LTN: Our Healthy Streets - Dulwich: Phase 3

[Rockets]

Something isn't adding up on these numbers when you look at the detail. So Lordship Lane has seen a supposed 22% decrease in traffic yet bus journey times along Lordship Lane are now longer than they were. The devil is in the detail and all that...

[legalalien]

One of the strange things about the debate locally is that (out of my personal contacts) some of the strongest advocates of LTNs are ?born again? active travellers- ie those who used to drive LOADS of short journeys and child- ferrying to any from school and activities and who have switched some of their journeys) whereas those against are those who have been walking and cycling these journeys the whole time. Perhaps the former see more potential for change than the latter / the latter see the downsides but aren?t really appreciating any benefit personally?

[Lordshiplads]

Keen to know who this councillor was. Haven't seen anyone round here because I thought they knew everyone would be having a go at them, but if they're saying now they're going, well different story!!

[Abe_froeman]

One of these I guess LL.

[legalalien]

Re councillor campaigning, here?s a couple of pics from Twitter.

Amusingly they seem to have taken along a councillor from Colchester who is keen on cycling, and who is copping flak after failing to explain an under-consultation bus gate to his constituents.

https://www.gazette-news.co.uk/news/19423678.concerns-proposed-new-bus-gate-colchester-ban-cars/

Here to compare notes on communication strategies, or pondering a move to Dulwich?

[Rockets]

I think it's pretty clear the councillors must be pretty concerned that the review is going against them. It's a bit naughty to extend the consultation and then mobilise a door-to-door campaign trying to get people to respond....not sure that is entirely playing by the rules. Looks like a desperate attempt to get people to try and turn things their way.

One wonders what they have seen from the analysis of the review thus far...it must be going against them. This lot are so dodgy.

[Abe_froeman]

They've been leafleting too...

It used to be that politicians asked the electorate what they could do to make things better rather than doing things to make things worse and then telling the public to vote for it in a consultation.

They treat us like mugs

[Rockets]

They are out again today...there is a group congregating outside Saucy with Charlie now. It's almost as if they are concerned about something.....

[Lynne]

No sign of them now (14.56). Pity. I would have liked them to hear my views

[LTN BooHoo]

Rockets Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> They are out again today...there is a group

> congregating outside Saucy with Charlie now. It's

> almost as if they are concerned about

> something.....

Global warming? Our climate emergency? Inactivity? Obesity? Pollution? Our children?s future? The fact that we have built our lives around the motor vehicle and if we have any decency we will acknowledge that we must seek alternatives?

I know, none of the above. Let?s just carry on as we were. Have a nice day.

[ab29]

How about banning everyone living within LTNs from owning a car for a start?

You get all the peace and quiet and in return you stop driving so people like me, living on LL, EDG, Croxted etc don't have to choke on the fumes from all the extra traffic pouring down our roads at the moment.

LTN BooHoo Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Rockets Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > They are out again today...there is a group

> > congregating outside Saucy with Charlie now.

> It's

> > almost as if they are concerned about

> > something.....

>

> Global warming? Our climate emergency? Inactivity?

> Obesity? Pollution? Our children?s future? The

> fact that we have built our lives around the motor

> vehicle and if we have any decency we will

> acknowledge that we must seek alternatives?

>

> I know, none of the above. Let?s just carry on as

> we were. Have a nice day.

[fottos]

Southwark's extension to the deadline is a futile attempt to change reality. See image for their interim results on the DV junction

[legalalien]

Is that a council document or something else (residents survey)?

fottos Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Southwark's extension to the deadline is a futile

> attempt to change reality. See image for their

> interim results on the DV junction

[Rockets]

LTN BooHoo Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Rockets Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > They are out again today...there is a group

> > congregating outside Saucy with Charlie now.

> It's

> > almost as if they are concerned about

> > something.....

>

> Global warming? Our climate emergency? Inactivity?

> Obesity? Pollution? Our children?s future? The

> fact that we have built our lives around the motor

> vehicle and if we have any decency we will

> acknowledge that we must seek alternatives?

>

> I know, none of the above. Let?s just carry on as

> we were. Have a nice day.

I am pretty sure that is not their concern....these are politicians trying to manipulate the result of the review. It's so brazen it just shows how out of control they are.

