Saffron

Agreed. Funny, I also did not grow up in London, and my daughter already sounds different compared to me. But then again, she also sounds different to DH who did grow up in London. She makes her own unique word combinations, and I love hearing her language progress. She's nearly 3 years old. Our recent struggle has been to get her to say 'hospital' instead of 'hostibal'. I make a habit of just repeating it correctly without actually correcting her. Although occasionally when I'm very tired, she's gotten me saying it wrong.

Tone can be understood in a number of different ways. I've just re-read the thread, and personally I don't find it racist. Observing and commenting on cultural or race-related differences in itself is not racist. Neither is it racist or classist to want to hear one's own children speak in a similar manner to oneself, so long as none of these things is done in a way that disparages other cultures. It is possible to dislike other cultural practices to the preference of one's own without being racist. That is how I personally read the comments on this thread. Herein is one of the curiosities of written versus spoken English, that two people may read the same statements and infer different tones. However, the beauty of online Forums is that they turn written English into (nearly) realtime conversations, allowing an interchange of ideas that reading alone does not allow. It's a very interesting discussion.

And now, the SECOND PART to my question! Would my nearly 3 year old daughter be welcome to join my mother and me at any of these places? She's fairly well-behaved, but there will be bouts of wild laughter with occasional bouncing on seats... and that's just Granny!

Scanning this thread, and maybe I missed it, but did nobody mention that you need to treat your bedding, pillows, carseats, hats, headphones and plush toys? You can use hot/cold/smothering to treat these items.

DaveR, I'd even expand that to say that there is a differece between what is accepted as correct and what is accepted as appropriate. The progression of language is generally from oracy to literacy, where understanding of a spoken language is seen as fundamental before understanding of a written language can progress. Basically, children learn to speak before they learn to read. Therefore a thorough understanding of pronunciation, word order, and meaning is fundamental in order to attain a thorough understanding of written usage. Returning to the OP's opening question, a child needs to understand the pronunciation of a spoken word in order to aid its later usage in written English, including a comprehensive understanding of when and why words are sometimes spoken differently. Indeed there may be multiple reasons why a word is different in one context compared to another. However, as the OP's child is still very young, personally I wouldn't dwell too much on overtly correcting her. As previously suggested, one of the best ways to teach good oracy to young children is simply to repeat their statements back to them correctly when they mispronouce or misuse words. Unless there are other problems in the child's speech, the issue will likely correctly itself overtime. If not, then a speech and language therapist might be helpful. Instilling an early love of books is probably also a good idea. Even though children may be too young to read all of the words themselves, listening to pronunciation and understanding speech patterns will help them develop their own linguistic skills. However, I would put the caveat on this, that you will reap what you sow: I have seen plenty of linguistic errors in children's books!

My mother is visiting over her birthday soon. I'd like to do something nice with her. She's rarely in London, so I thought tea somewhere in town would be lovely. Forumites, opinions please, what's best and why: Tea at the Ritz, Savoy, Dorchester, other??? Afternoon tea, high tea, or champagne tea (is that an oxymoron?)? What's 'champagne tea' anyway? Do I need to book, online, telephone, how far in advance?

LondonMix Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > If only people who are too busy to get > properly involve in any particular issue attend > the caf? (as you suggested) it will just be a > bunch of uninformed people sitting around having a > moan about something they don?t fully understand > with no organizational network behind them. Basically, like the ED Forum but with cake... Mmmmm cake. ;-)

Strawbs Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Mrs g I have experienced the same today actually.. > Mini strawbs has had something or another since > starting but always able to go to nursery until > yesterday.. Doc at 6pm, seldoc dulwich hospital > 11.15pm, kings midnight, today docs 11am and kings > again by midday just getting home now.. Thankfully > I emailed my boss last night who said either work > from home or not worry obv if I was back up to the > hospital.. It's very hard when they are ill and > you are at work!! Hoping he will be ok by Monday > or its another day ill need to take but thankfully > touch wood I won't have to use my annual leave. > > We have a process at work where we can buy an > extra 4 days leave and I am definitely going to do > that for next year!! > > Hope you all recover soon > > X Try to look at the time off to care for your child as an investment, if it helps. I came across an article a while back which compared time spent with a parent vs other carer (grandparent, childminder, nanny etc). The conclusion was that when a parent directly cares for the sick child, it shortens the recovery time. xx

DiGio Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > > Also, calling "I am loving", "I am wanting" > idiomatic expression I believe is also incorrect, > no? Idioma is a Greek word meaning special > phrasing, and implies figurative meaning. As defined in English, idioms can also form a style of speech or expressions natural to a group of people, ie regional speech or dialect and/or also including jargon.

