edborders

THEY ARE CUTTING TREES NOW IN CAMBERWELL OLD CEMETERY THE COUNCIL DO NOT HAVE PERMISSION FROM THE CHURCH TO CUT DOWN TREES AND ARE ACTING ILLEGALLY> GO TO AREA Z NOW. I WILL MEET YOU> AND TELL THEM TO STOP. WILL CALL THE POLICE. LEWIS SCHAFFER 07886504221

Some people on this forum bang on that Save Southwark Woods people are lying. What are we saying that is not true? That the council in in the process of the largest excavation and mounding project in the history of the UK? They already destroyed a pretty meadow and a hawthorn hedgerow on the Woodvale side. Can you name another project that involves covering graves with imported topsoil or excavating graves with JCBs in TWO cemeteries, then burying people in the graves of the dead? And the Council is cutting down acres and acres of woods and destroying the heritage and history of local people. That is what we say. Tell us what is a lie about that. Lewis Schaffer Meeting Tuesday at 7:30PM at the Herne. http://www.savewouthwarkwoods.org.uk

That man I spoke to in Camberwell Old Cemetery said Save Southwark Woods (or me) were lying. Is it a lie to say that the council will be cutting down two acres of woods then laying down three feet of dirt on top of 1000s of dead bodies in public graves then leasing off that land for private grave plots in the first part of their burial strategy? Cause that is what we have been saying. Lewis Schaffer Save Southwark Woods (and graves, too)

Vigil today 12-1. Camberwell Old Cemetery First Hill Road. Se22 0ru. Fight the mounding over and digging up entire cemetery by Southwark Http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk Lewis Schaffer Out of Breath

Devon? Oh you newcomers with your sense of entitlement. Otta Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > You're right, I don't get out much anymore, and I > haven't been up there for years. Sure it used to > be open but maybe I'm muddling memories. For all I > know I'm thinking of the reservoir near my nan's > place in Devon.

No kids are falling into Nunhead Reservoir. The reservoir is covered. You must not get out much or not be from around here. The leader of that campaign is not a part Save Southwark Woods If you want to help save the graves and woods of Camberwell Old and New Cemeteries please sign https://you.38degrees.org.uk/petitions/save-southwark-woods Otta Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Thing is, if some teenagers go up there, get > pissed and someone drowns in the reservoir. Or > indeed a little kid runs off and falls in >

Is this only about language? Please tell me the polite way of talking about this horror. People thought I was rude when I was in New York, too! The Council is spending millions to cut down acres of woods, scrape clean the ground to make it look like fresh, virgin field, this, the final resting place of tens of thousands of local people. Could I say that better? Then the Council will lease off the new "field" for rows up on rows of graves sold to people who may think they are going to be there forever and probably haven't been told they are above the bodies of the dead. Is that okay to say? And then when the wood is cut down and all the public graves (ie mostly poor people who didn't get their own plot), they will go after the private graves (ie richer people back then) and dig them up too and put their remains them lower down in the earth and put another body on top of them. What about that? Is that decorous enough? video at http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk Tell me a nice way of putting it. Lewis Schaffer Save Southwark Woods 07886504221 That is my phone number, Call me.

Thanks for reading all that and for acknowledging that Southwark will be cutting trees, excavating graves, mounding over poor people's graves, burying people over the top of other families' bodies, and the fact that families may or may not be told there will be bodies under their loved loses. Southwark has a large immigrant population - of which, I am one. Many chose burial and have the right to be told if the burial plot which they have leased, is on virgin ground or on top of other people's bodies. Lewis Schaffer Immigrant

