Blah Blah

It isn't just Macron who has reacted to the new variant in the UK, but more than half a dozen other countries too, with travelers from the UK also banned for now. Macron can not be accused of playing games here (Brexit level) given the effort to find a workable and safe way to get the lorries moving again asap. All of these countries have their own ongoing challenges with the pandemic and are acting in the best interests of their own public health structures. I think we have to be careful to not conflate the real challenges of the pandemic, with the real challenges of Brexit. Brexit is its own beast with everything negotiable. There is no negotiating with a virus.

Trinnydad Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Is Blah Blah masquerading as Sephiroth? The style is very similar and BB has been accused of multiple IDs before. Yawn. Trinnydad still trolling I see.

Quite Sephiroth. Trinnydad is now trolling of course - doubling down. Any interest in debate on the actual points left that one some time ago. Detail has been the one thing guaranteed to bring the froth out in brexiters and expose the folly of the cult they all subscribe to. They just do not care about the costs, really they don't.

The new variant (not correct to call it a new strain) appears to be more infectious and is driving up infections in the SE quickly. Hospitals across the UK are at 90 per cent capacity as it is, so the question is one of a potential surge as people travel from the SE travel all over the country spreading this more infectious strain, leading to a January crisis for the NHS. That is what government is having to consider. Personally, I think that surge is inevitable, and will not be surprised to see a hard lockdown in Jan/Feb. It is worth remembering that the first lockdown was to drive down spread and infection rates from a high R number, to below 1. The policy since has been about managing the R number and trying to keep it below 1. But that has resulted in the R number staying at 1 or thereabouts, over bringing it down further. As a result, the present surge has not gone down significantly enough from the extra November restrictions (I won't call it a lockdown because it wasn't in reality), 400+ people are still dying every day on average, and any surge is going to come on top of that. The peak of Flu intake is also about to hit, although that might actually be lower this year because of social distancing. The data shows that infection rates in schools among teenagers especially, are the issue at the moment. Hence the scrambling to get rapid testing facilities set up over the Christmas break. So the best advice for Christmas would be to keep teenagers away from vulnerable and elderly relatives, and to restrict travel from the SE to other parts of the country. I suspect it will emerge as advice, over any actual restrictions.

Trinnydad Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I'm with you Cat all the way. It is time Blah Blah established his credentials. I would guess he doesnt actually work but is "lap top researcher" who revels in the mocking put downs on those he disagrees with. Second thoughts... probably just another a lib-dem dreamer. > > He/she has much in common with the arch remainer MPs (such as Anna Soubry, Sam Gyimah, Dominic Grieve etc) who destroyed the last parliament with eloquent and impassioned nonsense. They later found to their cost that the following election endorsed the Brexit camp with a resounding majority. They are all now yesterday's people. > > Hang on in there Cat, don't cop out and let BB claim another victim. And yet more illustration of my point. No interest in engaging with the real world impacts but resorting to infantile sneering instead. Those MPs were fighting because they could see what what was coming, what IS coming. The following election was as much a rejection of Corbyn as anything else. And when the sh+t hits the fan, as it will with no deal, Boris will be toast. We will be scrambling for a deal, ANY deal by the summer. The EU knows it, which is why it sees no need to cave into every demand of the UK. And the money wasted on this folly so far? More than the total of our membership payments to the EU over our entire 40 year membership. Have a think about that while you are at it.

TheCat Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Its the total dismissal (and general mocking from > some) of the nuance of these sort of real world > differences (by most remain commentators on this > thread when I mentioned it 2 weeks ago), which > provides the perfect example of why I can't be > bothered providing further details....becuase the > truth is that many remainers on here really don't > want to consider any opposing arguments on their > merits.... Another predictable whine instead of admitting that tangible benefits are pretty hard to define right now. It is not mockery to ask about the subsidies farmers are going to lose, or the EU regional funding that places like Cornwall will lose, or the inflation that will hit low incomes families hardest on goods and food, or the 3 million jobs that depend on our current EU exports. Hundreds of existing trade agreements lost and how long do you suppose it will take to renegotiate those in the real world eh? You quite frankly don't care about any of that because you have never cared. THAT is why you won't engage in the details, because you have no counter argument to any of it. It reminds of an interview where Farage was asked about the potential loss of the 3000 Airbus jobs in Wales, the only major employer in that town, and he answered simply with 'Airbus is an EU political project'. Didn't give a toss about those jobs. That is the the kind of disgraceful BS that sits behind no deal Brexit and those who push it hardest.

