edborders

Is it true that if I start a new thread called "Cemetery Issues" it will not be deleted or moved to the Lounge? Are you the person in charge of that. Penguin68 Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Can I suggest, edborders that you start a new > thread with the headline you have given your > recent informative post, and re-post the > information you initially posted in this thread. > That will get discussion, hopefully, about the > council's specific plans about a few grave sites, > and not other matters. Lewis Schaffer Save Southwark Woods, Nunhead Resident, Age 58

Would it be possible to rename this thread "Cemetery Issues". Something general and possibly a less topical and emotive heading. Issues concerning the cemeteries are very important to the area.

The Undertakers is who - they told the "stakeholders" group that there was no demand for burial with flat headstones and for using other people's headstones. Put nice words on it and it is still what it is. A violation of trust. A broken promise. Lewis Schaffer Nunheader, father of two English boys.

dhboy You have never suggested digging up graves? What do think "re-using" graves is? Grave reuse (or recycling) means taking the headstone away, digging up the dirt and clay and sifting through the dirt and clay to remove the bones and other bodily remnants (teeth, hair?), either placing the bones deeper in the ground or removing them to another (group) grave in a corner of the cemetery. And moving the gravestone somewhere else. As for turning the headstone around? this can be done, and has been done (rarely), but do you think the type of person who wants to be buried would want someone else's headstone. People who want a headstone want their own new headstone. You haven't thought "reuse" out. Very few people have thought this out. Reuse is a euphemism. It sound lovely. But "reuse" is digging up graves and dumping what is left of people somewhere else. There needs to be a discussion about burial policy and cemetery management but every time we try to post here we get abuse from people who don't know jack about it and don't even know they don't know jack. this is what you wrote. dbboy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I have never ever suggested digging up graves or > the removal of headstones, yet again you mis > represent my words. You can't find anywhere that I > have said that because I have not > > And to put the record straight, I have suggested > the possibility of reusing the graves that meet a > set criteria set by the cemetery authorities and > turning headstones and insribing teh rear that > once turned becomes the front.

Oh, I get it dhboy. you think they should have cut down the trees in Nunhead Cemetery and kept on burying. That is what you are proposing for Camberwell Old Cemetery. Cut down the trees, dig up the graves. You want the Cem to go back to its original use? well once it was covered by ice, once it was meadows, once it was forest, once it was fields, then it was a cemetery and then it was closed to new burial and became woods again... How disrespectful is it to dig up the graves? I am not tossing the headstones, the council is. You support the removal of headstones and digging up graves. Yuck. Notice of Extinguishing Exclusive Rights of Burial under the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1975 CAMBERWELL Grave No 11272 Family name ? Allison Grave No 28016 Family name ? Haynes Grave No 13363 Family name ? Bryant Grave No 28055 Family name ? Snell Grave No 14379 Family name ? White Grave No 28075 Family name ? Webb Grave No 15772 Family name ? Bradshaw Square 107 Grave No 14934 Family name ? Macdonald Grave No 28274 Family name ? Perry Grave No 10512 Family name ? Stone Grave No 28285 Family name ? Harris Grave No 10524 Family name ? Butler Grave No 28290 Family name ? Taylor Grave No 15786 Family name ? Roe Grave No 28804 Family name ? Poncett Grave No 16828 Family name ? Bird Grave No 29408 Family name ? Hall Grave No 16836 Family name ? Scott Grave No 29941 Family name ? Collins Grave No 16807 Family name ? Greig Grave No 30326 Family name ? Hossack Square 106 Square 108 Grave No 27893 Family name ? Baker Grave No 30293 Family name ? Minahan If you are the current owner of one of the above graves or believe know the whereabouts of these families, please contact the Cemeteries and Crematorium Office, Brenchley Gardens, SE23 3RD. Telephone No 020 7525 5600 Email [email protected] Lewis Schaffer 58 years old, persistent athletes feet, and with a nose for hypocrisy.