What have I got wrong: The plan is to cut down the woods in the 12 acres and mound over the public graves. {that is, poor people) Then the Council will sell the plots to unsuspecting families who won't have been told they are burying their loved ones over other families' dead. And probably won't understand that they don't have the grave in perpetuity - only 50 years (or 100 years for only another ?1350 Then when they have used up all the poor's land the Council goes after the private graves, which surround the poor people's plots. 12 acres of woods for 5 years of burial. A wood and heritage and other people's family memories for five years of burial. The Council will give the family of the private grave six months notice - posted on the cemetery gates - If the family actually receives the notice, the council will offer them terms to keep them buried. "Pay up or you kin get dug up. ?1350 for 50 years please." [actually, not sure how the Council will do this.] and then the council digs the person out of the ground, then digs the hole deeper, then gently and respectfully dumps the remains back in the hole, [sorry, "transfers"] and places a new body on top. Sold off - sorry, leased off - to some unsuspecting family - - probably an immigrant family, which Southwark Labour says it cares so deeply about - an immigrant family unfamiliar with 50 year leases and being buried on top of other families' dead. What am I not getting here? Southwark Council is reusing Cemetery Land and selling it off a new. This is what our local Labour councillors have agreed is the right thing. Only Labour supports this. That include the Job-share on Double Wages couple Councillors Victor Mills and her husband Gavin Edwards. They totally support this and don't see how this bad is for local people. Southwark Council is hurting local people. Lewis Schaffer Sickened at what is happening and so should you be

First the council mounds over graves of poor local people, then they bury bodies on top of these other bodies. When they are done with the poor people's graves they will dig up the private graves. We have found that 2022 isn't as far away as it seems. Will the council be telling families their loved ones are being laid to rest above the remains of other people? Are people being sold a used pair of shoes as new? Lewis Schaffer see the video http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk

We have been told that 48,000 of working people's graves on the Area Z site alone. 220,000 to 300,000 in entire Old Cemetery. The Council is digging up or mounding over the poor because they don't need permission from families to go ahead. The poor don't have headstones (or smaller Headstones, many just thrown aside.) It looks like a meadow but there are no vacant land. Where there is no headstone there are poor people buried. After they are done with Area Z, they will do the the other areas where poor people are buried. That is, in the neigbhouring lanes J,K, L, and H and others. If your ancestors had a private grave and you want to keep your relative in the ground, the council will ask you to pay. That sounds like extortion. Lewis Schaffer Nunhead, annoying New Yorker How many of the dead were buried in flu epidemic of 1918?

Thank you Sue. I am sorry if I have come across as something of a hothead or some outsider who is telling local people how their area should be or someone who wants to take away their cemetery The Council wants to change the cemeteries, They are digging up or mounding over the graves of tens of thousands of poor people in the northern side of the Old Cemetery - they don't need permission to do that because they are public graves) See the mounding over of graves on the Woodvale side? That is their plan, and when they are done mounding they are going be digging up graves and disposing the headstones. It will be a car park of burials with the nature and the beauty gone. They are saying "It is not 12 acres". Well, not today - but it will be that in a few short years. Sorry, sorry, sorry. Please tell the Council to leave the dead alone. Leave the headstones alone. Leave the trees alone. Videos here: http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk Lewis Schaffer Outside who likes headstones and graves and woods in cemeteries. If it weren't why aren't Victoria Mills or Peter John or Gavin Edwards or Darren Merrill or someone coming onto this forum? Or Harriet Harman or Helen Hayes...

You find a whole cooked chicken in Peter John's fridge. He promises that he is going to eat just one leg (it's not the nice leg, either) and says he has no plans at this time to eat the rest. Sorry, but Peter John is gonna eat the whole chicken. Lewis Schaffer Nunhead

I have posted that the Council will be cutting down 12 acres of woods, including trees on One Tree Hill mounding over or digging up 1000s of graves removing the headstones and monuments of 1000s of graves burying the newly dead on top of the remains of other dead digging up the newly buried in 75 years as part of their burial strategy to keep the cemeteries open. I have also posted that the Council are saying that all of this is for the benefit of local residents. If you think the Council's plans are the right thing to do then what I have posted shouldn't get you upset. News video of grave reuse plans: https://youtu.be/0eklxkk30bQ Lewis Schaffer Save Southwark Woods. Write to the Church Richard Hastings, Clerk to the Registry: [email protected] Philip Petchey, Chancellor to the Diocese: [email protected] Paul Morris, Diocesan Registrar [email protected]

Please feel free to send my correspondence to anyone and everyone. Everything I write I write so that people will see it. Southwark Labour sells local burial for local people. But it means digging up other local people and reburying their bones and teeth etc under the newly buried local person. And that local person will be dug up in 75 years. (not mentioning the trees.) If you are okay with that you should tell the Church that. Richard Hastings, Clerk to the Registry: [email protected] Philip Petchey, Chancellor to the Diocese: [email protected] Paul Morris, Diocesan Registrar [email protected] Lewis Schaffer Please google me or visit my website http://www.lewisschaffer.co.uk Who are you?

