Huguenot

It seems to be a logical developmental step that the repetitive and uninspiring tasks of agriculture and manufacturing should be automated. I had the misfortune of working in a car indicator light factory for many months, and anyone who thinks that's better than unemployment is engaging in a ridiculously idealised view of society, compounded by a lack of imagination. The challenge is to create other lifetime objectives than those espoused by dysfunctional throwbacks who believe that being on a toilet production line in the 1950s is the only ambition to emulate. Terrifying as it may seem, the future of humanity and our current society is in the delivery of services - particularly in entertainment, media and the arts. So the rise of reality television is a stepping stone on that path, or a mis-step depending upon your perspective. It's defining everyday tasks like paper sales companies and entrepreneurial business in terms of their entertainment value rather than their productivity. We should probably stop taking ourselves so seriously, and crowbar our proletariat down from their bronzed pedestals. Marx has a lot to answer for. ;-) how was that, right-clicking?

If you're not an estate agent troll, the alternatives are much worse dulwichgirl2. The majority of the people in ED don't consider housing to be an exercise in speculation whereby embittered cynics today can strip income, optimism and meaning from the lives of future generations. You don't use phrases I would expect from someone who wanted to live in ED but was saddened and bereft. Terms like 'upbeat', 'getting the upswing' and 'prices going crazy' are used by people on the make. So what are you? The alternatives are much more cynical and noxious. I don't like you already.

That was a great piece by Charles Moore. I now understand where Len was coming from when he asked for locations of the emergency supply centres and demanded that they should not be used - these supplies woz wot allowed the nation to undermine the miners' extortion racket, and Len doesn't want to lose the truckie strike on the same basis. I find myself totally agreeing that senior government officials seem to have lost touch with the electorate, and that the line between perception and reality is almost meaningless when it comes to politics.

If it's free what would they stand to gain? I think it's a wee bit paranoid - but not beyond the bounds of possibility. More likely that the other people downloading the software exceeded Plusnet's retail bandwidth limitations, and their offer brought the system to its knees by accident! Odds of that being the case are significantly higher.

:) Very good.

There isn't a set of rules that dictate whether striking is reasonable or not d_c, it's a judgement call. Strikes that deliberately target the nation and are likely to result in panic buying and accidents like the one that resulted in a middle ageed woman getting 40% burns should be particularly concerning. It was not Maude's fault that accident happened - it was the militant self-interest that led down this path. The fuel haulage business is already hevaily regulated - health and safety 'claims' are about increasing holidays and reducing working time. Nothing to do with unsafe practices. Increased 'training' times aren't about health and safey, they're about increasing barriers to entry into the business so that competition within the labour market is restricted. Exxon Mobil is an irrelevant issue. Exxon Mobil doesn't employ these people - they're truckers working for haulage companies. To say that Exxon Mobile are rich so third party contractors should be paid more is foolish - do you intend to pay your decorator a share of your house price when you sell it? No - of course not. They're contractors carrying out a job at market rates. Exxon's profits, and your house, are owned by the shareholders not the contractors. The issue of the pension companies changing hands is also irrelevant. These are normal financial transactions that take place all the time, not a justification for strike - do you even know who manages your company pension scheme? You'd be in a minority if you did. So if all of these complaints are red herrings - what's the beef? Len's on record: "What is the role of government in this? Absurdly, the supply of this essential national commodity is controlled entirely by the free market." He believes that fuel delivery should be nationalised. He's an olde skool militant socialist. "Unite has written to the minister asking for a full breakdown of the emergency supply centres so that we can secure these." WTF??? A non elected bunch of militant lefties are going to 'secure' emergency supply centres? This is a protection racket.

Sheesh, what's the world coming to uncleglen, bloody foreigners coming over here claiming our benefits, can't speak the language... You'll be talking about stealing our women next, yeah?

On the other question, strikes are a positive force upon the labour market, but it's impossible to define when they are or aren't being used appropriately. Fuel tanker drivers are NOT getting exploited. They're subject to extensive health and safety legislation that's stuck to like a limpet, and they're well paid for what they do. Final salary pensions are unaffordable full stop. The maths doesn't work. Bleating about the bankers doesn't change that. Envy is not a reason to strike.