That's interesting. You've tried it? Does the liquid castile soap not stabilise the soda in solution? Curious that the recipe doesn't say how much soda:vinegar to use. You say yourself that you use castile soap, vinegar and soda for cleaning. How do you mix these products? (Or do you use them separately?) Why coconut derived soap? What advantage over regular castile soap (generally olive oil based)? I'm not so bothered with the dish soap, it's really a "natural" dishwasher detergent that I'm interested to find. Ideas welcome!

Baby Sensory in Brockley. Crystal Palace 1 o'clock club. Boppin Bunnies is fabulous, but not sure what location is closest to you. Check their website? Will the new pool complex in forest hill have a softplay? xx

shaunag Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I think it's a bit mean to jump on Medusa and the > Other Poster for their honesty that they would not > entrust their kids to a male carer. Obviously I can't speak for everyone, but... it seems to me that what upset people was not that some posters wouldn't consider a male childminder, but that the reasons they gave were unsubstantiated. Childcare is an emotive issue, and it's absolutely fine to go with your gut. There's nothing wrong with making an emotionally based decision. However, if one tries to pass off an emotionally based decision as a factually based decision then it's pretty common for people to feel besmirched by that. > The question is > whether there is a market for a male nanny,not > whether every person should consider it to be for > them or not. The OP not only asked it there is a market for it, s/he also asked in general what local people think. So on the strength of that, it seems reasonable that people will also answer with individual opinions. > I don't think my choice warrants comments re my faulty risk assessment. There's also a basic misundestanding of the terms hazard, risk, and risk assessment in this thread. Emotive-based risk assessment would be an entirely different thing to a fact-based assessment. There's nothing wrong with using either in an appropriate context, but one cannot be passed off as the other. It's not so much that posters have given faulty accounts of risk assessment as it is their reasons are simply non-sequitor. IE, one cannot say I made a factual decision based on my emotions. It's illogical. The decision could be valid, but not for the reasons stated. It's like putting stripes on a donkey and trying to pass it off as a zebra. It will raise eyebrows at the zoo, no?

Saying they're all in the wash might work once. However if you use that excuse time and again, then it just makes you look like you're not considerate enough to have their special clothes washed and presentable on the day. :( If they took the time to choose clothes, I can understand why they'd like to see at least one original item on their grandkids. Out of every 'batch' of gifts, always keep one original? Then make sure the kids are wearing it on the day! :) Also, preempt inquiries with a direct approach. Have your kids make beautiful thank you cards, and place a little note in each saying 'Thank you for the lovely X, we've had to swap if for a Y which Toddler adores.' Or something to that end. Keep it short and sweet. Don't offer a reason for the swap in your note. But if asked, I would be honest. Otherwise they'll never learn what it is that you want/need for the kids. On the flip side, it was really thoughtful of them to include gift receipts. So they can't expect that everything would be a perfect fit. xx

Lemon rosemary dishsoap: http://backtoorganic.com/lemon-rosemary-dish-soap-pure-baking-soda-distilled-vinegar-fresh-lemons/ Homemade dishwasher detergent (borax-free): http://myhealthygreenfamily.com/blog/wordpress/homemade-borax-free-dishwasher-detergent-with-secret-ingredient/ Lots of interesting things on these two sites, including food recipes. I'm quite keen to try the homemade dishwasher detergent. Anyone else tried something similar?

