Screaming kids

[Nero]

My neighbours have twin boys who seem to have screamed since they were born about three years ago. It's not crying or sobbing, but real screaming. Is this normal? I see them out in their pram and they look placid, but in the house they bawl and bawl and bawl, night and day. I have no idea whether this is to be expected, not being a parent, but it does bother me a bit. Nero

[*Bob*]

Call the social?

Ok.. maybe not just yet. When you say 'screaming', do you mean actual shrill screaming, or just general shouting and hullabaloo?

[LizzygotDizzy]

I would just mention it to Social Services and that it concerns you as it doesn't appear to be the usual play fight, squealing or crying, or just been repremanded punished crying or sobbing. At least that way if something untoward is going on you won't have to feel you sat back all this time and did nothing, on the other hand, if the poor woman does just have kids who just won't stop screaming, (my niece is the same, you would think she was being murdered when she is in fact having seriously bad tantrums and can often be heard from inside my car when I drive by the house!) if all is innocent the Social Services just turn up and ask if all is ok, they won't say its you and will say it was annonymous and once their fears have been alayed they will generally leave the poor woman alone to sort out her unruly child, (or tell her to buy earplugs!) My sister in law didn't get offended, though slightly embarrassed when one of her neighbours called in Social Services for her daughter, and the woman just sat there for five minutes and said to her, you poor thing, you have my complete sympathy, as niece in question, for just no apparent reason screamed at the top of her voice, do something though just in case, you never know.

[Nero]

I have no worries about the parenting at all. It is like a peeved, vexed, defiant bawling. Anyone remember the term 'throw a wobbler' from the 70s and 80s. It's a bit like that, or maybe it is fear-based. It is bursts of screaming, a bit like Violet Elizabeth. Bloody annoying for me, so it probably is more so for the parents! Nero

[LizzygotDizzy]

Sorry Nero, have just properly read and re-worded my post, wasn't aiming the ear-plug thing at you lol! Though must be a pain in the butt though, whenever I feel broody I just go down to my sister-in-laws house and it puts me off completely, best birth control method I've ever used! lol

[mightyroar]

Whether or not you call the social services I think it would be a lot better if you spoke to the parents first. If you still feel concerned, then call them.

[*Bob*]

So this issue basically is that it's a pain in the arse for you, as a neighbour?

[Nero]

Agree, mighty. I was more or less fishing about whether this was a typical sort of behaviour for kids, and was not in any way casting aspersions on the children's parents. I was more curious about child development than anything else! Nero

[*Bob*]

I was only joking about The Social. I'm assuming you do still want to remain on speaking terms with your neighbours?

Well, we haven't got to 3 yet, but we sure do have a noisy baby. A 'night-owl talker', which means he often wakes-up during the night and just bats around happily in his cot, burbling, shouting and making merry - which must be nice for the folks on the other side of the wall.

I'm guessing that at some point in the not-too-distant future we'll be explaining that it's not ok to just be as noisy as you want whenever you want. But he's too young to understand at the moment.

Is 3 too old to be doing the same?

[mightyroar]

Three is a difficult age. You can get a lot of screaming tantrums, which are sometimes best ignored. Once they realise the tantrums dont work they stop (eventually). My 2 and a half year old will lie on the floor screaming 'its not fair' because she was given a blue spoon not a pink one at breakfast.

Also the worst behaviour always seems to be at home. for other people she is mostly angelic. But it's at home that the boundaries exist so that's where the fights are. I would imagine 3 year old twins spend a lot of time considering the world to be unfair and expressing this to their parents!

[*Bob*]

mightyroar Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

I would imagine 3 year old

> twins spend a lot of time considering the world to

> be unfair and expressing this to their parents!

Just wait 'till they grow up and find-out that the world really is unfair.

[LizzygotDizzy]

I would be very careful however, how you approach the parents, if you are on quite good talking terms with them, you could approach by saying, my God you poor people, how do you cope! I would be climbing the walls by now! My aunty had kids who ......blah blah blah, that way it kind of opens up a channel for them to vent what a nightmare their toddlers are while at the same time letting them know you hear it all, all night long! but in a nice way. But still, it isn't that common to have young children screaming in high pitched wails or at the top of their voices ALL the time, my niece is an exception and I would be concerned if I lived next door to someone whoes child never stopped screaming, and would just need to make sure all was ok. The bigger fear is what if something bad was happening to them, you never know, and I am sure there are many a repentant neighbour who wish they had in fact listened to their instincts and called someone in the cases of children who have been abused, harmed and killed in their homes, and who very obviously must have heared crying or screaming. Its really is a difficult call.