Trinnydad Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Who are you trying to kid! Hungary has bought the > Russian vaccine to placate its population as > Brussels would not approve despatch of vaccines > under their coordinated approval and distribution > regulations. They got it cheap from Putin as he > wants to sow dissent amongst EU members. > If you dont believe me read this:- > https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-countries-may-g > o-their-own-way-on-coronavirus-vaccinations/ > > It's not just us that's frustrated with Brussels. Keep telling yourself that if you must.

TheCat Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I don't know about that. Watching you twist > yourself into knots, while making this same > ridiculous, myopic claim over and over again is > tangibly changing my life I can assure you. And there you prove my point perfectly. Never interested in any real world detail. The typical Brexit voter deflection we have had to put up with for the last four years. Like I say, you will have nowhere to hide in a no deal Britain.

Trinnydad Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Glad to be shot of the lethargic heaving > bureaucratic mess that is the EU having learned > from the media today that the very earliest the > will commence Covid vaccinations will be 27th > December and could well be pushed back into > January. As pointed out to you, the EU is not stopping any country from starting the vaccine if they want to. Hungary has bought the Russian one already for example. But also, you might want to consider that it is going to be summer before the UK gets to vaccinating the over fifties even, and that is if we manage 1 million vaccinations a week. The total number of over 70's, vulnerable, and front line workers that have to be vaccinated first is 23 million. So that puts any complaint about differentials in vaccine programs into perspective. It is not when you start that really matters, but how quickly and wide you can roll out. The EU has decided on a ready to go bigger mass rollout as opposed to a drip feed ramp up. There is sense to that, especially if the vaccine has limited immunity before requiring boosters.

TheCat Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > I get overall most people on here disagree with > the whole thing, but surely not every comment > needs to discuss every aspect of the issue? > There's 30 pages of comments on this thread > swinging between specific minuatae and big picture > and back again.... But it is not just about disagreement, it is years of endless avoidance from people like you, who ignore and gloss over the real impacts that are going to affect real people's livelihoods and jobs and prospects. You won't do details. You won't say how long you think people should have to put up with the impacts. You won't even say if you work in a sector that will be affected or not. So spare us yet more vacuous deflection. The fact is that up to 3 million jobs are supported or dependent on our exports to the EU, and many of them in regions where lack of jobs are a real issue. Many more sectors are dependent on collaboration, funding, shared intelligence, data etc etc. All of that is going to take a hit, and there is no indication that this government is even going to replace farming subsidies in full or regional investment lost. They refuse to guarantee it. You can avoid the discussion now, but when it all becomes real from the New Year onwards, there will be no place to hide then.

diable rouge Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > It's certainly been interesting watching the > so-called libertarian > right/free-speechers/free-thinkers etc, squirm and > convolute their way around willingly removing this > freedom from their fellow citizens, making it more > difficult to travel, work, study, retire in the > EU. It's true that logistically it will still be > possible i.e. travel, but the real stumbling block > will be financial, namely having to take out > costly private health insurance to cover the loss > of reciprocal access to health services, > especially for those who want to work/live in the > EU. Freedom of movement helped democratize travel > and the opportunity to work/live etc. To borrow a > phrase, it was for the many not the few... UK students who want to study in the EU will now face three times the level of student fees they had to pay as an EU member, so no, the cost isn't just health insurance etc. There will be genuine barriers to a range of things because of sudden increase in cost. And still, not a single leave voter has given a single tangible benefit that will be brought to their life by leaving the EU. not one.

It does, but for calls longer than 40 mins, you have to pay for a subscription. Whatsapp calling is entirely free.

Quite Malumbu. Was about to say exactly the same thing. I would also point out that being able to engage in one's own language is a display of how non federal the EU really is.

Isolationism, protectionism and nationalism always emerge after severe economic crisis. This has been true for most of history. We are still in the trajectory of the 2008 financial crisis. And as always, you have a status quo struggling to hold onto their share of the profit (and increase it), while changing nothing for anyone else, hence the rise of populism. Populism loves vague notions and simplistic slogans around national pride and sovereign strength which is why historically a lot of wars have been started by populists.

Pugwash Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > Neither of us have Zoom but are in contact by > phone and emails. If you don't have zoom, but have a smartphone and internet use, use whatsapp instead for a video call. I agree on the three day thing personally but think the five days relaxation has been set to allow for traveling. You can't travel to most other areas under the tier system, so the days before Xmas Eve and after Boxing Day are needed.

