely at risk

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Oldtincan 20 August, 2018 14:39

London (asking) house prices down 2.3% month on month in August: [www.homesandproperty.co.uk]

Our neighbours over the road have finally got an offer on their house having reduced the price by 15% from their original asking price. I suspect the market will grind slowly lower through Brexit and the government will eventually be forced to kick start the market by abolishing/reducing stamp duty. Just my thoughts..

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by James 20 August, 2018 15:52

All these people saying "If you price it right, it will sell... it must be overpriced" are being a little smug I think. Surely a huge factor in a depressed market like this is luck. To those who are easily selling their places at the moment, has it occurred to you that perhaps you were just fortunate in getting the right buyer coming along at the right time? Telling anyone who can't sell that they are being greedy or unrealistic and overpricing their houses is a bit patronising and shows a bit of an empathy deficit. Reminds me of the old Tory mentality of "Well I did all right for myself so anyone who can't must be lazy or thick." (Um, no actually, there is always an element of luck in any market situation).

Our house looks great, and is sensibly priced. It's not selling. So we need to decide how much of a hit we can take on the price. Which is not a great situation to be in.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by JohnL 20 August, 2018 16:25

James Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> All these people saying "If you price it right, it
> will sell... it must be overpriced" are being a
> little smug I think. Surely a huge factor in a
> depressed market like this is luck. To those who
> are easily selling their places at the moment, has
> it occurred to you that perhaps you were just
> fortunate in getting the right buyer coming along
> at the right time? Telling anyone who can't sell
> that they are being greedy or unrealistic and
> overpricing their houses is a bit patronising and
> shows a bit of an empathy deficit. Reminds me of
> the old Tory mentality of "Well I did all right
> for myself so anyone who can't must be lazy or
> thick." (Um, no actually, there is always an
> element of luck in any market situation).
>
> Our house looks great, and is sensibly priced.
> It's not selling. So we need to decide how much of
> a hit we can take on the price. Which is not a
> great situation to be in.


You can't have a go at someone for whatever they price their houses at - you can but try for the best (buyer or seller) in your own circumstances.

messageRe: Are houses selling around here at all?
Posted by Townleygreen 20 August, 2018 17:35

James said: Our house looks great, and is sensibly priced. It's not selling. So we need to decide how much of a hit we can take on the price. Which is not a great situation to be in.

Hopefully the house you're buying will take a similar hit, so you won't be any worse off?

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