Reposting legal notice. Southwark Council will be extinguishing the rights of people buried in the Old Cemetery by March 15, 2016. Please check the names below. The council plans at some point to dig up or mound almost every grave over 75 years old, and remove the headstones in Camberwell Old and New Cemeteries. The Council does not have ask permission to dig up public or pauper's graves. If you have a loved one on the list below, call or email Avril Kirby at the Cemetery to see what rights you have. Telephone No 020 7525 5600 Email [email protected] LEGAL ? CAMBERWELL OLD CEMETERY NEWS DESK (07 October, 2015) Notice of Extinguishing Exclusive Rights of Burial under the Greater London Council (General Powers) Act 1975 CAMBERWELL OLD CEMETERY Under the GLC (General Powers) Act 1975 the London Borough of Southwark has been granted powers to extinguish the rights of burial in any grave which contains sufficient space for not less than one further interment, where such a right has not been exercised for 75 years from the date of the latest interment in the grave or, if there have been no interments from the date of the grant of the right of interment. In order to comply with the Act the London Borough of Southwark hereby gives notice that it intends to extinguish the interment rights in respect of the following graves and to remove any tombstones which are present on those graves in accordance with s. 21 of the Act: Square 89 Square 106 Grave No 11272 Family name ? Allison Grave No 28016 Family name ? Haynes Grave No 13363 Family name ? Bryant Grave No 28055 Family name ? Snell Grave No 14379 Family name ? White Grave No 28075 Family name ? Webb Grave No 15772 Family name ? Bradshaw Square 107 Grave No 14934 Family name ? Macdonald Grave No 28274 Family name ? Perry Grave No 10512 Family name ? Stone Grave No 28285 Family name ? Harris Grave No 10524 Family name ? Butler Grave No 28290 Family name ? Taylor Grave No 15786 Family name ? Roe Grave No 28804 Family name ? Poncett Grave No 16828 Family name ? Bird Grave No 29408 Family name ? Hall Grave No 16836 Family name ? Scott Grave No 29941 Family name ? Collins Grave No 16807 Family name ? Greig Grave No 30326 Family name ? Hossack Square 106 Square 108 Grave No 27893 Family name ? Baker Grave No 30293 Family name ? Minahan The Council has also served notice upon registered owners of the rights of interment and on the registered owners of any tombstone affected at their registered addresses for these graves The Council does not intend to extinguish the rights on these graves or remove the tombstones until 15 March 2016. After this date all existing rights will be deemed to be extinguished unless we have been notified of an objection to the extinguishment of the right or to the removal of the tombstone in writing by the registered owner of the grave or a next of kin with a legal claim to the exclusive right of burial in the grave. Any tombstone(s) removed will remain the property of the owner and available for a further 3 months after 15 March 2016 Compensation is payable in accordance with subsection 21 (7) to any legitimate owner in respect of, and proportionate to the loss of rights of the plots affected provided that a claim is made within 6 months from 15 March 2016 If you are the current owner of one of the above graves or believe know the whereabouts of these families, please contact the Cemeteries and Crematorium Office, Brenchley Gardens, SE23 3RD. Telephone No 020 7525 5600 Email [email protected]

Is there anyone else who agrees that Southwark would be a better place if Nunhead Cemetery were cleared for new graves? Please, speak up. Join Sue and dhboy (whoever these people are). Practically every inch of Camberwell Old and New Cemeteries is filled with graves. The only way the council can make room for new burial is by 1) cutting down trees and digging up graves and tossing the monuments, or 2) cutting down trees and mounding over graves and tossing the monuments or 3) digging up graves where there are no trees and tossing the monuments or 4) cutting down trees, digging up graves or mounding over graves where there are no monuments because the people were buried without monuments because they were too poor to have their own plot and monument. It is all "re-use". Or re-cycling. Lewis Schaffer Nunhead Heights resident, tree-hugging shrub lover Yes, the Benefit is on Valentine's Day, Feb 14, 2016 and the money will be used to help reforest and preserve graves in Camberwell Old and New Cemeteries. http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk

Sorry, posted this twice.

dbboy Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I have no problem with graves being re-used. > Perhaps if this practice was used in Nunhead > cemetery none of the problems of limited grave > space would exist in Southwark. Are you seriously suggesting that our area would be better off if Nunhead Cemetery had been continuously dug up to provide burial space? That would mean no woods and no beautiful monuments. Who else is for that? No Nunhead Cemetery woods. Come on, speak up! Yes, we are "tree hugging scrub land lovers" and proud of it. Lewis Schaffer Save Southwark Wood Tree Hugging Scrub Land Lover Nunhead Resident, Two kids at Harris Boys School, East Dulwich. Come to the Benefit to Save Southwark Woods February 14, 2016 at the Ivy House