[Nero]

THey don't scream all the time, just often. See my above post as per aspersions. They even scream when the grandparents and or nanny or just one of the parents is in. Nero

[SteveT]

They cannot be screaming there all the time, because they will be doing it at the supermarket when we are shopping!

Gone are the days when children were seen and not heard, sadly.

My theory is 'difficult parents beget difficult children' in your neighbours case 'noisy kids have deaf parents'

My sympathy nero.

[Nero]

They're silent now. And when I see them, they are always sweet as pie and totally charming. Maybe it's the decor? Nero

[SteveT]

Its the loud wallpaper!

[Asset]

Jeez, don't joke about calling in the social services.

It can be distressing listening to children crying, especially if you don't know the reason.

Maybe it would be worth keeping a diary for a week. Are you out all day at work? If you are, you can't say they scream all the time as you are not there all the time. If after a week of diary keeping you feel there is real cause for concern, then approach the parents first.

My friend had social services called on her when she was doing 'controlled crying' to get her young child to sleep at night and it is not a pleasant experience.

[LizzygotDizzy]

Why what did they do? my sister-in-law had Social Services attend her home after someone reported the noises coming from her home, but once the lady had actually visited and witnessed for herself the actual behaviour of her extremely overactive and loud 2 year old and checked everthing was ok, she left and conveyed her deepest sympathies for her. She also gave her some numbers if things ever really got out of hand and she needed support and if my niece's behaviour didn't improve. I think too many children slip under the Social Services care nets when it comes to their safety and well being, and I would must rather a few innocent families get unnecessarily investigated than one more child suffer or die at the hands of abusers overlooked due to the incompetence of Social Services.

[mightyroar]

I agree with you Asset. You must approach them first. If you still feel like you have to call social services then go ahead.

If you are trying to foster any sense of community at all then better to be in the position of someone who is concerned and at least has the decency to speak face to face to their neightbour.

If you get the social services coming around due to an anonymous call you are going to spend your whole time paranoid and stressed, on top of your crying children and crippling mortgage you now have to worry that all your neighbours have decided you are somehow abusive.

[Asset]

Exactly mightyroar.

How about all the stories where Social workers get it wrong the other way round and end up taking children away from families where they are not in any danger. There was an article I read just recently about that very thing happening. By the time Social services admitted the mistakes the children had been adopted and it was too late to get them back.

[lozzyloz]

I read somewhere that 2 children per week under the age of 15 die in the UK as a result of abuse. That's over 100 a year. Neighbours can help but I think those instances where they obviously get it wrong or over react are fairly rare. It seems more likely that people are too scared to say anything and that is compounded with the ineptitude of Social Services and other depts that don't talk to each other.

[dulwichmum]

I spent last weekend in Disneyland Paris (without the children - it was a press type trip and not my idea to go without them) and I never saw a single child having a tantrum. The restaurants were teeming with children and they were embraced and celebrated. It really was eye opening. I think that our society is far too intollerant (did I spell that properly?) of children. In Europe apparently the children are welcome everywhere. I think that the idea of children being seen and not heard is actually rather tragic. What can oppression do to a young child's developing sense of self esteem?

My children scream the house down and I feel at times as though I am losing my mind. I console myself by believing that it is just part of their normal growth and development. Before I had children I was full of advice for others, but every child is different, there is no "one size fits all" solution. Some kids just love the sound of their own voices... like their parents!

[lozzyloz]

I used to be quite anti Disney. When I hesitantly took my son to Disneyworld in the US my cynicism melted away within seconds. His face was a picture and the fact that he had the most memorable time meant everything to me. Thoroughly recommend it.

My second son is the loudest thing in SE22. The neighbours often remark on how they can hear him. They haven't called the Social yet but I hope they can cope when No 3 also gets in fine voice.

[Domitianus]

Perhaps the 'intolerance' that makes the difference here is for the type of tantrums and ill-mannered displays that kids get away with in the UK? Just a thought.

[mightyroar]

I dont understand that last post.

I'm fairly sure its another dig at children who dare to make noise and run around and other outrageous things. Is it?