Are the Lib Dems broken.

[Loz]

DJKillaQueen Wrote:

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> James. not for the first time have you got your

> figures wrong

Why do you say that, DJKQ? James' links to the Beeb backed his figures.

I googled "Sheffield forgemasters 3000 jobs" - the only figure I could find was that 3000 people signed a petition associated with the loan.

[James Barber]

Hi DJKillaQueen,

I thought your figures outlandish and different ball park to those I recalled.

So I checked the figures then responded and included the links.

As for not knowing southwark's budget - which bit or total or type?

Broadly its ?1.5bn pa. The cuts proposed are probably in the region of ?20M pa. But no one knows for sure how the cuts will affect a specific authority until around the 9 December.

[RichBowles]

I didn't vote for the Lib Dems even though I thought their ideas on constitutional reform were quite good, mainly because of tuition fees. I think it is absurd that we should be funding people of working age and ability through highly expensive degree courses, many of which have no relevance in the workplace.

[EDOldie]

I think one of the things that keep us long term Liberals going is the prospect of electoral reform and this coalition must be the best prospect ever.

The 'elected' dictatorships of Thatcher and Blair have surely shown us how polarised and intrinsically unfair, politics have become in the UK.

[Bicep_Builder]

>Vine Cable brings legislation concerning tuition fees to the house and defends it.

>Suggests he will abstain from the vote.

>My face http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz214/racooon1/madmenreaction.jpg

[Pugwash]

I would rather the Lib Dems be in a coalition with the Torys as they can water down some of the more drastic policies that a Tory government would have introduced.

My eldest daughter is 36 and only paid off her student loan a couple of years ago as despite being a graduate at 22- never earnt enough to repay her student loan.Was forced to take out another loan to get shot of the student loan which was bugging her for over 12 years.

Youngest daughter, graduated 3 years ago with a student loan of ?15,000, only earns ?14,000 a year for 38 hour week.

Eldest daughter did not have to pay tuition fees, and we paid youngest daughter's tuition fees for 4 years. I would find it difficult to help out with fees that were ?6 - ?9k. I feel that anyone earning below ?15K should have an interest free repayment on their loans (tuition fees and student loans). That graduates who earn more than say ?25k pa should pay a highter rate of interest, with a lower rate of those earning between ?15 - ?25k. The more you earn - the higher the rate of interest until loan is cleared.

Whilst I do not agree with the increased fees, there needs to be a common sense approach as the country cannot subsidise every thing. I groan when I hear of youngsters going off to uni to study 'media'/ business studies but they have no clear cut idea of a career at the end of the day. Rather than increasing the fees, I would look at the courses on offer and reduce the places available.

In the 60/70s I wanted to undertake a degree but the course I wanted suddenly asked for much higher and more A levels. I found out later that there were too many people graduating from this course and not enough jobs available in this field. This was a way of preventing unemployment from this area of study. Needless to say, I did not go to uni then, but went for a degree and post grad professional qualification when I was 40, I used my redundancy money to back up the grant I got for the period.

Getting back to the subject - most of the reforms will not take affect for another 3/4 years and it is possible that the economy maybe stronger then.

Agree with other writers - Tories could not govern without help, Labour was too unpopular, a further election would have had to be called if a coalition government could not have been formed. I think most grass roots LDs would agree that the future success of the party will depend on the LD not allowing the Tories to get all their own way. Paddy Ashdown in his day considered an alliance with Labour, and was lead to believe that this was possible by Tony Blair.

Hopefully more people will support the move to have PR. And whilst they are about electoral reform - why can't we hold elections over the weekend - save ?thousands by not closing schools, community halls etc and parents having to take days off to care for school age kids.

[Brendan]

Bicep_Builder Wrote:

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> >Vine Cable brings legislation concerning tuition

> fees to the house and defends it.

> >Suggests he will abstain from the vote.

> >My face

Which serves well as an example to illustrate the earlier post by Loz.

