What is wrong with post code shame?

[Alan Dale]

Losttheplot asked on another thread why there is anything wrong with pretending to live in SE22 when you have an SE15 postcode.

In my opinion it depends on whether you like living where you do.

If you do then you shouldn't care what post code it is. If you don't then you should move.

If despite liking your house and neighbourhood you find having an SE5, SE15 or other postcode makes you feel embarrassed at dinner parties then you have self esteem issues that you need to tackle rather than brush under the carpet with lies and deception.

If your problem is the misconception of others that your SE15 post code makes you in some way inferior then it is that misconception you should address. Not your post code.

My point about Camberwell has never been that it's lovely outside McDonalds it has always been that there is a lot more to Camberwell than the chaos at the bus stops. I am sure you know full well that there is a lot more to Peckham than gun crime and the death of Damilola Taylor but renouncing your post code merely compounds the ignorance.

It is up to us to promote the merits of our neighbourhoods rather than migrate them to Dulwich.

[SeanMacGabhann]

I think I agree with most of that Alan but the tool you are using to define where one lives (ie postcodes) is a very crude one

Postcodes were implemented to automate mail sorting - and have since been adopted for other purposes. Which is fine as far as it goes but it doesn't tell the whole story. And it certainly doesn't constitue an area's actual boundary

On the shame thing - there is sometimes a snob thing going on with some people - It's been discussed many times before. But if I lived near the Gowlett (SE5 postcode) I would say I lived in ED, not Peckham. If I lived near Bar Story I would say I lived in Peckham. Neither would bother me. Honestly.

In Hoopers case, it is so borderline it doesn't warrant any further discussion really. I don't think it's a shame thing they call themselves ED - if they tell peopl eto arrive by train they are going to say get off at ED. If they say come by bus they are going to say get the bus to ED and when you pass Camberwell AND Denmark Hill Station and descend DKH into ED, get off there...

[Maurice]

I agree. I'm a very proud resident of The Grove.

[Alan Dale]

I accept that it is crude but is an objective measure. In the absence of a better measure it will suffice.

If you want to get to Hoopers (and you should definitely give it a try!) then I suggest you direct your cabby to the top of Camberwell Grove.

As for saying the Gowlett is not in Peckham then I think you are just flat wrong. How can we settle the dispute? Let's go for an objective measure. Post code perhaps...

[Alan Dale]

Maurice Wrote:

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> I agree. I'm a very proud resident of The Grove.

No more silly talk about moving to SE11 then Mo please.

[SeanMacGabhann]

It's that reliance on postcodes that causes so much anger re:

Schools

Operations

Council Tax etc

People living on the same road are told that some are in Lambeth and some are in Wandsworth (for example)

I understand that lines have to be drawn somewhere for administration purposes (until we evolve and stop caring about such things) but I would expect everyone on that road to say they all lived in the same place

[Maurice]

I'd like to move the whole of The Grove there. Sorry. Camberwell is a dump Alan. I do applaud your one man campaign to talk it into being 'hip' but it's a dump. I cannot fault anyone living in Camberwell for clarifying where they live when asked.

'It's Camberwell/SE5 but the bit close to East Dulwich'.

[Alan Dale]

I think you are out of touch Maurice.

[SeanMacGabhann]

Far be it from me to agre with Alan (again!!) but whilst Camberwell has it's faults, calling it a dump is crass over-generalisation. But then again look who posted it...

For a start Camberwell is just too big an area to be so over simplified - I would happily move to Camberwell if I was casting my net around for somewhere new to live. I certainly wouldn't rule it out. Would make the walk to work a lot quicker as well..

[Keef]

SeanMacGabhann Wrote:

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> But if I lived near the Gowlett (SE5 postcode) I would say I lived in ED, not Peckham. If I lived near Bar Story I would

> say I lived in Peckham. Neither would bother me. Honestly.

>

> In Hoopers case, it is so borderline it doesn't warrant any further discussion really.

Sorry, but both The Gowlett and Hoopers are clearly in Peckham!

Next we'll have Penge residents saying they live in Higher Crystal Palace...

I've-met-jimmy lives just round the corner from Hoopers, and he would never in a million years say that he was from East Dulwich! He is from Peckham, was bought up in Peckham and is proud of that, as well he should be.

Do people call Bellenden East Dulwich these days?