Why this is important: People who have a family member buried in the Cemeteries may want to know that the council is going to be digging up their loved one's grave - a plot they bought for eternity. If Vodafone sold you a plan with "unlimited internet forever" and much later told you they would be stopping that, you would scream bloody murder. That is what the Council is doing here with the graves of your loved ones. And everyone who wants to get buried there may want to know that they won't be resting in peace forever. Their body will be dug up in 75 years and the plot sold off to someone else. And everyone who thinks of a cemetery as having old, lovely headstones may be surprised to find that in a few years there won't be any old headstones left, just regimented rows of new graves. These new graves waiting to be dug up in 75 years. Lewis Schaffer Local Resident

3/4th of Southwark's dead are cremated. A large percentage of the rest are buried in Muslim Cemeteries outside the borough. Only an extreme minority want to be buried in the borough.

Dear John K. The Hawthorne Hedge was on Woodvale in Camberwell Old Cemetery. And Mr. Kennedy, I would appreciate an apology for your saying I have no right to participate in local affairs because i am a recent arrival. I pay taxes, both council, income, and VAT. I found that comment typical of your style of discussion on this forum> it is totally unacceptable. If no apology is forthcoming, I will consider other actions.

There are still plans, applications and strategies to develop the Cemeteries. These include the cutting down of trees, digging up the graves so that the plots can be sold, covering over large areas with 1.8 metres of soil to create addition grave sites, roads being rammed up One Tree Hill - with the potential for flooding,water pollution, increased traffic, religious discrimination,and major financial waste. Might it be good to make one general cemeteries thread for all of these issues? Lewis Schaffer American, Nunheader, father to English children, and save Southwark Woods supporter. See me in Bloomsbury at the Museum of Comedy this Decmeber.

This has nothing to do with "privacy". This has to do with people thinking they can write what they want because their real names and addresses aren't visible. To mention my place of birth is probably abusive (and illegal?) and you would never have said that to my face, and would never have written it if I were from any other country, or if your real names and addresses were made visible. I think I know John Kennedy. I used to kill time with my baby son at Cherner Books (and bought a few books, too.) I don't remember anyone there who was horrible. They were lovely! Maybe it takes someone from another place to notice the beauty in YOUR backyard.

John Kennedy of Cherner Books in East Dulwich. I spent many a happy hour in there with my baby son. A very pleasant place! The council cut down a row of hawthorns in excess of 200 years old on the Woodvale side of Camberwell Old Cemetery and topped over a meadow for a couple of hundred regimented grave spaces The council is going to give millions away to provide burial for the few dead why cutting services to the living. ?5 million pounds is a very low ball estimate. Do they have the money?

My name is Lewis Schaffer I am a Nunhead resident. I am an American Citizen. You can google me. Who, may I ask are you all? What do you gain by seeing these trees cut down? What do you gain by being so derisive to the people who want these places to be wild? Why can't you tell us who you are? A coward hides behind anonymity. Anyway... Destroying woods on One Tree Hill. Tomorrow November 25, is the deadline for asking the Church of England, Diocese of Southwark, to no approve Southwark Council plans to cut down woods on One Tree Hill in Camberwell Old Cemetery. Paper letters only. Mail them by last post today. go to [www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk]

Destroying woods on One Tree Hill. Tomorrow November 25, is the deadline for asking the Church of England, Diocese of Southwark, to no approve Southwark Council plans to cut down woods on One Tree Hill in Camberwell Old Cemetery. Paper letters only. Mail them by last post today. go to http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk/object-now Lewis Schaffer Nunhead Resident. American. Two children in area. Lived here since 2000. I am a real person. If you respond to this post please tell everyone who you are. That will make sure we are nice to each other.

I think there was an error in making the thread names too specific. There should have been a more general name making it a specific thread instead of something general, like Southwark Burial Policy, or Turning the Cemeteries in Nature Reserves. Is there a way to change this?