Christmas for us is usually seven households mixing for a big xmas feast. We won't be doing that this year. Everyone is staying in their own household, apart from the two family members that live alone. They will join a household each, in their bubble. That is a small effort to make for one year. Boxes of presents have been sent to everyone and we'll have a zoom xmas present opening shindig as well as copious 'our xmas dinner is better than yours' photos going back and forth. It will be different, but it won't kill us, and we'll make up for it next year hopefully. That should be perfectly possible for every household to do, but we know they won't. Government knows that people will still meet up with friends, travel all over the place in the days around xmas to drop off gifts, and took I think the decision that encouraging sensible behaviour was going to be more effective than demanding it. Who wants to be the government sending Police to people's homes over the Christmas Break? My impression is that most people are indeed going to be sensible. In London at least, you can see evidence that people have shopped early, possibly endeavoring to isolate a little in the days leading up to that five day period.

The thing about advice Penguin, is that it is a general guide. There will always be a small number of individuals who, for very understandable reasons, will decide otherwise. For most people though, keeping older relatives safe from infection, will be a factor in making sure hospitals do not fill up with a third spike in January. Otherwise, it will be another lockdown, and that helps no-one.

Yes, common sense is called for by everyone. It is one year and ask yourself, unless you can be absolutely sure you and those you plan to spend xmas with are not infected, if one Christmas is worth someone's life. Anyone planning to be in close contact with a vulnerable person absolutely needs to ask themselves this. If people (individually or as a family) can isolate in the 10 days leading up to Xmas gatherings, that would also be common sense. Xmas could actually be an opportunity to slow the spread of infection, if everyone does the right thing.

People have migrated from all sorts of places to get jobs. Why do you think major cities lost half their population at various times? Industries rise and decline, Scotland is not unique in that respect. If Scotland decides on independence, she can rejoin the huge trading bloc on her doorstep, and there are many advantages in her doing that. I too have strong connections to Scotland and as for scuppering dreams, leave voters just took away the dreams of generations of people who might want to live, work or study in any one of 27 other nations, so giving up access to little England for access to 27 other nations seems like a good trade off to me. Let's see how her small farmers do without EU protections and subsidy shall we? Westminster never handed the subsidies over in full when we were in the EU anyway. That move for independence may come sooner than we all think.

You have no way of knowing how the EU will evolve going forward, and of course it will change. Everything does, even if it is slow to do so. I don't what is worse, people bleating on about Empire and 'making Britain great again' and those latching on to equally nonsensical Franco-German desires for an Empire. These are the ideas that lead to conflicts and war historically too.

Stop playing the fool Keano.

Keano, whether you vote for an MEP or not makes absolutely no difference to your life. And that you cite a debunked story about the shape of bananas really shows the sum of your understanding of anything the EU does. So try again. Something tangible that directly will make your life better now that we have left the EU.

"But this whole time, the government have continued to smile and say we will "prosper mightily" - which is obviously a lie of the most morally reprehensible magnitude" Yes Sephiroth, and it is this that angers me most. The lies, lies and more damn lies. They don't even hide it anymore.

Nice bit of deflection there TheCat, if a little rambling. Where do you think the wealth of all those millionaires pushing Brexit, and especially a no deal one, comes from TheCat? Any ideas? Go and do some research and you will see how heavily invested in, and connected they are to the City, and big corporations. So no, these comments are not comparable to ridiculous claims about immigrants. One is based in fact, the other is not. Even John Redwood made a speech in the commons a few weeks ago asking where the VAT and other tax cut announcements are, in the middle of a pandemic with soaring government borrowing no less. These hard Brexiters want the UK to become a tax haven. It is all they think about. And by the way, the EU knows that full well too, and that is shaping their hardball negotiations with us especially on things like state aid. It is not childish to ask those who voted leave to cite one thing they expect to be better for them personally. That they all avoid answering the question is why we ask it. I would argue that it was childish to vote for something when they can't cite a single tangible benefit to them from it. As for life being a little bit sh+ttier, it already is for a lot of families struggling to make ends meet. Many in bed and breakfast, too many needing to rely on food banks. Up to 3 million jobs depend on exports to the EU. Any contraction in the economy (and especially on top of this pandemic) is going to hit many of those who voted for Brexit hardest and I see no policy from this government that even begins to address any of those fundamental issues. And all you can do is make silly analogies about mud huts. Good grief!

Which is why I think the answer is partly in addressing design and standardising a few things to maximise safety. A bigger front wheel would be one. Standards on brakes and speed and acceleration could be another. Even handlebar and platform size. Wider handlebars alone make it harder to zip between traffic. Standardisation would also make it easier for police to determine between legal and illegal ones.