The monopolies you mention are subject to overseeing bodies appointed by elected representatives. Price fixing from monopolies is fraud. It rarely goes unchecked and the formation of a cartel is criminal. Neither of these checks and balances will be in play to control a militant union with excessive demands. Unions are there to protect workforces, not be a mechanism for untrammeled greed. Two wrongs don't make a right. Fortunately it seems that we have army drivers. I look forward to seeing this opportunistic land grab from Len getting thoroughly undermined and this union getting broken.

Ha ha - I'm sure people like me aren't so stupid as to fail to realise the apparent foolishness of this exercise. So that makes it much more likely that they knew something you didn't. That's not as satisfying of a vague feeling of superiority, so people choose to ignore it ;-) People like El Pibe Drones often think they know better, only to discover that there's usually more to it than meets the eye, and that the job is a bit more difficult than they imagined. *giggles* Hating the boss and thinking the management are stupid is a pretty tired and usually inappropriate cliche.

The market only works well where no single participant has the power to set prices unilaterally, and there are no barriers to entry or exit. Far from being the market in action, this is an example of the creation of a monopoly and price fixing. As Len explains - the union is NOT currently strong in fuel trucking, this is an attempt to create a strong union that has a dominant market position and the ability to hold the nation to ransom. The drive for yet more 'health and saftey' requirements is an attempt to INCREASE the barriers to entry, and would no doubt aim to ensure that only those workers IN the union would ever be able to work - thus preventing the labour market from functioning. This move is absolutely transparent - this is a nasty little 'see you next tuesday' in action.

Can't imagine it's any more dangerous than Deptford. You do hear a little bit on the forum about incidents, but remember that's 60 people posting about the same incident, not 60 incidents! You'll undoubtedly love it :)

Only teasing pookie :))

Oh come on guys - this is how it works! Football reviews don't have to be written by pathological obsessives. If you want to read that crap you go on the Football thread - a duller piece of repetitive brain vomit you'd be unfortunate to read ;-) I'd be very pleased to read a review populated with anecdote and perspective. I don't think that football is 'owned' by the people whose desperate personality problems are illustrated by their obsession with a bunch of overpaid teenagers. I think 90% of enthusiasts out there are just having a bit of fun. I'm offended that any OCDC freak out there thinks they can take football away from me because I'm not 'a proper fan'. You go for it Tony - have a laugh, tell some stories, make the people real - and you'll get ten times the number of reads compared with the football retards.

"Saying that, I don't think the description of "aggressive barely literate ex football hooligans" is exactly helpful." Oh, okay, I was just having fun;-) I don't think mental Len is going to be overly stressed by my little poke. He'd probably grin as he looked in the mirror. It doesn't detract from my underlying message of WTF?

Callie... Razors Wrote: ------------------------------------------------------- > People that post on the forum that do not live > anywhere near East Dulwich @ Razors, me too! Really? Do you not like people who don't live near you? Are they bad people?

There's been threads about GPs going downhill since before the computer was a twinkle in Babbage's eye. They sit alongside the ones about the country going to the dogs and creme eggs getting smaller. Hardly evidence that performance related remuneration doesn't work. Incdientally, I don't believe it to be a solution in isolation - it needs to be linked to other elements that free clinicians and their administrative support from stifling and dehumanising bureaucratic controls, and give them more control over their own destiny. More importantly, the fact that there are 'risks' is not sufficient reason not to implement the new structure. We take a risk just by getting out of bed in the morning.

Ha ha, I love this reinterpretation of truck drivers as selfless heroes running the gauntlet of death on a daily basis, single handedly holding the very fabric of our society together at inconceivable personal sacrifice. :)) Truck drivers - the new Ubermensch. Could we elevate them to some sort of religious status, maybe worship them once a week in an act of communal gratitude accompanied by much wialing and gnashing of teeth, crippled by our own inadequacies? Oh, that we could all attain such lofty heights.

People who think they have a right to say whatever they want without respect or regard for other people, and then hide behind their anonymity to avoid redress.

You simmer the chicken in stock before BBQing it?

Alien or mutant?

I'd like to be a French afternoon.

Is it a good idea to take the fat out of sausages before you put them on BBQ? Is that what rendering means?

I'm not sure why competition has to mean privatisation, it simply introduces a link between performance and reward. GPs already receive 25% of performance related pay - meaning that they 'compete' for patients within their catchment. The actual compensation structure for GPs is still not fit for purpose, and it's incorrectly audited, but it does demonstrate that competition can exist within public services.

But aren't the hapless procurment managers a consequence of a bumbling government bureaucracy with associated HR and performance challenges? They wouldn't last long in a competitive environment?