Is there a way to change the name of this thread? We are no longer dealing with Southwark's planning applications for the cutting down of woods on One Tree Hill or in Camberwell Old Cemetery. We are now asking the Diocese of Southwark to not give approval to Southwark's plans on One Tree Hill to cut down dozens of trees. And after the 25th of November 2015 there will be other issues. This matter isn't going away. Could we change it to "Creation of Nature Reserves in Southwark's Cemeteries" Or even: What to do with Southwark's Cemeteries. Lewis Schaffer Host of Nunhead AMerican Radio on Resonance FM., 6:30PM Mondays

Burial in Southwark is waste of money when it is going to cost twice the amount (or more) to provide a gravespace in Southwark than providing a gravespace on land outside the borough. That that land outside won't have trees or your great-grannies grave on it. The Cemetery Plans, as far as I can tell, is mainly a vote-getting scheme by Southwark Labour and a giveaway to Conway and the local morticians. Is your tax money is being wasted? Yes.

I have learned my lesson and put my post in an ongoing thread. Sorry for making a new thread! Trees to be cut down on One Tree Hill - Act now if you prefer trees to graves. Southwark Council plan to cut down almost two dozen trees (and probably more) including oak trees Exclaimation and drive a road up the side of One Tree Hill in Camberwell New Cemetery - right next to the One Tree Hill Nature Reserve. Why? For 140 graves - less than 9 months of grave space. And when that is filled there will be a scar on the side of the hill the need to destroy more of the wild places - or potentially wild places - in the cemeteries. The Diocese of Southwark, the Church of England can stop these plans as this is consecrated ground. The Church is consulting with the public. Save Southwark Woods is asking you to write the Church immediately. Deadline is Wednesday 25 November for receipt of objection to the council's plans. Please write on paper and mail or deliver (no emails) Mr. Paul Morris, Diocesan Registrar, The Diocese of Southwark, Minerva House, 5 Montague Close, London SE1 9BB and tell him that One Tree Hill is sacred ground and shouldn't be marred or scarred. There are places for burial elsewhere. Watch this news report on ITV [youtu.be] We didn't tell them they were "veteran" trees and besides a few other minor points, it is all true. Please go to [www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk] Save Southwark Woods Object page for more information. And please act now to stop the scarring of One Tree Hill. Lewis Schaffer Local Person, Nunhead Resident, Tree Lover.

Just to clarity, they are cutting down an area and not just random trees. What 'documentation' are you asking for? There are probably dozens of pages.

Southwark Council plan to cut down almost two dozen trees (and probably more) including oak trees (!) and drive a road up the side of One Tree Hill in Camberwell New Cemetery - right next to the One Tree Hill Nature Reserve. Why? For 140 graves - less than 9 months of grave space. And when that is filled there will be a scar on the side of the hill the need to destroy more of the wild places - or potentially wild places - in the cemeteries. The Diocese of Southwark, the Church of England can stop these plans as this is consecrated ground. The Church is consulting with the public. Save Southwark Woods is asking you to write the Church immediately. Deadline is Wednesday 25 November for receipt of objection to the council's plans. Please write on paper and mail or deliver (no emails) Mr. Paul Morris, Diocesan Registrar, The Diocese of Southwark, Minerva House, 5 Montague Close, London SE1 9BB and tell him that One Tree Hill is sacred ground and shouldn't be marred or scarred. There are places for burial elsewhere. Watch this news report on ITV We didn't tell them they were "veteran" trees and besides a few other minor points, it is all true. Please go to http://www.savesouthwarkwoods.org.uk/object-now/4590876971 Save Southwark Woods Object page for more information. And please act now to stop the scarring of One Tree Hill. Lewis Schaffer Local Person, Nunhead Resident, Tree Lover.

Has anyone spoken about the lack of a consultation regarding plans to cut down the 10 acres of wood in Camberwell Old Cemetery (woodvale) and other woods in Camberwell New Cemetery (Brenchley Gardens). The council says they consulted in 2011 but I have heard there was only one reference to "trees" in their papers. There will be a meeting Wednesday at 7:30 PM at The Rose Pub, 108 Forest Hill Road, SE22 0RS where we would appreciate someone expertise as we try to save the trees and the heritage. Lewis Schaffer Tree and heritage lover.

Hi, there will be a meeting today, Wednesday at 7:30 PM at The Rose Pub, 108 Forest Hill Road, SE22 0RS to save the woods in Woodvale and Brenchly Gardens cemeteries. They council is planning on cutting down ten acres of woods. aerial view. listen to local birdsong. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b76wj7BO8yI Lewis Schaffer Nunhead tree and heritage lover