[Metallic]

I am astounded the deadline was extended. This can only mean the council's data collection hasn't added up to what they hoped. At the same time, they give data for Dovercourt Road yet not Lordship Lane north? Their picking and choosing is crazy. And what about the closed off roads of East Dulwich - Elsie Road and Derwent Grove? If they are going to cherry pick then they will have to supply all the data to prove they are not hiding something. Of course anyone who tries to rubbish this data presentation who is on Simmons' blacklist, won't get called so all we will hear are the Clean Air Dulwich and pro LTN groups sallying forth, whilst many of us are not at all represented in the meeting.

[hpsaucey]

Interesting article from CREDS:

https://www.creds.ac.uk/cycling-is-ten-times-more-important-than-electric-cars-for-reaching-net-zero-cities/

HP

[legalalien]

I think it made sense to extend given they hadn?t published the data (in fact I might have suggested it on another thread). Everyone was criticising the failure to provide the data before the consultation window closed so a brief extension seems sensible to me. The selection and presentation of the data is a different issue. Critics were always expecting the presentation of the data to be ?spun? (in which case might have been better not to call for data to be provided and the additional meeting held before the deadline). It?s only a week at the end of the day.

I would say that I?m sure the councillors must know the broad substance of the data by now, but at this point I?m not entirely sure what local councillors, compared to say the cabinet member, or the officers, know at any given point in time. I would be interested to hear from local councillors about precisely what data they are being given by officers and when. Do they get to see the raw data or are they just given the same information as is made public?

[Otto2]

hpsaucey Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Interesting article from CREDS:

> https://www.creds.ac.uk/cycling-is-ten-times-more-

> important-than-electric-cars-for-reaching-net-zero

> -cities/

>

> HP

Good article - thank you. Here's a paragraph that is notable:

*There are links in the article that discuss walking as well.

"We also estimate that urban residents who switched from driving to cycling for just one trip per day reduced their carbon footprint by about half a tonne of CO₂ over the course of a year, and save the equivalent emissions of a one- way flight from London to New York. If just one in five urban residents permanently changed their travel behaviour in this way over the next few years, we estimate it would cut emissions from all car travel in Europe by about 8%."

https://www.creds.ac.uk/cycling-is-ten-times-more-important-than-electric-cars-for-reaching-net-zero-cities/#

[heartblock]

12% decrease in traffic due to Covid across London, 14% in Dulwich LTNs with a 25-35% in crease in traffic on ED Grove and Croxted and an increase in journey times for public transport. Doesn?t seem to be a successful initiative to reduce pollution or traffic.

[Bicknell]

heartblock Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> 12% decrease in traffic due to Covid across

> London, 14% in Dulwich LTNs with a 25-35% in

> crease in traffic on ED Grove and Croxted and an

> increase in journey times for public transport.

> Doesn?t seem to be a successful initiative to

> reduce pollution or traffic.

and how are elderly and sick affected? noone knws because council hasnt asked them yet

[Metallic]

Bicknell Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> heartblock Wrote:

> --------------------------------------------------

> -----

> > 12% decrease in traffic due to Covid across

> > London, 14% in Dulwich LTNs with a 25-35% in

> > crease in traffic on ED Grove and Croxted and

> an

> > increase in journey times for public transport.

> > Doesn?t seem to be a successful initiative to

> > reduce pollution or traffic.

>

>

> and how are elderly and sick affected? noone knws

> because council hasnt asked them yet

Surely it must have dawned on you? Elderly and sick don't count.

[Penguin68]

Surely it must have dawned on you? Elderly and sick don't count.

With luck they'll be dead before the next election - so nothing to worry about there... And sick and asthmatic children don't have a vote - win: win if you ask me.

[Earl Aelfheah]

Attached is the actual summary for those who want to see it.

[hpsaucey]

rahrahrah Wrote:

-------------------------------------------------------

> Attached is the actual summary for those who want

> to see it.

Thanks for posting.

HP

[hpsaucey]

Tangential but interesting map enabling you to see very local breakdowns of carbon (place) footprint including car; van; public transport (also flights; heating; services etc etc)

https://www.carbon.place/

HP