I think flamers tend to be the obvious light the blue touch paper and stand back, where trolls are grumpy antisocial types/outcasts (even if self-defined so) in general. Both can be very entertaining if done right. Snorks is an excellent flamer in general for instance. Huguenot ticked most boxes of the troll definition but did it with a certain charm, panache and wouldn't take himself too seriously. I think the latter point is pretty important in differntiating between the good ones and the idiots. anyway, found a couple for you otta http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?20,959317 http://www.eastdulwichforum.co.uk/forum/read.php?20,944243,944243#msg-944243