Hmm, just to be clear, the point of my post wasn't to further the "us" and "them" attitude. It was simply to demonstrate that the dynamic does indeed run both ways, irrespective of whether one thinks that the dynamic is unequal. Nevertheless, an inter-influence in both vocabulary and pronunciation occurs. Yes, particularly historically, American English has been influenced by many other languages. And British English hasn't? No, indeed they're both influenced by other languages. If we accept that one of the strengths of the English language is its ability to absorp other languages, than we'll also have to accept that one of the things it absorps is itself: dynamic interchange between dialects and pronunciations. Toe-MAY-toe, toe-MAH-toe. Forsooth. Anecdotally, I have noticed many Californians using the British "shed-dule", rather than American "sked-dule". Although, I'm not sure we can compare California to the rest of the States anyway. civilservant Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Interesting that most of the terms quoted in your > link are British slang rather than 'correct' > usage, Saffron. > Overall, I think that we are more influenced by > them than they are by us and the impact is much > more fundamental. I'm thinking of words like > 'billion' - which is now accepted to mean a > thousand million (originally US usage) rather than > a million million (old UK usage) > > American English is influenced by much more than > British usage, though - there is a lot of Italian, > Spanish and Yiddish influence. I was told that > their use of 'hopefully' is a literal translation > from German usage. But many of their their > strange spellings (losing the u in words such as > "colour", for example) come from early attempts to > rationalise English spelling, which succeeded in > the States but failed to catch on here. > > Anyway, here's another of my pet hates - > 'DISinterested' when one means 'UNinterested'. > That's wrong both in the US and the UK!

I don't disagree that as for as profiling is concerned, the male sex presents a higher hazzard for abuse. However, for risk assessment to be valid, you would have to run separate risk assessments for each individual regardless of sex. And let's not forget that there have been cases of nursery workers (both men and women) convicted of abuse, and in some cases covering the abuse for each other. Personally, I would typically look for a woman because that's comfortable for me. My personal experience has been that women are better at the kind of multitasking and forward planning that childcare requires than are men in general. Nevertheless, if someone recommended a man to me for childcare, and I saw that he excelled in these areas, then I would definitely consider him. I also have male friends who have been nursery workers and primary school school teachers, and I have known them to be amazing at their jobs.

Some of these are examples of American English vs British English. People sometimes comlain that American English is creeping into British English. However, a recent BBC article demonstrated that the current runs both ways. Indeed British English is infiltrating America. "Britishisms and the Britishisation of American English" http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-19670686

That wouldn't really work for our loft unfortunately. We'd have to turn off all the rest of the central rads in the house and leave on only the rad in the loft! The problem is that the loft is regularly used (though it's not Little Saff's room) and needs heat at times when the rest of the house is fine. We'd like to give the loft some extra heating to make it nicer, as we can't do much about the (lack of) insulation b/c it's a rental house. Last year we ran the central heating all the time, but it was really expensive. We can live with the downstairs being a little cooler to save money, but that means the loft is unbearable. We were thinking about getting a similar portable rad, until I reread this post!! Although, maybe it would be fine if we ran it sparingly?

Ah, westof, we crossed posts, but I see what you mean regarding correspondence where the names are published but contact details are not. That I can understand (they don't publish my personal contact at my work either!). What I'm confused by is correspondence to the governors through the school when the list isn't published. And also, would like to know why some people think the lists should remain unpublished. (Again, not saying right/wrong, just curious about the arrangement.)

rachel83/prickle/westof - Do those published lists of governors include just the staff governors, or the parent governors too? I read somewhere that it's often common policy for the school to accept correspondence or enquiries to the governors on their behalf. So basically the school acts as an intermediary between the person making the enquiry and the governors. I thought that was a very odd arrangement, but perhaps others can shed more light onto why that is the case.

Saila Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > we bought one of these for the same reason > > then we got the electricity bill which was 4 > figures... > > never again > > so we now use 2x 2.5tog sleeping bags, a blanket, > quilt and tights/pjs Wow! Considering getting one of these for our loft this winter, but maybe not if it would explode our electricity bill. How much was your radiator running? All night, or just a few hours?

Can you elaborate on why you think the lists should not be public? (I'm not saying what's right/wrong, just curious about opinions on the topic.)

What, no e-books in the party bag? ;-) the-e-dealer Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Im not that sort of e dealer lol

Interesting shopping thread in the Family Room a while back: http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?29,847362,847362#msg-847362 . I do most of our family shopping online and have it delivered. Husband does one-offs like the butchers or fish market (Deptford) sometimes. We also like the Brockley Market (Lewisham College carpark off Tressillian Rd), which tends to be decent value for meat. Veg are not always cheaper. Artisan bread is very expensive there.

A good year for port wine, so I'm told.