We were in the office of the Chanecellor Mr Phillip Petchy who leads the Church Court overseeing the consent procedure concerning Southwark's plans. After he informed us that Southwark Council does not have Church (and therefore, legal) permission to cut down trees and build roads in the Consecrated Areas of Area Z (which is most of it) we asked him what we could "right now" to stop the Council. He told us we should file for an "injunction" to the Church court, which is what we did, right then and there. They have chosen not to move forward on this, but an injunction was given to the Church, none-the-less. It is not our fault we probably were given dodgy legal advice. Lewis Schaffer American, believer in separation of Church and State Loz Wrote: -------------------------------------------------------

It took me a year to understand the duplicity of Southwark Labour/Peter John-run Council. They are digging up or mounding over the graves of the local dead and are telling local people it is good for local people. People who want to be buried locally with their families will find that their ancestors have been covered over or excavated, and the memorial moved away. Even the people who have no family there being sold a plot of land in a flooded cemetery for only 75 years. The only people this is good for are the Funeral Directors, the contractors, and Peter John. I am sure the other councillors would wish this would all go away. ADDED: Calling Victoria Mills, Gavin Edwards, Renata Hamvas, Harriet Harman, Helen Hayes. Southwark Labour's plans (and only they support it) are not good for local people. If they were, they would be telling everyone. Lewis Schaffer Save the graves and the trees. dbboy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > edborders try looking up the meaning of decorum, > respectability, correctness, etiquette or > restraint.

Don't get mad at me. The council is going to be digging up or mounding 1000s of graves in Camberwell Old Cemetery. And cutting down the trees to get to those graves. Inevitably children's graves will be dug up or mounded over. I am not doing the digging or even the proposing. I am just the messenger. Southwark Labour, Southwark Council, Victoria Mills, Gavin Edwards, Fiona Colley et al will be digging up and mounding over the graves of local people to lease off. And not to forget the main guy, Peter John. Sorry for mentioning this. Lewis Schaffer Nunhead, coughing, want to be back in bed, going back to bed

Please write the Diocese of Southwark expressing your support for the works to be undertaken by Southwark Council. Dear Mr. Petchy, I approve of Southwark's plans for Camberwell Old and New Cemeteries. Their plan to dig up or cover over with dirt the buried dead of East Dulwich is fine by me. I recognize that they were buried in perpetuity and might even be some of my relatives, or my neighbours's relatives. It is a tough call but the living today have the right to buried forever near our homes with our families. We have that right even if it means digging up those family members we want to be buried next to and eventually having us dug up, too. I, in no way, mind being buried above the dead (in area prone to flooding, made worse by cutting down the trees). We aren't superstitious and will rest just as easily in a grave above the newly reburied remains (ie bones, teeth) of the former occupants, having replaced their headstones with ours. I cannot imagine a time I will go looking for the remains of my relatives, or others will want to come looking for me. Finally, I prefer to be dug up in a few years. We need to make space for someone else to be buried. After all, the Funeral Directors need to work, too. (And what of the horses who pull the caskets?) I know I will have spent a lot of money for the plot and headstone but if that is the price for local burial for local people, I am willing to pay it. (Insert something about who you are, how you are just like them, and go to the Church all the time) Oh, I have never been to Nunhead Cemetery so I don't know what they are on about. These places are overgrown scrubland. Signed Local Resident Richard Hastings, Clerk to the Registry: [email protected] Philip Petchey, Chancellor to the Diocese: [email protected] Paul Morris, Diocesan Registrar [email protected] Prepared by Lewis Schaffer when i should be working.