[zeban]

Bicep-Builder I very much doubt you look like Don Draper

[Bicep_Builder]

When the lib dems make a hilarious cock up and act as a meat shield for Cameron and co it lights a warm fire in my heart, it really does.

[minder]

All I can say is Nick Clegg better ditch his bicycle and get a Camilla and Charles style limo!

[????]

They're broken. Fix them and they can go back to 70 years of poweless nothingness. Bloody idiots, silly them having to actually govern and make tough decisions and get a shot at Electoral Reform. Bring back Jeremy Thorpe I say.

[Brendan]

?This could kick the Lib Dems into touch once and for all.?

Is what was said to me recently by a junior tory politician I know when displaying his displeasure at not getting the post-election job he was promised if they had won outright.

[Brendan]

Although the same guy has said the same thing to me before about the Lib Dems, Labour Party and the Greens on different issues and I?m beginning to suspect he just thinks shit up as an excuse to use rugby metaphors.

[indiepanda]

Brendan Wrote:

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> It?s funny how all this vitriol about Lib Dem

> ?betrayal? comes almost exclusively from Labour

> supporters.

>

> If you remember they first tried to negotiate a

> power sharing deal with Labour but the Labour

> party refused to compromise on anything. Cynically

> in my opinion, and I?m pretty sure on the advice

> of that Mandleson character, because Labour had no

> interest in winning this election. It was a ?good

> one to loose? as the next few years were going to

> make any party in power deeply unpopular.

I couldn't agree more.

We can argue about how big cuts should be and how quickly we need to reduce the debt, but no one could have seriously suggested we didn't make some cuts, and if I were in Labour (not that they'd have me given my politics) I certainly wouldn't want to be one to have to implement them. Their chances of being elected in 2015 seem much higher being the opposition party now than the one in power.

[James Barber]

more details of the Pupil Premium announced this week. Southwark Schools will receive around ?5M at ?425 per poor pupil to give them and their cohort the extra support they need to counter under priveledged backgrounds.

It wont happen instantly but I think places like Southwark it will quickly make a big difference.

[McCatllar]

Yes (re the actual subject matter).

Is the East Dulwich Forum supposed to be used as a quasi Party Political Broadcast platform? No, especially when contributions are made by political non-entities who can't even follow their own party line on account of their:

a) ignorance

and;

b) laziness at addressing their ignorance.

[James Barber]

Hi McCatllar,

Perhaps I should have explianed my thinking behind my last post.

Lib Dems are clesarly very low in the national opinion polls. This probably relates to the obvious compromises that have been made and the announcements made so far.

My point about the Pupil Premium is that 65% of the Lib dem national manifesto promises are in the coalition agreement. As those promises come to the for and are implimented I'd anticipate a change in Lib Dem fortunes. The Pupil Premium was one of our four main election promises and I think it will make a huge difference. Whether it makes a difference to people likely to vote Lib Dem is another matter.

If you point out the areas you believe I've been lazy it would help enormously. Many thanks in advance.

[Huguenot]

McCatllar, that's just abuse.

[McCatllar]

@Huguenot

I plead justification...it relates to another thread.

[????]

Abuse for someone who disagress with you....you'll go far on here

[McCatllar]

Apologies.

I was very angry when I wrote my previous comment (if you knew why, you'd understand), but I realise it was inappropriate to express this on the Forum.

[James Barber]

Hi McCatllar,

I'm also sorry for inflaming you.

I'd quite like to talk through the policy from the other thread as you clearly know lots about it.

[silverfox]

Bye bye Vince?

I must admit I quite liked him during the credit crisis. But since he's been in power he seems to have lost it.

Good riddens

[SeanMacGabhann]

am I missing something? someone stands up to media monopoly and they are the ones losing it?

Still, Italy gets by

[silverfox]

Well if you were relying on The Telegraph to enlighten you no wonder you missed it. They've missed one of the biggest stories of the year and it was their giggling hacks that uncovered it.

Big questions here Sean. Why is Vince abusing his power? Who else is behind it? why is The Telegraph supressing it's own scoops?