El Pibe

A touch of the commentator's curse for UDT gards Hart there. Still, what a game so far!

Did enough is the best you can say. Xavi and Iniesta looked out of sorts and so did Spain. Still France only really had one truly decent spell, and didn't play with enough urgency. Still it speaks volumes about Spain's quality that that was a performance well below par. I think they had something like 400 passes in the first half with over 80% completion. Not that bad! Edited for doh!

Apparently so, though give me atl?tico over Franco's favourites any day of the week.

He does do a good one liner. I'll be honest and say I think he's good at what he does and at his best when he's pushing at the boundaries of acceptability. Not the point though loz ;-)

Though his drinking probably contributed a fair bit to the public purse through duties alone. In the good times maybe noone would have given a shiot about all this. During a recession and austerity people are pretty sensitive to things like tax and waste. Much less ambitious tax avoidance finished red ken's political career once and for all, that's how the public react and Carr know's it. As it stands from now on he's going to have a tough time putting doewn hecklers who bering it up and get ovations!

Mind you, all this talk of morality. Breivik has just finished his self-serving soliloquy where he apparently decried the effect of Sex & The City on the nation's morals. Whereas gunning down 70 people of course.... Jimmy Carr may be many things, primarily annoying, but at least he can appreciate the irony of the situation. Breivik I think no. Not to subvert the thread, but it's interesting that psychosis is proof of insanity but psycopathy apparently correlates to sanity. Anyway, as you were.

Right on brother, they shall not pass! ;) "highlights the prolateriat's naivity" I find it an odd populist move to draw attention to the prolateriat(sic) voters just how naive they are.

WHich is fair enough, but to suggest that Carr can be justified in his tax avoidance because he's an entertainer is taking that argument to it's absurd logical conclusion. Besides, you have to factor in the how much he annoys people into that equation, which probably means he should pay more tax than most!!

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/seventies.png

"...though I would suggest that taxation only plays one part in our collective responsibilities to society" Of course, absolutely with you on that. But the state asks little else of us in terms of duty in all fairness. Should we have the sort of war that would require us once again to do our bit I wonder how may people would say 'oh he did it legally' when Jimmy Carr's (or whoever is his equivalent come the day, which let's hope it doesn't) lawyers exploit loopholes in the law to keep him out of it.

"There is a moral difference between breaking and not breaking the law" How can paying 1% without knowing what you're doing be immoral, whilst paying 1% thanks the skills of those who understand how to exploit loopholes in the law is moral, especially given that you don't think tax has anything to do with moralityh in the first place. I don't think you can have it both ways. I never siad that the specific level of tax paid was a matter of morality, i said that exploiting gaps in the law to have a lower tax burden than that expected of memebers of society is immmoral. It says to society I can afford to avoid the expectations of our collective responsibilies.

thumbs up smilies are doubtless frowned upon in the drawing room, so I'll jsut do them in my head bob

So you're saying there's no moral difference between tax evasion and tax avoidance? Fair enough I guess, I guess it depends on what sort of society you want to live in. I thought there was a moral basis to social democracy and the welfare state, but I could of course be very wrong. If there isn't then I have to defer to your opinion, if there is then tax is a moral issue, pure and simple.

I find it pretty repugnant to be honest. I pay roughly that amount of tax on a significantly smaller income and am happy to do so because that's the price you pay to be part of, maintain and enjoy the benefits of a fair, democratic, free nation where I can contribute to a healthy society and help those less fortunate than I. Those that partake of this scheme are basically saying that that sort of attitude is for the poor dumb schmucks, the rich can afford to laugh at the rest of us. In other words to have all the benefits without paying his way; cake and eat it. I bet you the scheme ain't cheap, what do you reckon, 1.5% commission? So he's actually saying he values the fortunes of the rich accountants more than that of his countrymen. Of course these loopholes and complexity come about for good reasons, to alleviate the burden on charities, on agriculture, to encourage investments and pensiopns etc, schemes designed to benefit society as a whole. These loopholes are taken advantage of and the the proceeds funnelled offshore. If you close down many of the loopholes it will be society that suffers. On every level then it is a cold blooded calculation to maximise personal gain at the cost of society. Call it what you will if it falls within the law, at best it's uncivic minded. If I could afford such a scheme I would not partake, no matter the legality, I would find it morally repugnant. I loved his comment that he made a judgement of error. Sure his judgement of error was that he could do this without being found out, for he knew exactly what he was doing.

Voiceovers, that's where the money's at. I gather that it's the new-comedy-is-the-new-rock-and-roll that is driving up London house prices and that of Scottish forests. When will this madness end, especially as they're all so dull, I mean Michael McIntyre is richer than the Queen!!!!

A) B) C) can be very annoying when doing a list!

You're talking to a Madrile?o UDT. What do you expect from Barcelona!?!? If we're going down that route we can tar every team under the sun, part of the reason why i just don't give a shit full stop about the 'beautiful' game in the way I once did. Portugal did do it last night on a number of occassions though.

That's why I want Portugal to lose. Always with the diving histrionics. Dirty!

I thought that was quite funny jah! We've the makings of a good first team with a couple more signings. Cracking midfield, and, well one good striker and one who's good on his day and a couple of good defenders. Just like west game to have a squad of midfielders and little else. Obviously desprately weak for goalies without green, well we've a green one and one due for retirement. But strength in depth, noooooooo, across the season we'll struggle.

Whoa...cross post of the century, didn't even think you ventured here!!

THing is he'll probably end up in CHigwell or somesuch to practice his golf swing. I think I'd rather be in Wigan the the dirty northern birds frankly. No offence RosieH!!

Yeah I read that too. HEre's the whole quote. Hard to argue with it though I can understand why Dave Whelan is miffed too.

Mohamed Diame (just signed on a free from Wigan for the hammers) reveals the real reason Kenny was sacked. On his discussions with Liverpool prior to the sacking he had this to say: "I met with the then manager and we talked about next season but God decided to finish this situation"

For the time being. I can't see England beating Italy to be fair, but I'd certainly love them to, I can't stand bloody Italy (the football team, for tis a fine place).

After Fridays blithering drunkenness I think a quiet one is in order. Has anyone been along to Hoopers, is there a good atmosphere for the England games?