We believe the council does not have legal permission to proceed with the first part of the largest excavation and mounding programme in British history. They want to drive roads over private graves whose rights have not been extinguished. They seem to not have permission to cut down trees over 75mm, which they are planning. They posted that they had permission to cut down trees that even they call "significant". The Diocese of Southwark has sent emails that have said otherwise, and asked the council for "legal justification" for their proposed actions. We asked the Church for an "injunction" to stop the works - their word. We wrote one out on the spot and gave it to them, which I think surprised them. Whether it has the intended result, we will see. My guess they didn't expect to get it and didn't want it! One of the reasons the council is planning on doing illegal work right now is that they didnt expect the church to get THAT many objections - over 800 people spoke out against cutting down trees and mounding over and digging up graves. - That caused additional delay. The church has had to schedule a hearing. I got the feeling they didn't want that. If anyone has the link to the London Live news report today (starring me!) would you please send me the link? Appreciated. Video of me and my East Duwlich educated son in Camberwell Old Cemetery last summer. See what I look like. See that i am a real person. Who are you? Lewis Schaffer Nunheader, Brooklyn Born, Newcomer

Save Southwark Woods met with the Diocese of Southwark today. Sitting in with us was Daniel Raven-Ellison from London National Park City We were told that the Council has not been given consent to cut down any tree with a circumference over 75mm and 75cm tall. And that due to having received over 500 paper objections and over 300 emailed objections, a hearing will be held regarding Southwark's plans. Up until that time Southwark doesn't have permission. That is what we were told. The Council plan to cut down over 12 acres of woods and dig up or mound over 1000s of graves to provide burial space for London's dead. These are the largest mass excavation plans in UK history. Lewis Schaffer Southwark Resident, 40 pounds overweight, deeply in debt.

Sue Wrote: > How do you know they don't care about the birds? Southwark Council has made the decision to cut down twelve (12) acres of woods in inner London to put in 4800 graves. If they placed birds over burial provision in Southwark they wouldn't do that. And they wouldn't be doing at this time. This is the decision that Darren Merrill, Peter John, Victoria Mills, her husband Gavin Edwards and the rest of Southwark Labour has made. Lewis Schaffer Meeting tonight at the Herne Tavern at 730. All welcome who love birds over burial provision in Southwark.

LOL. Thank you, Sue. Added - Sorry, I thought you were kidding. They don't care about the birds. They care that they have a legal requirement to not cut down trees during the nesting season. They probably figure it is a better bet to mess with the Church. And the nesting season may have already arrived, due to the unusually warm winter. Sue Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > edborders Wrote: > > > > The Council decided to jump the gun as they > have > > cut down the trees before bird nesting season. > > > But surely it's a good thing that they are taking > this into consideration?

Sorry but Penguin68 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Church permission is only required > when bodies are to be disturbed - and then ONLY > for public burials. According to the The Diocese Registrar Richard Hastings "The Council must obtain consent from the Consistory Court of the Diocese in the form of a faculty before any works within the consecrated areas may take place" and "the Consistory Court has not granted permission for any works to take place, as due process with respect to those who have objected must first be undertaken." [Aerial video of the 12 acres of Nunhead Cemetery-style woods we are going to lose. https://youtu.be/b76wj7BO8yI ] The Council decided to jump the gun as they have to cut down the trees before bird nesting season. We meet with the Church tomorrow at 11PM. Lewis Schaffer Meeting tonight at the Herne.730PM

Save Southwark Woods meets Tonight Tuesdays 730PM at the Herne Tavern on Forest Hill Road. This week is obviously an emergency as the Council are acting now on plans to cut down trees, drive roads and mound over the dead. To see Southwark Council lying to us, rewatch the ITV video and see the Councillor in Charge of Burial Darren Merrill getting caught out by the reporter. https://youtu.be/0eklxkk30bQ This week we have been lied to by the Council. They said that it doesn't need permission from the Church of England to cut down the trees and mound over the graves in Camberwell Old Cemetery. They said they only needed permission to actually bury the bodies. Like they wouldn't need permission to tear down the building, only to put the new building up. Darren told a full council meeting (and residents surrounding the Cemetery) that the entire Old Cemetery project was to be less than one ( 1 ) acre in size. Their website today says three acres. 700 graves and still keep the beauty? Come on. http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk and read all about. Lewis Schaffer Nunhead, head cold with coughing and sneezing, and basically a non-drinker (I have tried)