[*Bob*]

Everyone in London identifies an area with it's station (underground or overground) - you have to live somewhere to appreciate the ins and outs of a particular street.

The location of the train station is one of the cruel ironies of ED.

Consider my own terrible dilemma. Despite having 'the right postcode' and not living in 'the shit bit' (Alan - you never did get around to specifying exactly where the shit bit is - perhaps now is the time?), it is usually less bother and (sometimes) quicker to ask visiting guests to head for (*shudder*) Peckham Rye and hop on a bus than it is to go to the unfortunately placed ED station.

I'm mildly embarrassed just telling someone I live in East Dulwich but directing them from Peckham Rye station. Because even if it's true, I sound like an arsehole.

[Maurice]

Perhaps I'm out of touch - or you are living in a dream world. Who knows?

I do believe your views are skewed. Camberwell's tale is one of peaks and troughs. The bits that have improved in the last two years were actually recovering from a better offering say 4 or 5 years ago. For those somewhat new to the area, it misleads them to think it is steady improvement.

Peckham is a story of its own. Millions and millions and millions. God knows it should be better. But 'better' is relative.

[Alan Dale]

*Bob* Wrote:

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> Alan - you never did get around to

> specifying exactly where the shit bit is - perhaps

> now is the time

I have to be honest- I've given up looking for it.

[Alan Dale]

Maurice Wrote:

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> Perhaps I'm out of touch - or you are living in a

> dream world. Who knows?

I think we both do. Whilst I wouldn't expect you to enjoy the same things that I enjoy about Camberwell I think you have to respect that my love of all things SE5 is in no way delusional.

[Maurice]

Fair enough.

My mind isn't what it once was - I'm struggling to remember why Sean hates me so. I'm sure it was something I said.

Do forgive me dear one.

[KalamityKel]

And to add to the grrrr I would like to point out I live in EAST Dulwich not Dulwich :p

[Alan Dale]

Go on Sean let him off. Think of Mike and the Mechanics..

[*Bob*]

The worst offenders are those who include 'East Dulwich' in their address.

Like it helps the Royal Mail or something.

[Peckhamgatecrasher]

Dear PSTWS

I live near the Gowlett and it is definitely in Peckham. The border is E Dulwich Road. [please make up with Big Mo - it is nearly Christmas]

Dear Bob

Don't you think Peckham Rye BR Station is misnamed and confusing. It's nowhere near the Rye, half of which is SE22.

I do know many people who live in Peckham and cringe when they say they live in East Dulwich [be loud and proud Eric]. But, at the end of the day, (or for SE22 residents: when the gloaming wraps Lordship Lane in her cloak), it doesn't really matter.

Peace, love and goodwill to all.

[Keef]

Dulwich East, or West Peckham surely?

[SeanMacGabhann]

Remember this all used to be Surrey not that long ago - boundaries change all the time so I'm just less interested in boundaries than a lot of people (umm... that makes me sound like an estate agent - I'm not. Promise)

I like Alan's defence of Camberwell (ooops - pat on the back there - sorry Al) - but then again he is delusional if he thinks that's how to spell it (ah back on track)

Maurice - I don't hate anyone* - I'm just waiting for the more interesting Maurice to surface, not the one who likes to stir things JUST FOR THE SAKE OF IT. More so than even Alan in his prime.

* Although I do still hum "Tramp The Dirt Down" from time to time when I think of THAT woman

[Alan Dale]

I'm still in my prime.

Dogs mean nothing to me.

[SeanMacGabhann]

When I say "if I lived near the Gowlett I would say I lived in ED" - it's not because of ignorance. I know it's "in" Peckham. It's not because of snobbery - I'd equally happily live in Peckham and be pround to say so. It's just.. well I know I'm an outsider and everything, but...Goose Green is RIGHT THERE.. I'm probably heading to Inside 72 after the Gowlett. Or Hisar. Or Chener Books. Or William Roase. My "loop" is effectively ED

All that said I would probably use Rye station and the Peckham library so....

[Maurice]

Indeed we were Surrey and back then, everyone wanted to say they lived in 'Camberwell' (or close enough).

Oh how the mighty have fallen.

[KalamityKel]

believe it or not putting the town you live in in your address DOES help the post how many times have ppl taken your postcode down incorrectly and yet the post/parcel still arrives? :p