Sophron

Speedo Pizza - that epitome of yuppiedom! Must mean the socio-economic profile of the ?blow-ins? has changed again ? please, please can there be another debate about this, please!

Very good incisive post Miga/Captain Obvious, sounds very similar to my own (and I'm sure many others)circumstances Bravo!

In the interest of balance I would like to add that there are those of us who have been here for a long time (25 years+) with ties to the area going back generations and who are delighted with on going gentrification, much better than the opposite which is what happened to Rye Lane(which used to be called the Golden Mile due to the quality of shopping etc.) As some one stated on a different thread, it's not uncommon for people from around here to say that they cant wait to get out and they've been saying it for years. I certainly don't look back to the 70's and 80's and reminisce for the area as it was then.

Totally agree with XIX and EDlove.

PokerTime Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > And you couldn't afford to do that now > Sophron...that's the point. It's interesting that > you cite investment. That is part of the > problem....that housing has become an investment > over a home. And that long time span you mention > that comes accross as being deserving.....doesn't > time span also make those born and bread a little > deserving too? > > People of all economic backgrounds need to live in > London to work, and London needs people of all > economic levels to work as a city too. Southwark > is not Kensington or Chlesea (or Marylebone) and > never has been. ED is NOT central London. Yet when > something is decided to be done about the poor > design and social housing of Elephant and castle > for example, the solution becomes one of building > sizeable amounts of unaffordable private property > over affordable housing. It's profiteering at it's > worst, with no interest in community, dressed up > as urban regeneration, but regeneration for who? > certainly not the previous community, some of whom > had also lived there for decades! > > We need a range of homes in all areas, not a > ghettoisation of London from the centre outwards > for the above average earner only, with the > poorest being scattered on the fringes. > > There was an interesting documentary on TV this > week about Brent council having to move larger > families out of London because there is nowhere > they can live under the Housing Benefit Cap. This > has meant displacing families from Brent (hardly a > glamourous borough) to cities like Manchester and > Birmingham. We are not just talking about the > pushing out of the lowest earners from London, we > are actually seeing forced deportation of some of > the poorest families to cities they've never even > been too. Surely the time has come to say that the > private market is not going to correct itself > unless government intervenes. Hi Pokertime, I'm not sure what you mean by deserving, but to answer your question, no I dont think that simply because somebody was borne and bred in a certain place they automatically deserve some advantage. Also I dont believe that the answer is some mass building of municiple housing (this is what created the ghettoisation around Elephant and Castle and the North Peckham estate before both were fortunately knocked down). Additionally I dont think that mass building of coucil property in East dulwich would add anything to the area. I do think that there is opportunity for government to support lower income working familys to purchase property and I would support tax breaks etc to enable this to happen. I'm clearly not a socialist so we are unlickly to agree but I certainly didn't wish to appear "deserving".

Well for me Pokertime, coming good meant years of investment and putting my faith that East Dulwich had the potential to rise above the average property price. When I first bought local prices were 10% lower than the London average (akin to somewhere like Beckton today)and achieving some equity in my first property. I couldn't afford to buy on my own so I clubbed together with a freind to get a deposit together and bought a very modest, badly done Victorian conversion and within a year we were in negative equity, I bought them out and lived in it for nine years. So bought at the top (89) and waited it out till (98) to sell at a profit. I think its called a market correction and most likely it will happen again. For me I have invested my life here, married, had kids, done up property, bought and sold etc to build a life, and if I've contributed to gentrification then I'm pleased - it's a nicer place to live than it was in 1989 and the surrounding areas are also looking better. It seems to me that as London changes and grows people who wish to buy, like I did, have to compromise initially but build over time - I still cant live in Marylebone but I'm happy here now!

This is true, I've lived here since 1989 and many times neighbours, freinds in the pub etc. have said "I hate it here and cant wait to get out" and to this day people I know who were born here dream of leaving. I agree with ???? it not a right to own property in any area, I moved here years ago coz I couldn't afford to buy where I wanted to - and it's taken 25 years of mortgage and buying and selling in East Dulwich to get my house, I've stuck with East Dulwich having faith that it would "come good in the end".

Zebedee Tring Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Why is it racist to complain about local > businesses who cause a mess that they don't clean > up? Surely it would be racist (not to say very > patronising) to argue that businesses owned by a > particular part of the community should do as they > please and not be required to clean up, because > that would be expecting a lower standard from > them. Surely all businesses that cause a mess > should be held to the same standards, regardless > of race, colour, creed, gender, sexual orientation > etc etc. Agree with this, there has been no racism in this thread, this is about rubbish and waste being left in public places which would be unacceptable in any community.